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Planetary Conquest 2.0, What should happen in Space (EVE side)

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Renier Gaden
Immortal Guides
#1 - 2014-02-04 19:54:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Renier Gaden
Here is a link to the discussion on the DUST 514 Feedback/Requests forum.
Here is a link to the discussion on the EVE Online Features & Ideas Discussion forum.

The short version is that to initiate a Planetary Conquest match in DUST a Warbarge class ship loaded with clones must travel in EVE from where the clones were picked up to the district being attacked. This creates two phases in a Planetary Conquest match.

1) EVE Phase, the fight to defend/destroy the Warbarge.
2) DUST Phase, the fight on the ground to take/defend the district.

There is also a mechanic for DUST corps that don’t have EVE connections.


Edit: Check out post 16 to see what could be in it for EVE pilots.
Angelica Dreamstar
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2014-02-04 22:13:45 UTC
Sounds horrible.


What mechanic is it you mention in the last line? Sounds good that EVE players can't deny DUST players playing the game ... ^^

bingo, his pig not being a goat doesn't make the pig wrong, just him an idiot for shouting at his pig "WHY ARENT YOU A GOAT!" (Source)

-- Ralph King-Griffin, about deranged people playing EVE ONLINE
Angelica Dreamstar
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2014-02-04 22:16:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Angelica Dreamstar
Renier Gaden wrote:
Ayures wrote:
Where's the incentive for EVE players? I'm not seeing one.

For EVE pilots to care there must be a significant benefit EVE side to your Alliance owning Planetary Districts. That would have to be part of Planetary Conquest 2.0. This post was focussed on the mechanics of the conflict, not the incentives behind it. However, those incentives would definitely have to be there, or the whole thing would be pointless.

So how about working out the primary concern first?

There is no point in thinking or talking about details when there's no reason to implement something in the first place!
If you have an idea, you have to start from the beginning and not in the middle. Doing this just makes it sound like you got caught by some detail you think is awesome, but haven't actually spent time on anything else.

bingo, his pig not being a goat doesn't make the pig wrong, just him an idiot for shouting at his pig "WHY ARENT YOU A GOAT!" (Source)

-- Ralph King-Griffin, about deranged people playing EVE ONLINE
Thead Enco
Thunderwaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#4 - 2014-02-04 22:42:23 UTC
Renier Gaden wrote:
Here is a link to the discussion on the DUST 514 Feedback/Requests forum.
Here is a link to the discussion on the EVE Online Features & Ideas Discussion forum.

The short version is that to initiate a Planetary Conquest match in DUST a Warbarge class ship loaded with clones must travel in EVE from where the clones were picked up to the district being attacked. This creates two phases in a Planetary Conquest match.

1) EVE Phase, the fight to defend/destroy the Warbarge.
2) DUST Phase, the fight on the ground to take/defend the district.

There is also a mechanic for DUST corps that don’t have EVE connections.



No one over here gives eh flying **** about that poor excuse of an fps. In other news I hear Star Citizen will be a good game (sarcasim implied)
Jill Chastot
WE FORM BL0B Inc.
Goonswarm Federation
#5 - 2014-02-04 22:46:55 UTC
Sadi do

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=298596&find=unread OATHS wants you. Come to the WH "Safety in eve is the greatest fallacy you will ever encounter. Once you accept this you will truely enjoy this game."
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#6 - 2014-02-04 22:53:56 UTC
Just what someone playing a fps wants: Their play delayed while someone else in another game spends an hour flying a ship about, only to find out it got ganked right at the end and the battle has been called off.

Know a Frozen fan? Check this out

Frozen fanfiction
Vincemt' Night
Wellshire Farms
#7 - 2014-02-04 23:01:58 UTC
EVE Players will only care about Dusties, the moment Dusties are allowed to destroy Planetary Interaction Structures on said planets.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#8 - 2014-02-05 01:36:11 UTC
Renier Gaden wrote:
Here is a link to the discussion on the DUST 514 Feedback/Requests forum.
Here is a link to the discussion on the EVE Online Features & Ideas Discussion forum.

The short version is that to initiate a Planetary Conquest match in DUST a Warbarge class ship loaded with clones must travel in EVE from where the clones were picked up to the district being attacked. This creates two phases in a Planetary Conquest match.

1) EVE Phase, the fight to defend/destroy the Warbarge.
2) DUST Phase, the fight on the ground to take/defend the district.

There is also a mechanic for DUST corps that don’t have EVE connections.




Never work.

Bubbles.


Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Alduin666 Shikkoken
Doomheim
#9 - 2014-02-05 04:04:49 UTC
Forum Conquest 2.0

New soldiers will be taught which forum to put their thread in before they pass boot camp.

Honor is a fools prize. [I]Glory is of no use to the dead.[/I]

Be a man! Post with your main! ~Vas'Avi Community Manager
Anomaly One
Doomheim
#10 - 2014-02-05 05:31:18 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:
Just what someone playing a fps wants: Their play delayed while someone else in another game spends an hour flying a ship about, only to find out it got ganked right at the end and the battle has been called off.


we need this

Never forget. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8sfaN8zT8E http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5l_ZjVyRxx4 Trust me, I'm an Anomaly. DUST 514 FOR PC
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2014-02-05 10:08:25 UTC
Thead Enco wrote:
Renier Gaden wrote:
Here is a link to the discussion on the DUST 514 Feedback/Requests forum.
Here is a link to the discussion on the EVE Online Features & Ideas Discussion forum.

The short version is that to initiate a Planetary Conquest match in DUST a Warbarge class ship loaded with clones must travel in EVE from where the clones were picked up to the district being attacked. This creates two phases in a Planetary Conquest match.

1) EVE Phase, the fight to defend/destroy the Warbarge.
2) DUST Phase, the fight on the ground to take/defend the district.

There is also a mechanic for DUST corps that don’t have EVE connections.



No one over here gives eh flying **** about that poor excuse of an fps. In other news I hear Star Citizen will be a good game (sarcasim implied)


Incorrect. There are plenty here that care enough about DUST to want to see it succeed.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2014-02-05 10:11:51 UTC
Renier Gaden wrote:


The short version is that to initiate a Planetary Conquest match in DUST a Warbarge class ship loaded with clones must travel in EVE from where the clones were picked up to the district being attacked.


In order to facilitate faster gameplay for our less-patient fps brethren, DUST mercs do not travel on a warbarge, they jumpclone to one already in position, and because of their more-advanced-than-capsuleers cloning and scanning technology, there is no delay between jumps. At least, that's loreside. In reality, an fps needs to be more fast-paced than the more strategic gameplay of EVE, and the two still have to work in parallel for DUST to not just succeed, but meet player expectations as well.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Lugalbandak
Doomheim
#13 - 2014-02-05 13:58:14 UTC
hey dust haters , those ground pounders already proofed tear creators up in space , dust is working and is only getting better. Lol

The police horse is the only animal in the world that haz his male genitals on his back
Noxisia Arkana
Deadspace Knights
#14 - 2014-02-05 14:37:34 UTC
Neat concept. I don't see what's in it for the EvE player? I'm definitely not going to the dust forums to find out.
Ruskarn Andedare
Lion Investments
#15 - 2014-02-05 14:49:54 UTC
Renier Gaden wrote:
Here is a link to the discussion on the DUST 514 Feedback/Requests forum.
Here is a link to the discussion on the EVE Online Features & Ideas Discussion forum.

The short version is that to initiate a Planetary Conquest match in DUST a Warbarge class ship loaded with clones must travel in EVE from where the clones were picked up to the district being attacked. This creates two phases in a Planetary Conquest match.

1) EVE Phase, the fight to defend/destroy the Warbarge.
2) DUST Phase, the fight on the ground to take/defend the district.

There is also a mechanic for DUST corps that don’t have EVE connections.


Unfortunately I can see two probable outcomes here

Option 1: DUSTies active on warbarge
Phase 1 - EVE players do their best to grief DUSTies, max tears generated if DUSTies prevented from playing for over an hour
Phase 2 - the single DUSTie that didn't quit the battle during the wait auto-wins

Option 2: DUSTies battle becomes active when warbarge arrives so they can jump to it
Phase 1 - EVE players do their best to destroy warbarges, there's unlikely to be any incentive to pour enough EVE resources in to protect them
Phase 2 - so few Planetary Conquest matches ever occur that it doesn't matter
Renier Gaden
Immortal Guides
#16 - 2014-02-05 19:12:18 UTC
Possible incentives for EVE players to care about their Alliance owning Planetary Districts:

1) Have a district on a planet function like a PI Command Centre for anyone in the Alliance that holds the district. This would not be counted toward the total number of Command Centres you can have due to your Interplanetary Consolidation skill. It would allow you to operate PI on additional planets.

Each District on the planet owned by your alliance would make more Power Grid and CPU available up to a maximum of 6 districts, as the Command Centre Upgrade skill allows you to due for a normal Command Centre.

