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Missions & Complexes

 
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DED Complexes

Author
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2014-01-30 13:57:02 UTC
3/10 are easy enough in an algos with reasonable drone skills, 4/10 is fine with any cruiser really, not gone any higher yet...
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#22 - 2014-01-30 16:59:13 UTC
Laiannah Sahireen wrote:
Zhilia Mann wrote:
Evilishah wrote:
I like the Muninn idea for 6/10's.


I really don't. I very much doubt you can push out enough damage from a Muninn to kill the BR or Sansha overseers. And I very much doubt it would even get to the overseer in the Serp 6 and if it did it probably wouldn't kill him either.


Muninn is perfectly capable of all of this - my corpmate does it on a regular basis.


Forgive me, but you're misinformed. You might just break the Crimson Lord in a Munnin. You will not break Skomener Effotber, who requires 500 DPS pure EM just to even out with his armor tank; a three RF gyro Munnin with 425s and faction EMP only pushes 515 total, 75% of which is EM damage. That simply isn't enough to crack him. Firing Mjolnir Rage HAMs from your utility high will probably help a bit, but I still very much doubt that fight would end before downtime.

As for Serpentis Logistical Outpost, you could break Uehiro Katsen with that much damage but I still contend a Munnin would never get to him.

This is all assuming solo. If your friend is bringing alts along for the ride these things become more likely.

As for a cheap battleship... I suspect just about any BS can run them (standard Scorpion exclusion applies). The issue there becomes moving through low sec with a battleship.
Evilishah
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#23 - 2014-01-31 01:44:53 UTC
Zhilia Mann wrote:

As for a cheap battleship... I suspect just about any BS can run them (standard Scorpion exclusion applies). The issue there becomes moving through low sec with a battleship.


A BS would be fine. I was just hoping for something with a better align time, but it is insane for me to fly a billion dollar ship in low/null until I can comfortably afford to eat that as a loss.

From this thread, it seems BS might be the preferred price to performance ship than.
Jeanne-Luise Argenau
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2014-01-31 12:23:47 UTC
Evilishah wrote:
Zhilia Mann wrote:

As for a cheap battleship... I suspect just about any BS can run them (standard Scorpion exclusion applies). The issue there becomes moving through low sec with a battleship.


A BS would be fine. I was just hoping for something with a better align time, but it is insane for me to fly a billion dollar ship in low/null until I can comfortably afford to eat that as a loss.

From this thread, it seems BS might be the preferred price to performance ship than.


maybe fit a blop to run those plexxes and directly jump to them, by using a covert cyno alt
Treborr MintingtonJr
S.N.O.T
S.N.O.T.
#25 - 2014-01-31 13:39:45 UTC
@Zhilia Mann

What about Antimatter Channeler
Hermeticas
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#26 - 2014-02-02 18:32:40 UTC
I've repetitively flown 10/10 in a Manticore.

Which I think is excellent in so far as the ammount of isk you are risking in the ship vs. the potential rewards.

Frigates, fit/flown well, can sig/speed tank most of the content in complexes like that. You however need to fly well and understand that you can't actually absorb even a small percentage of the ammount of damage that the NPCs are attempting to send your way. Your flying must constantly be manual and maintaining a high radial velocity to everything in the room, or you will die in one or two volleys by the time you even notice you aren't properly avoiding their attacks. If you can do that, and it isn't so very difficult, the next trouble is in breaking the tank on your targets. Very occasionally in my Manticore I'll run into an Officer or some such that is difficult to kill solo due to active tank/repair rates. Or the same thing on a stronghold/structure. But nothing a little overheating can't fix. More of a problem most of the time with the Elite Frigates. Javelin Torpedos and target painters however can work wonders. I semi-frequently one-shot frigates with a volley of those torpedos + double painters. If a new spawn has a collection of frigates in the spawn, immediately point yourself outwards from the room and go for range, until they are down. I head out and then make slow turns around the room, keeping my radial velocity high to the ships/etc. still in the center of the room and letting the frigs chase me in a circle.

