EVE General Discussion

For SOE missions, the claimed payout is much higher than 90 mil/hr. Just FYI (read my post above).

Better yet, hear it from the horse's mouth himself:

Here.

I turned in none of the LP. I simply used the ISK per LP Store site to determine that the LP I had exchanges for 1356 ISK/LP. SOE exchanges at 2301 ISK/LP.

I figured that rather than take the time to purchase the rockets, cart them to Jita, wait for them to sell etc., I would use the posted exchange rate so more of the 4 hours could be spent actually being awarded Mission Rewards, Time Bonuses, Bounties, and more LP.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the basic claim to justify the nerfing of Highsec is that Highsec mission runners can earn 90+mill ISK per hour in relative safety. However, as Kimmi's initial data has shown, that is a long way from being factually accurate. Now, is it possible to achieve ISK/hour values of those claimed? Certainly, if you have a perfectly fit ship, excellent tactics, near perfect skills and ideal conditions.

One of the posters argued that Kimmi was 'doing it wrong' and therefore having a lower ISK/hour ratio than is possible. Well, that's rather the point isn't it? There may be a few dedicated Highsec mission runners making large amounts of space money, but from my own experience most Highsec mission runners don't have their fit perfectly tuned, or have maxed skills, or even use the optimal tactics; they do it largely for fun.

If SoE LP are overvalued, assuming that they are awarded in the same abundance as LP from other sources (assuming parity between sec status and level of agent), then that's not the fault of the players running SoE missions, but of the nature of the market itself. Inflation, market trends and other economic factors are controlled by players and are just as much a part of the 'emergent gameplay' as scanning down miners and mission runners and ganking them.

As for claims of Highsec missions being as ISK faucet, I would also argue that they are also an ISK sink. This is partly due to ship losses from botching a mission (very common with newer players who assume a faction battleship will ensure easy victory), or more often from the ganking community who proudly state that they make their ISK from scams/ganks/ransoms. I don't have the data to back this statement up, nor to identify the exact number of ISK being generated and lost by Highsec missioners, so this is simply my anecdotal opinion based on my limited firsthand observations.

I just wanted to comment on Kimmi Chan's work. And it most certainly qualifies as a body of work. And in a scientific sense. You put a question into a testable framework and then performed experiments on that and produced verifiable results. I see other posters questioning that, attacking it, but not in any verifiable way. You've produced results that are 'falsifiable'. We can prove whether they are false or true.


The attacks on your results tend to be 'non falsifiable'. We don't have a way to test them. 'I'm sure I could do better' is not the same as actually having done comparable work so that we have a set of results from a similar experiment.

Basically I'm saying that you've done extremely good work here, Kimmi Chan, and saying one reason why it's so good.

Thank you.

I really wanted the numbers to be higher. I was hoping it would be a lot closer to the 90m ISK/hr but the numbers just weren't there.

A note about the "you're doing it wrong thing":

If I take 5 minutes off the times for the 2 missions I failed to blitz properly, Unauthorized Military Presence and Intercept the Saboteurs, AND take 1 minute off each of the other 12 mission times for a "poorly fit ship", I would have had an extra 22 minutes to run 1 maybe 2 more missions. I'm afraid it would be unlikely that I could have gotten an additional 240m ISK from 2 missions to get me to that 90m ISK/hr mark.

I have to correct you here. Losing ships is not an ISK sink. A material sink yes. But no ISK is leaving the Eve-conomy when a ship is lost. In fact, ship loss constitutes an ISK faucet as soon as Pend ponies up the insurance payout.

You are precisely right with the LP. The LP store is a sink and I believe that CCP uses this sink to great effect.

60mil/hr is most certainly much more feasible, assuming ideal conditions (ship, agent, missions, etc.).

Also, in reference to MTU's, if you use them you'll have to babysit and waste time on them. You will eventually lose them to probers (they're appx 6 million a pop), as I have learned. I don't bother with them anymore in hi sec. And I doubt using while blitzing through missions will add any value, as you are wasting blitz time and isk (if/when they get blown).

It is.

But its not the norm.

Guys I know it's easy to be confrontational here in GD but we all know what we've all said.

Let's discuss the data and conclusions that can be drawn from it. We've had almost 90 pages of nullsec and highsec buffoonery and I think we need to all shut down our afterburners and evaluate what we have.

I posted my EveBoard profile earlier in the thread.

I've also estimated roughly how much more I would have made doing SOE with SC V. Though I have not posted it. Posting it now:

35546 LP * 1.5 (SC V) * 2301 (ISK/LP) = 122,852,691

(67,865,081 + 122,852,691)/4 = 47,679,443 ISK/hr

ED: The LP is based on an estimate of earned LP * 1.5 for the SC V. This may not be entirely accurate but is the best I can do without training the skill up to V and going about this again to generate additional data. This is not outside the realm of feasibility but not at this time.