Currently DUST mercs only hold districts on Temperate Planets, but since High Tech Produciton Plants can be setup on Temperate Planets there is a definite benefit there.

2) POS bonusses. The bonuses already in place fore are based on planetary infrastructure:
- Cargo Hub: 10% per district owned to a maximum of 4 districts (40%) decrease in manufacturing time at a POS.
- Research Lab: 5% per district owned to a maximum of 4 (20%), reduction in POS fuel usage.
- Production Facility: Nothing? I could not find an EVE bonus associated with it.

Maybe there are other POS bonuses that could be applied.

3) Refining bonuses. If your Alliance owns a POCO and at least one district on the planet, you can drop off Ore at the POCO and have it refined at a better rate than you would get at an NPC station. Have a 24 hour delay on the refinement process due to the Ore having to be transported to the surface, refined, and returned to orbit. The refined minerals can then be picked up at the POCO. Have the Refining capacity increase with each district owned.

When space elevator are introduced in Null Sec have them further reduce the cost of refining.

4) Increase the Bounty payout for Rats based on the percentage of districts in the system owned by your Alliance.

5) Storage. If the Alliance owns the POCO and owns at least one district, each alliance member gets access to a hanger in the POCO. Also include a Corp Hanger. (Could be useful in systems without stations.)

6) Factories in Districts to produce some POS fuel components such as Oxygen.

Any other ideas?

Also, on a related note, the NPC version of the War Barge should generate a kill mail based on the value of the Clones lost. Currently a clone pack costs about 30 million ISK. Not much, but not bad for something that does not shoot back.
Renier Gaden
Immortal Guides
#17 - 2014-02-05 19:14:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Renier Gaden
Vincent Athena wrote:
Just what someone playing a fps wants: Their play delayed while someone else in another game spends an hour flying a ship about, only to find out it got ganked right at the end and the battle has been called off.

The Warbarges carry empty clones. DUST mercs only Jumpclone to the Warbarge when the battle starts.
Renier Gaden
Immortal Guides
#18 - 2014-02-05 19:17:57 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:

Never work.

Bubbles.

We are talking about Low Sec. No Bubbles. Null Sec would not have NPC Warbarges. Null Sec Planetary Conquest, or whatever version of that is extended to Null Sec, will require full EVE/DUST integration.
Renier Gaden
Immortal Guides
#19 - 2014-02-05 19:31:44 UTC
Ruskarn Andedare wrote:
Unfortunately I can see two probable outcomes here

Option 1: DUSTies active on warbarge
Phase 1 - EVE players do their best to grief DUSTies, max tears generated if DUSTies prevented from playing for over an hour
Phase 2 - the single DUSTie that didn't quit the battle during the wait auto-wins

Option 2: DUSTies battle becomes active when warbarge arrives so they can jump to it
Phase 1 - EVE players do their best to destroy warbarges, there's unlikely to be any incentive to pour enough EVE resources in to protect them
Phase 2 - so few Planetary Conquest matches ever occur that it doesn't matter

We are talking about option 2.

The mechanic I propose is for an NPC Warbarge that is tough enough to require several Capital Ships to take it out when moving within the System, but is Shield heavy and loses 20% of its shields every time it makes a jump, so that with each gate jump it becomes more vulnerable. This will ensure that DUST Corps can expand to adjacent systems, but restrict them to a slow system by system expansion if they don’t have EVE support.

I also propose a Player controled Warbarge which is faster, squishier, and does not have the same restrictions as the NPC Warbarge. So it would be more viable if there was enough EVE support.
Rovinia
Exotic Dancers Union
Hatakani Trade Winds Combine
#20 - 2014-02-05 19:55:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Rovinia
If Dust514 once gets relevant to Eve, I would much more like to see Eve players beeing able to build fortifications (Trenches, Bunkers, Clone-Supply-Depots, Fortresses etc.) on a planet to make it harder to be conquered by opposing forces. In the form of some kind of Map Editor. So Eve players would be more involved in the preparation of the battle, not the battle itself.

Perhaps such a function to personalize "your" world would help Eve players a bit to get interrested in what's going on on the surface. It would also make it more "personal" for Dust Players i think. "Back at 9CK-K2 again. This time we will take that bloody Goon-Fortress, Arrrrr!" Pirate

The main problem stays: Dust is for instant action, Eve is much more tactical and it often takes a certain amount of time till a engagement happens. That doesn't really fit with the matchmaking System of Dust, a open world approach like Planetside would have been much better for this.
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