The biggest threats to you in a room/spawn are the Elite Frigs, Tower/Regular Sentry Turrets, and Stasis Towers. Proper flying and you kill all of them/the small stuff first on each spawn, switch to harder hitting torpedos and blast the crap out of the Battleships that are left.

You are however quite vulnerable to any surprise visit in 'your' complex.

Regular every day risk management however can keep you alive.

Watch local. Only fly when you are alone/only with friends. If you decide to take a risk and fly a signature/complex with other people in system... watch d-scan for probes and warp out the second you see them. But that isn't fool proof. They may already know where the sig is and not need probes to come find you so again, I advise only flying alone or with friends unless the reward is worth the risk.

YMMV: Caveat, I have perfect torpedo sklls, so perhaps my damage application is a bit better than average. However, I wouldn't imagine 'that' much better.
Cheng Musana
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#27 - 2014-02-02 19:58:56 UTC
8/10 sites (sansha prison camp) are near impossible to complete solo. Even if you manage to clear all rooms the objective (a structure) has a insane active tank where you need like 1600DPS to get trough armor+shields. maybe a pure damage fittied kronos/vindicator could do it solo. All 4 rooms i would advise to snipe with a MJD+railguns. And after you are done killing everything in the 4th room get close to the structure and use a mobile depot to fit T2 blasters with max damage focus.
Hermeticas
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#28 - 2014-02-02 21:15:08 UTC
Cheng Musana wrote:
8/10 sites (sansha prison camp) are near impossible to complete solo. Even if you manage to clear all rooms the objective (a structure) has a insane active tank where you need like 1600DPS to get trough armor+shields. maybe a pure damage fittied kronos/vindicator could do it solo. All 4 rooms i would advise to snipe with a MJD+railguns. And after you are done killing everything in the 4th room get close to the structure and use a mobile depot to fit T2 blasters with max damage focus.


Many of those structures only actively repair if you are within a given range of them. For example in Serpentis Fleet Shipyard, that range is 60k for the objective stronghold at the end. So while the needed DPS to kill it within that range is considerably larger, orbiting at even 61k and hitting it with something of longer range is much easier. I do this with Javelin Torpedos, for example. I have tested and come to the very fast conclusion I had no chance of breaking the tank of the structure with Rage Torpedos at closer range, but did so pretty easily at greater range w/ less damage, with the active tank... inactive.
The Renner
Canadian Operations
#29 - 2014-02-03 02:03:13 UTC
All of the sansha DEDs are soloable at least, assuming the proper ship of course.
Boltorano
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#30 - 2014-02-03 08:45:30 UTC
Zhilia Mann wrote:

Forgive me, but you're misinformed. You might just break the Crimson Lord in a Munnin. You will not break Skomener Effotber, who requires 500 DPS pure EM just to even out with his armor tank; a three RF gyro Munnin with 425s and faction EMP only pushes 515 total, 75% of which is EM damage. That simply isn't enough to crack him. Firing Mjolnir Rage HAMs from your utility high will probably help a bit, but I still very much doubt that fight would end before downtime.


I'm not sure what ship could kill Effotber with only 500 DPS, maybe it's possible with a Legion or some other ship that doesn't have to reload. The only time I've ever managed to break his tank with less than 700 EM-heavy DPS was when I shot at him for 15+ minutes and he eventually gave up on life and stopped repping.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#31 - 2014-02-03 17:04:06 UTC
Hermeticas wrote:
Cheng Musana wrote:
8/10 sites (sansha prison camp) are near impossible to complete solo. Even if you manage to clear all rooms the objective (a structure) has a insane active tank where you need like 1600DPS to get trough armor+shields. maybe a pure damage fittied kronos/vindicator could do it solo. All 4 rooms i would advise to snipe with a MJD+railguns. And after you are done killing everything in the 4th room get close to the structure and use a mobile depot to fit T2 blasters with max damage focus.


