Intergalactic Summit

This raises a common question: Is "Amarrian" a culture, a religion or an ethnicity? The answer to that question often depends simply on whom you ask, and the probability of which answer you get is often directly related to a person's own perceptions of their own position within the Empire - and yes, sadly, vanity often comes into play here.

That the original Amarrians originated on but a single world is common knowledge, as is the way in which we have spread out our Empire, along with our culture & religion across a vast expanse of New Eden. In this way the idea of "Amarrian" has spread beyond a mere ethnic group and into a vast Empire.

The more conservative Amarrians, sadly I feel, have yet to fully grasp this, though I suspect such ignorance is quite deliberate. By placing an emphasis on the mere idea of an Amarrian "bloodline" as it were they seek to elevate themselves above all others who are also part of the Empire but outside of that particular ethnic group. It is old fashioned racism, plain and simple.

Meanwhile, more liberal minded and forward thinking Amarrians (such as myself) define "Amarrian" as anyone who embraces Amarrian culture and follows the Amarrian Faith. In this sense, all those who give unto God thus become equal before God. Naturally this does not exempt one from following the hierarchy of society, as we must still obey our superiors, but it is a unifying factor of our society that whilst we may all bow before the Empress, even she still bows before God. This is worth noting because despite the Amarrian reputation for arrogance this proves the exact opposite: That no Amarrian sees themselves as divine, but rather merely instruments of a divine God.

It is this attitude, I believe, that is precisely why our Empire has been so successful on it's growth and stability. The idea that anyone, from the Nu-Kunni, Khanid. Ammatar, even a Gallente or Caldari who so desired, could become one of us and stand with us as equals before God. And yes, we do most certainly erase foreign cultures and replace them with our own when we assimilate a people. In this way we avoid the constant turmoil that nations such as the Federation often experience, caused in chief by so many different (and often opposing) factors all attempting to live under a single roof, as it were. The Caldari experience this to a far lesser degree, as their loyalty to the ideals of the State trump any particular loyalty to any one Megacorporation, though some sentiment remains. The Republic obviously, as seen in events throughout history, do tend to face the most internal strife during times of relative peace; an external enemy is what unites them best, as Shakor knows all to well. I believe the Republic motto is "Me against my brother, my brother and I against my uncle, my uncle and I against the other tribes, the tribes united against the Amarr." Ironic, then, that to this day they find themselves needing us for something, I would suppose.

But I digress: How is this different than the tribal family ideals of the Republic? Simply put, it is more akin to the conservative elements of the Empire that I mentioned previously. More emphasis is placed on "bloodlines" - genetic heritage, etc, than to anything else. In the minds of the Republic, one does not get to choose one's culture or destiny. One's place is assigned at birth, very much akin to a caste system, to one tribe or another based entirely on one's genome. Furthermore, loyalty to said tribe is automatically assumed. One born to Sebiestor parents, for example, will, in the eyes of the Republic, forever be a Sebiestor. They can never become Brutor or Thukker, no matter where their true loyalties lay. Even if they emigrate to the Federation (and many do) they are still considered part of that tribe even after decades of Federation citizenship and cultural assimilation.

To truly see the severity of this belief one need only look at the infamous Elder Fleet invasion, or even the terrorist attacks still taking place by so-called "freedom fighters" to this day. The Republic believes that people born with Matari DNA in their bodies must belong to their ancestral tribes, no matter how many centuries have passed since they last even met someone from said tribe. It did not and does not matter to them if a person of Matari heritage has long since converted to the Amarrian Faith, or embraces our culture - as far they are concerned, this genome is the only thing that matters. As noted before, this issue exists even amongst Matari living within the Federation, as well.

The true ugliness of it all rears it's head when it comes to actual families and marriage. To marry someone outside of one's own tribe is considered to be a social faux pas, because doing so dilutes the "purity" of the all-important "bloodline" of the tribe. Maintaining this "purity" is disturbingly important to the tribes, as is some of the less savory means in which is sometimes enforced. Those who marry outside their tribe, or worse, outside of the tribes altogether are ostracized at best and labeled "race traitors" at worse. Needless to say this has limited their expansion over the centuries, as indigenous people simply can not be assimilated when conquered - only eliminated to make room for the "pure" races of the tribes.

The organization that you are referring to is PIE, and yes I am aware of them. They definitely fall into the extremely conservative frame of mine, to be certain, but then what can one expect from such a staunchly traditionalist military organization?

You might be surprised, however, at how many of the more liberal minded Amarr exist in the upper echelons of our government. Those such as Mr.Baracca and myself, whom believe in the Pax Amarria and the idea of a more peaceful Reclaiming, are not so much idealists as simple pragmatists. It is one thing to destroy an enemy, yet it is quite another to convert him into an ally - and you will be much stronger for it when you are done, as well.

The Caldari have a similar viewpoint, though more directly militarist, which I believe is known as the "sheathed sword" victory. Now in their case it simply means outsmarting a foe so that they realize that they cannot win and simply surrender without a fight, but the end goal lesson is the same: It is far better to capture than to destroy. When we defeat barbaric people in battles we destroy lives and lose souls, for such is the cost of war; but when we convert people peacefully, assimilate them, make them like us, then no lives need be lost, nor souls wasted, and we all prosper together.

While it may seem like idealism, again this is pragmatic logic that simply happens to achieve an ideal result.

