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[Rubicon 1.3] Drone Assist change

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MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#841 - 2014-02-08 04:09:23 UTC
Chorianda wrote:


It seems that changing the limit based on the types of drones being controlled, while certainly more complicated to implement, would preserve this use-case while addressing the problem with massed sentry drones that needs fixing. Is it really that much more complicated to implement?


how difficult would it to add a new attribute to all ships in game?

Every ship would now have a 1250Mb for drone assist.

that would let you keep your light drones but make more then 50 sentries impossible... which from what i understand is the thing they are trying to limit drone assist in regards to sentries.

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
DetKhord Saisio
Seniors Clan
#842 - 2014-02-08 05:43:08 UTC
WK XI wrote:
Maybe we can add a kind of new ships which can do drone assist, all other ship can not assist. Maybe new ships has all kind of sizes.
As I suggested 4 pages up this thread on page 39, 1250 m3 drone assist bandwidth may be the direction to go for a solution. After thinking about your suggestion of a new ship to do this, I feel you may be taking this in the wrong direction.

Fleet Assistance Modules seem to be a better location for drone assist bandwidth. I believe a good direction to take this is require squad commander in fleet be actively running a command processor I module; then and only then will the fleet assistance module's drone assist bandwidth allow the squad commander to control all the squad member's drones.

New drone variations for each warfare and mining links are needed as well:

Mining Foreman Link - Fleet Drone Assistance
Armored Warfare Links - Fleet Drone Assistance
Information Warfare Links - Fleet Drone Assistance
Siege Warfare Link - Fleet Drone Assistance
Skirmish Warfare Link - Fleet Drone Assistance

The gang link item descriptions would go something like this... [adjusted example from Armored Warfare Link - Rapid Repair I] becomes [Armored Warfare Links - Fleet Drone Assistance]:


"Increases the bandwidth and speed of the fleet's personal and targeted drone assist systems.

Warfare links are dedicated fleet command systems designed for use on battlecruisers and advanced command class ships.

While only one of these units can normally be operated at any given time, certain advanced units allow the use of multiple systems.

Notes: The Fleet bonus only works if you are the assigned fleet booster. This module cannot activate inside a starbase forcefield."

Without an active fleet drone assistance gang link, the drone control returns to the drone owner. Unless a new command is given within 10 seconds, the now un-assisted drones return to control of the owning player's ship drone bay i.e. squad commander's ship is destroyed.
Kiandoshia
Applied Anarchy
The Initiative.
#843 - 2014-02-08 06:15:24 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:

considering an incursion runner has plenty to do without accounting for drones, perhaps you should do one and realise it's not the same as a drone assist fleet where you can go afk once drones are assigned.


That's bs. Incursions are **** easy, just like every other kind of PvE. When I did them, they felt an awful lot like mining after a while with the only difference being that incursions hose a lot more ISK all over everyone involved. After a while, I was even using mutliple characters in them.

On topic though, I'm glad for the change in general. Flying Domis was getting boring and I have only been here for a month =p
Captain StringfellowHawk
Forsaken Reavers
#844 - 2014-02-08 07:45:38 UTC
Desert Ice78 wrote:
Sipphakta en Gravonere wrote:
Desert Ice78 wrote:
Read: Make it so that goons win every time.


We won the war even with the current mechanics.

No. No you didn't. This war is still very much on. Whats going to happen now is the CFC is going to sit and ship spin and blue ball every chance they get until eventually your pet dev's give you exactly what you've been crying for since the start of this year.

Then you'll come out and fight.


I'm sorry when your alliance is relevant again and not giving it's sov up to masters you can talk. Until then, enjoy the new Lighter Why So..
Dave Stark
#845 - 2014-02-08 08:01:51 UTC
Kiandoshia wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:

considering an incursion runner has plenty to do without accounting for drones, perhaps you should do one and realise it's not the same as a drone assist fleet where you can go afk once drones are assigned.


