These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Ships & Modules

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
Previous page123Next page
 

Opinion on the Legion
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
bubble trout
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2014-02-23 13:54:45 UTC
Adeptis wrote:
Aivo Dresden wrote:
Yea you're right, that extra 130k EHP doesn't matter much at all ...



Extra tank means nothing if you can't escape or kill the target before they blow through it. I already admitted the tank can be very useful but I don't consider it enough to justify the cost and chance of skill point loss



Then you are not someone who should be looking at a legion.


The point of a legion is the MASSIVE ehp in addition to doing the **** the other T2 ships do about as well or maybe even a little better.

If you don't have the isk, or hate retraining skills don't fly a legion.
God's Apples
Wilderness
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
#22 - 2014-02-23 17:02:50 UTC
Legion is a top level anti-support ship for small gang combat whether flown shield or armor.

[Legion, Super Nomen]
Medium Ancillary Armor Repairer, Nanite Repair Paste
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Shadow Serpentis Armor Thermic Hardener
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink
Imperial Navy Heat Sink

Gistum C-Type 10MN Microwarpdrive
Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 800
Republic Fleet Warp Disruptor
Federation Navy Stasis Webifier

Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M

Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I
Medium Energy Locus Coordinator II
Medium Energy Locus Coordinator II

Legion Defensive - Nanobot Injector
Legion Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer
Legion Engineering - Power Core Multiplier
Legion Offensive - Liquid Crystal Magnifiers
Legion Propulsion - Chassis Optimization

Out of the box with just zor's in:

521/599 dps @ 48 + 5 w/ scorch
654/752 dps @ 16 + 5 w/ IN multi
1936/2756 m/s speed
400/547 burst tank
25k ehp

With 4 link loki/legion/proteus and FN mindlink:

499/686 burst tank
2410/3466 m/s speed
33k ehp

"Hydra Reloaded are just jealous / butthurt on me / us because we can get tons of PVP action in empire while they aren't good enough to get that." - NightmareX
LUMINOUS SPIRIT
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#23 - 2014-02-23 19:37:26 UTC
Legion is a very specialized ship that does need to be looked at by CCP.

Having said that, it does fulfill a role - in wormholes, it acts as a neut boat. Curse/pilgrim just doesnt have the tank to brawl alongside a t3 gang.

For everything else, you use a proteus Im afraid.
Flaming Forum Spammer
Doomheim
#24 - 2014-02-24 00:35:40 UTC


Legion Electronics - Energy Parasitic: 20% vamp/neut amount and range per level; 10% Tracking Disruptor Effectiveness
Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories
#25 - 2014-02-24 08:40:05 UTC
100mn hamlegion, 2 rigors, 3 BCUs - still 95k ehp, but something like 740dps of choice. Unlike a proteus, doesn't need cap to fire.
Valleria Darkmoon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#26 - 2014-02-24 08:47:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Valleria Darkmoon
While it's true that many other Amarrian ships will equal or outperform the Legion in certain roles there are none of them that even come close to outscaling it in a full fleet with links/logi etc. The augmented plating sub contributes so much EHP to a ship with a resist profile like the Legion fully fleeted and all without hindering its movements at all.

It is for exactly this reason that I typically leave my Legion docked unless it has that kind of support and use the Zealot/Curse for small roams. It a large fleet, linked and slaved a Legion with over 300k EHP is entirely possible without even a super expensive fit (though the high grade slave set is pretty steep). In a heavy damage scenario that Legion may well get repped in time if it gets primaried. An armor fit Curse will die in many situations where that Legion would live.

Reality has an almost infinite capacity to resist oversimplification.
Gh0stBust3rs
Templars HIghsec
Stellar Fusion
#27 - 2014-02-24 08:59:30 UTC
Just to also toss out some food for thought.

Nuet Legions with a cov ops cloak can take a cov ops bridge. Which a Curse can not do and a pilgrim is weaker.

A solo nuet legion can cap out a carrier in about 8 minutes with the carrier running nothing. Add in the carrier running reps not at 100% cap already etc and one nuet legion can mean a dead carrier in a matter of a minute.

Ham legions are almost as good as hamgus. The only real downside is range.

Pulse Legions used to shread incursions and with the same optimal as a zealot with more mids. Also You dont just T2 fit any ahac variant imp navy ENAMs arent expensive and add like 6k ehp.
Winthorp
#28 - 2014-02-24 11:35:34 UTC
Coming from a Wh perspective only where we mostly fly T3's for the bang for your buck ship for your WH mass limitations i will use different T3's for different purposes.

I will prefer a Proteus for very small gang stuff but if we are going into a mid-large size fleet fight if we need DPS i will bring a legion every single time. A legion allows me to have "Applied DPS" on targets at all times due to the nature of WH fights that usually have to involve multiple primary switching to break stalemated fleets.

A legion is also great in a Nuet legion role when bringing a Bhaal becomes pointless in certain situations.

I do however prefer being that guy in the fleet everyone hates.... Jamgu.
Igor Nappi
Doomheim
#29 - 2014-02-24 21:51:42 UTC
The scanning subsystem grants Legion the best space mushroom / ISK value.

Furthermore, I think that links must be removed from the game.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#30 - 2014-02-24 22:06:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Kaarous Aldurald
Recently, I have begun flying my Legion quite a bit more than before (I moved into a wormhole). Before that, it was a perfectly serviceable boat for wardecs, with 2 bonused neuts and 6 Heavy Assault launchers.

One of it's major drawbacks is the general total unviability of it's cov ops subsystem for any kind of DPS use. This means that unless you want them to see you coming, the Legion is a neut boat, and nothing else. Which means that it's not for any kind of solo work, either.