Sadly, you are correct that an outside viewer often does not see the Empire this way, and sadly groups such as PIE - by far one of the most visible faces of the Empire - do nothing to improve this image. Yet again, they clearly do not believe in the Pax Amarria. I see them as useful simply because there are those in the Republic who see personal political gain in sacrificing their citizens in pointless war, and without groups such as PIE we would certainly find them upon our doorsteps with torches and pitchforks. Yet should the more sensible elements within the Republic ever rise to power enough to direct policy and peace is achieved, then PIE would no longer bear any relevance - something which I do not believe that they would welcome. Which brings us back to our own faults, namely, these regressive elements that believe that the Reclaiming is best done at the point of a sword.

I assure you, however, that the Pax Amarria "movement," if you will, is strong throughout the Empire. It is not just a blind ideal, it is a rational choice based on simple logic, as well. While the Sarum Family were clamoring for war, our Empress held them back and let more calm minds prevail. While I would not call her "liberal" I would most certainly attribute her the virtue of profound sensibility.

The Pax Amarria is the voice of sensibility, as previously mentioned, so it is only natural that she chose the course that she did. While I am sure that if war was more sensible she would have chosen it instead, but this was clearly not the case.

The Empire has always been slow to change, this is true, but this does not mean that we never grow or evolve.

Meanwhile, in other subjects, I assure you that the Republic's view on race & genetics is quite true. I should know, as my brother-in-law (from a long line of Matari engineers who had earned their freedom & citizenship several generations previously) was brutally murdered by the terrorists of the Elder Fleet. His crime? Being of ethnic Brutor decent but married to an Amarrian woman. "Race traitor" was the exact words they used before executing him in front of his wife and daughter.



Midular did not reign, Shakor did. That was the problem. It still is.

Naturally, every nation has it's warlike elements and it's more rational elements. I admit that I know little of the Thukker ways, other than them being essentially nomadic. Yet a nomadic people are ones who meet many different peoples and cultures in their travels, and this tends to broaden their worldview. So that being raised in Thukker traditions have given you this wider perspective is only natural.

I can only hope that the other tribes learn to follow suit, and that our own aggressive factions can learn to stand down as well.

You could not be more wrong.

If CONCORD worked, I would be all for it.

But it does not work. It has failed now multiple times to stop major conflicts between the Empires. It routinely allows for the slaughter of Imperial Civilians at the hands of capsuleers.

CONCORD steps in to stop a capsuleer from shooting another capsuleer. But it allows a capsuleer in Amarr prime to butcher whole convoys without intervention.

Either CONCORD needs to do its job and maintain the peace, or it needs to be removed so that we can be allowed to retaliate to threats against Amarr.

I would actually prefer the first, but I don't see that happening.

When at such time as I see disappear the boundaries separating the main body of PIE from it's Auxillaries, which is to say that archaic race-based system of hierarchy that places a glass-ceiling on those people whom we are supposed to be uplifting, then my opinion shall stand as it is.

Not that I have much stock in the outcome of this discussion... But I have to say, I found something of a personal note in the glass ceiling analogy.

Just because you have killed the enemy with the scabbard should never mean you're unwilling to make the cut.

That aside, I wonder at your misconception that assimilation is peaceful when in fact it's war through culture.

Why did the Starkmanir matter? Others have explained too, but here is why I think they did.

Pretty much since its conception, the Republic has struggled to keep the balance between two political views with the same goal but an opposing view of methods and timing. There are those who say we should seek peace with the Enemy, to explore peaceful solutions (in the best case) and at least prepare before the full-out war (in the worst case). Then there are those who say that no peace is honorably possible, and we must not negotiate with the Enemy, but to attack now to either liberate every kinsman and -woman (in the good case) or to lose everything but at least keep our honor (in the bad case). The balance has never been a comfortable one, and in the final years of Karin Midular's regime, the bad blood was already starting to cause a serious rift, a threat worse than the Empire alone could have caused.

The Starkmanir are a powerful symbol. They are, according many legends, the Tribe that started the rebellion, and paid for it with a fate worse than death: extinction, death on a scale that surpasses the chain of generations. To fully understand what that means, I suspect, you have to be Matari, and possible that is not enough, but to be of a clan with such a chain. Nevertheless, when the Starkmanir was rediscovered, it was a test of sorts: will we fight for the Lost Tribe, or will we abandon even them?

My guess is, had we left them alone, the secessionist war-minded faction would not have gone for them anyway.

It was no choice.

And if anyone believes it was a coincidence that the Starkmanir were found at a moment where the "discovery" forced the hand of the Republic into a war we have much less chance of winning than we would have had we waited, oh, say, twenty years more... they are a fool.

Elsebeth

If this mess is a PR victory, I am not sure I ever want to see a loss.

Else

Isn't it what I said ? That you do not want CONCORD in your way...

Oh well... You are not wrong on that sore point though. CONCORD's case these days is annoying.

Though who do you think presides at the Inner Circle ? Representatives of all Empires. You brought it upon yourselves.

Also, some might say that this deplorable state of affairs is still preferable to an outright full scale war. I find PIE Inc view on the matter rather shortsighted, if I may say so.

Are ashes Reclaimable in scripture by the way ? I am pretty sure that the trillion of dead Amarr citizens will feel relieved when the gates of Paradise will open to them as martyr for the cause... The same way they already open to the ones dying from CONCORD failures.



What Mr Makari says is that the invasion of Halthurzhan and the liberation of the Starkmanir remnants was a political coup.

That the Starkmanir matter or not for the Minmatar as a people does not matter in interstellar politics.



And the Ealur right ?

People always forget the Ealur.