That's bs. Incursions are **** easy, just like every other kind of PvE. When I did them, they felt an awful lot like mining after a while with the only difference being that incursions hose a lot more ISK all over everyone involved. After a while, I was even using mutliple characters in them.

On topic though, I'm glad for the change in general. Flying Domis was getting boring and I have only been here for a month =p


it's not bullshit, and how "difficult" incursion are has NO RELEVANCE to this discussion, or thread. it's a fact that there are more things to do in an incursion than assigning your drones to the drone bunny.

once again, cfc members attacking arguments that haven't been made in order to whine about whatever it is they've been told to whine about this month.

when it comes to this topic it really is telling that the only people whining, and posting irrelevant arguments to facilitate whining have pretty much exclusively been from the cfc.
Dave Stark
#846 - 2014-02-08 08:29:38 UTC
Sala Cameron wrote:
If someone could link me the post explaining the particular problem with Incursions and the hardcap, I would be thankful as I am not interested into reading through of 40 pages of uselessness.


200 > 50.

basically.

there are more drones in an incursion fleet than you will be able to assign to the drone bunny, this goes directly against rise's statement of especially not wanting to negatively impact incursion runners. regardless of magnitude it will have a negative impact.
Gimme more Cynos
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#847 - 2014-02-08 08:41:43 UTC
Imho, a cap in numbers is pretty bad. It should be a bandwith cap.

Say 1250 bandwith at max and you have your 50 sentries, 50 Heavies, and no Problem with lights and mediums.
Oxide Ammar
#848 - 2014-02-08 09:11:10 UTC
Andski wrote:
MeBiatch wrote:
The ponit is incursion runners dont use domi and dont cause lag. Rise said those are the only reasons for the nerf.

So again why should the majority of eve players have to pay for unbalanced 0.0 warfare?




i can turn that around and ask why 0.0 players, who are routinely responsible for the content that matters and attracts new players, should be penalized because CCP doesn't wish to trivially inconvenience the farming subset of the playerbase?

also goddamn your assumption that incursion runners are the "majority" screams entitlement and i am quite sure that more players regularly partake in 0.0 warfare than in incursion running


Underlining for the lolz...dude your alliance is one of the major causes for making new players resenting null sec experience.

Lady Areola Fappington:  Solo PVP isn't dead!  You just need to make sure you have your booster, remote rep, cyno, and emergency Falcon alts logged in and ready before you do any solo PVPing.
Needa3
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#849 - 2014-02-08 09:12:57 UTC
Desert Ice78 wrote:
Nice, the goon whining wins again. Good job there Rise and Fozzie, but could you even TRY to make an effort not to be so obvious?


What he said.


Ccp obviously picking sides and going for the blob.


Think you may want to perform an internal audit to find out how deep your employees are into mittens ********.

As soon als a blob counter appears it gets nerfed. Nice job ccp
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#850 - 2014-02-08 09:17:11 UTC
nullsec can you please go, you're all really terrible
Tragot Gomndor
Three Sword Inc
#851 - 2014-02-08 09:41:30 UTC
CCP Rise wrote:
We feel that drone assist, at a large scale, leads to passive gameplay that most players do not enjoy.


What makes large scale combat unenjoyable is the x hours of 10% tidi. The whole large scale pvp stuff is broken and i can only stand seeing it when its a youtube video with fast forward. Fix the servers.

And yes, nullsec is bad.

NONONONONONO TO CAPS IN HIGHSEC NO
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#852 - 2014-02-08 09:46:36 UTC
Oxide Ammar wrote:
Underlining for the lolz...dude your alliance is one of the major causes for making new players resenting null sec experience.


do you have anything to back up your ridiculous, unsubstantiated claim here?