Which basically shoves the Legion aside in favor of the Proteus.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
gnshadowninja
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#31 - 2014-02-24 22:12:13 UTC
The OP is comparing a combat recon to a cloaky T3 which is far from comparable.

You need to decide what you want this legion for...
A cloaky T3 Legion with neuts needs to be compared with a pilgrim not a curse.


Is it for support? What type of gang? Are you going to be tackle? Do you need DPS?

I'm struggling to answer your original question because I haven't got a base to work around...
For example : WH Gang I would run neut legion, Armor T3 Gang i'd run a ham legion, tackle i'd run a insta lock legion etc..
God's Apples
Wilderness
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
#32 - 2014-02-24 22:22:20 UTC
Gh0stBust3rs wrote:

A solo nuet legion can cap out a carrier in about 8 minutes with the carrier running nothing. Add in the carrier running reps not at 100% cap already etc and one nuet legion can mean a dead carrier in a matter of a minute.


Maybe if you're killing shitfit ratting carriers, but then you don't really need a neuting legion then do you? A triage archon with proper triage implants can't be neuted out by a full neut bhaal with talismans in.

With that said, neuting legion is still sorta viable on more small scale engagements. However, without the range bonus I feel like the ashimmu is a bit sexier ♥.

"Hydra Reloaded are just jealous / butthurt on me / us because we can get tons of PVP action in empire while they aren't good enough to get that." - NightmareX
Bertrand Butler
Cras es Noster
#33 - 2014-02-24 23:28:13 UTC
The ashimmu neuts harder, and that 90% web is sexy as hell. Sadly though you will need to have logi for it to do its job, its got sth like one third of the tank the Legion gets at the same pricepoint...T_T

Buff the pirate line CCP!
Jon Joringer
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#34 - 2014-02-25 00:34:10 UTC
Can't fly the Legion, but from what I hear and have read about it on the forums, it seems like the most balanced T3. Other T2 ships will perform their specific roles better than the Legion when fit for that role. The trade-off is in tank (and the ability to reconfigure and perform ALL the roles in one ship, etc).
Gh0stBust3rs
Templars HIghsec
Stellar Fusion
#35 - 2014-02-25 01:17:07 UTC
God's Apples wrote:
Gh0stBust3rs wrote:

A solo nuet legion can cap out a carrier in about 8 minutes with the carrier running nothing. Add in the carrier running reps not at 100% cap already etc and one nuet legion can mean a dead carrier in a matter of a minute.


Maybe if you're killing shitfit ratting carriers, but then you don't really need a neuting legion then do you? A triage archon with proper triage implants can't be neuted out by a full neut bhaal with talismans in.

With that said, neuting legion is still sorta viable on more small scale engagements. However, without the range bonus I feel like the ashimmu is a bit sexier ♥.



If someone tosses a triage cap on the field you dont bother with trying to nuet it. Drop 2-3 dreads on it and call it a day.
bubble trout
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#36 - 2014-02-25 08:59:00 UTC
Or you know, not everyone can just bring 2-3 dreads to every fight.
Mr Floydy
Questionable Ethics.
Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
#37 - 2014-02-25 13:41:46 UTC
Yeh I'd lean toward the Legion being overall being one of the best balanced T3s. It's only really the ehp with the 10% hp subsystem that I've ever seen anyone suggest is overpowered.
Tul Breetai
Impromptu Asset Requisition
#38 - 2014-02-25 14:14:59 UTC
Adeptis wrote:
From what I can see for any sort of pvp it fails compared to other ships.

The main problem with the legion is simple, other ships do it better for cheaper and with no loss of skill points.

The top fits I know off for a legion are:

HAM legion - Just take a Sac, its cheaper
Pulse legion - Again Zealot is cheaper
Neut legion - Curse does it better at longer range
Cloaky/Scanner - New Sisters of eve ships/every covert ops are better
Salvage legion....about as good as it gets

I may have missed some great fit that really turns it around , please point it out if I have.


The legion has a larger tank and in some case more dps than the above ships but at a massive cost of isk and the loss of skill points when it dies and it will die, everyone will target it.


With so many re balanced ships over the past few years they legion has really fallen behind.


Btw I'm not interested in pve fits for the legion, I don't use it for pve, any ship can be good for pve with little to no risk.

What other ship can you get a Sac, Zealot, Curse/Pilgrim, Covops, Damnation, Noctis, and hell even cloaky Guardian, all in one hull? Granted the bonuses aren't quite the same, and the subs need to be rebalanced (and will be), you're paying out the ass for a nearly-full line of T2 amarr ships in one hull.

Grab a tissue and fap with me baby!

There's nothing worse than an EVE player, generally considered to be top of the food chain in the MMO world, that cannot smacktalk with wit and coherency.
Noxisia Arkana
Deadspace Knights
#39 - 2014-02-25 16:50:25 UTC
Tul Breetai wrote:

What other ship can you get a Sac, Zealot, Curse/Pilgrim, Covops, Damnation, Noctis, and hell even cloaky Guardian, all in one hull? Granted the bonuses aren't quite the same, and the subs need to be rebalanced (and will be), you're paying out the ass for a nearly-full line of T2 amarr ships in one hull.

Grab a tissue and fap with me baby!


Yeah, I heard versatility is supposed to be the hallmark of T3s. Also, maybe a little too enthusiastic?
Gh0stBust3rs
Templars HIghsec
Stellar Fusion
#40 - 2014-02-26 08:37:22 UTC
bubble trout wrote:
Or you know, not everyone can just bring 2-3 dreads to every fight.




Then maybe you shouldnt engage someone that is willing to field triage support. Or do so with someone who can on bat phone to escalate the fight.
Previous page123Next page