Many of those structures only actively repair if you are within a given range of them. For example in Serpentis Fleet Shipyard, that range is 60k for the objective stronghold at the end. So while the needed DPS to kill it within that range is considerably larger, orbiting at even 61k and hitting it with something of longer range is much easier. I do this with Javelin Torpedos, for example. I have tested and come to the very fast conclusion I had no chance of breaking the tank of the structure with Rage Torpedos at closer range, but did so pretty easily at greater range w/ less damage, with the active tank... inactive.


And people wonder why I insist that DPS at 60km is a valid metric for exploration ships....
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#32 - 2014-02-03 17:05:20 UTC
Treborr MintingtonJr wrote:
@Zhilia Mann

What about Antimatter Channeler


A well-fit Munnin could break him but it would take a bit. You'd probably be stuck running a three slot tank which might make managing incoming damage a touch and go thing from time to time but that's what overheating is for, right? It can be done though.
Tajic Kaundur
Collapsed Out
Pandemic Legion
#33 - 2014-02-05 01:30:02 UTC
Personal experience speaking here:

Someone with around 12M SP, not really specializing in anything other than "combat skills", can solo 7/10s easily enough. It's definitely not fast, so it can be frustrating if nothing valuable drops, but it's possible.

What I personally use (keep in mind these are all Serpentis sites):

4/10: Harbinger Navy Issue (no doubt in my mind the "Navy Issue" part is unnessisary). This has a few issues in the final room, my tank can't hold forever, but you can easily kill the boss before you fall below 50% armor.
5/10: Dominix with medium guns
6/10: I don't think a Serpentis 6/10 exists.
7/10: Dominix with large railguns, MJD away, drop sentries, blow things up.

The same strategy would probably work in 8/10s, I never feel at danger in 7/10s (until local spikes). Just haven't stumbled across one in a while. Serpentis 9/10s don't exist, and from the few 10/10s I've done in fleets, I wouldn't try it. I know it doesn't have enough DPS to crack the final tower anyways.

My only problem is my DPS is really low, but that's kinda a given with Sentry Drones at 3 and Gallente Battleship at 3.

I'm considering swapping the Harby for a Stratios, though the Stratios costs more it seems like it'll both do better than the Harby and I can bring it into 3/10s (as though those aren't easy enough).
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#34 - 2014-02-05 04:32:01 UTC
Tajic Kaundur wrote:
Personal experience speaking here:

Someone with around 12M SP, not really specializing in anything other than "combat skills", can solo 7/10s easily enough. It's definitely not fast, so it can be frustrating if nothing valuable drops, but it's possible.

What I personally use (keep in mind these are all Serpentis sites):

4/10: Harbinger Navy Issue (no doubt in my mind the "Navy Issue" part is unnessisary). This has a few issues in the final room, my tank can't hold forever, but you can easily kill the boss before you fall below 50% armor.
5/10: Dominix with medium guns
6/10: I don't think a Serpentis 6/10 exists.
7/10: Dominix with large railguns, MJD away, drop sentries, blow things up.

The same strategy would probably work in 8/10s, I never feel at danger in 7/10s (until local spikes). Just haven't stumbled across one in a while. Serpentis 9/10s don't exist, and from the few 10/10s I've done in fleets, I wouldn't try it. I know it doesn't have enough DPS to crack the final tower anyways.

My only problem is my DPS is really low, but that's kinda a given with Sentry Drones at 3 and Gallente Battleship at 3.

I'm considering swapping the Harby for a Stratios, though the Stratios costs more it seems like it'll both do better than the Harby and I can bring it into 3/10s (as though those aren't easy enough).


Serpentis are unusually easy, at least on the ones you name. The 6/10 is a pseudo-DED that very much exists and... isn't that easy. The 9/10 is also a psuedo-DED (as it is for all factions).

And yes, if you can apply decent damage at 60, you should be able to handle all of those sites (up through 8/10, really). 7/10 is a grind but it's workable. 5/10 is a breeze.
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