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#853 - 2014-02-08 09:54:59 UTC
Chorianda wrote:
Sala, Fleets for incursion HQ sites typically consist of 30 or so battleships, 6-10 logistics cruisers, and a t3 cruiser. The battleships assign their drones to the t3, which uses them to kill frigates while the battleships work on the larger ships. Typically, the t3 is controlling about 175 light drones. That's the use-case which CCP Rise says he wants to preserve. Surely you can see how a 50-drone limit would cause a problem here, right? It's not insurmountable, of course, but it IS a problem. Some may think that incursions SHOULD be made less efficient, and this change would certainly do that, but that's not what we're here to discuss, is it?

It seems that changing the limit based on the types of drones being controlled, while certainly more complicated to implement, would preserve this use-case while addressing the problem with massed sentry drones that needs fixing. Is it really that much more complicated to implement?


So you're upset over ~2500 DPS lost from a gang of 30 ships?

my sides

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Dave Stark
#854 - 2014-02-08 10:03:43 UTC
Andski wrote:
So you're upset over ~2500 DPS lost from a gang of 30 ships?

my sides


you can't be any higher than about 5 foot tall since the point sails right over your head almost every time you quote some one.

the dps is irrelevant. read the actual post and you'd see they clearly explained the issue.
Mournful Conciousness
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#855 - 2014-02-08 10:09:29 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Andski wrote:
So you're upset over ~2500 DPS lost from a gang of 30 ships?

my sides


you can't be any higher than about 5 foot tall since the point sails right over your head almost every time you quote some one.

the dps is irrelevant. read the actual post and you'd see they clearly explained the issue.


Having read the text carefully, I still fail to see why incursion runners can't direct their own drones.

Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#856 - 2014-02-08 10:12:38 UTC
Having skip read through I still can't see why anyone would (and should) be able to control more than 10 drones...you want 50 drones on one target? Co-ordinate a fleet of 5 players...

We keep seing comments about changes to promote more player interaction so make drone bunnies actually work as fleets...
Dave Stark
#857 - 2014-02-08 10:13:20 UTC
Mournful Conciousness wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Andski wrote:
So you're upset over ~2500 DPS lost from a gang of 30 ships?

my sides


you can't be any higher than about 5 foot tall since the point sails right over your head almost every time you quote some one.

the dps is irrelevant. read the actual post and you'd see they clearly explained the issue.


Having read the text carefully, I still fail to see why incursion runners can't direct their own drones.


that's because directing your own drones isn't the issue. instead of reading the post, you're looking for something that isn't there.
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#858 - 2014-02-08 10:13:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Omnathious Deninard
This thread makes me think that maybe the best stand point for drones server wise, flavor wise and game play wise, is to remove drones from all non-drone bonused ships.
With a few exceptions such as mining barges and logistic ships.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Mournful Conciousness
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#859 - 2014-02-08 10:20:33 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Mournful Conciousness wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Andski wrote:
So you're upset over ~2500 DPS lost from a gang of 30 ships?

my sides


you can't be any higher than about 5 foot tall since the point sails right over your head almost every time you quote some one.

the dps is irrelevant. read the actual post and you'd see they clearly explained the issue.


Having read the text carefully, I still fail to see why incursion runners can't direct their own drones.


that's because directing your own drones isn't the issue. instead of reading the post, you're looking for something that isn't there.


Please kindly tell me specifically which game breaking problem I am missing?

Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".
Dave Stark
#860 - 2014-02-08 10:26:54 UTC
Mournful Conciousness wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Mournful Conciousness wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Andski wrote:
So you're upset over ~2500 DPS lost from a gang of 30 ships?

my sides


you can't be any higher than about 5 foot tall since the point sails right over your head almost every time you quote some one.

the dps is irrelevant. read the actual post and you'd see they clearly explained the issue.


Having read the text carefully, I still fail to see why incursion runners can't direct their own drones.


that's because directing your own drones isn't the issue. instead of reading the post, you're looking for something that isn't there.


Please kindly tell me specifically which game breaking problem I am missing?


no. because the point has been made many times and if you haven't understood it by now then there's no point me wasting my time.