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What if we removed jump drives from the game?

First post
Author
Doc Severide
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#21 - 2014-01-20 20:45:14 UTC
Beekeeper Bob wrote:
Read as far as "Formup in 5 minutes".

You really have no clue if you think it takes 5 mins to for multiple 250 man fleets....Oops

Yes, a real player would do it in 3 minutes...
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
Just let it happen
#22 - 2014-01-20 23:05:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Vincent Athena
To project force three things need to be placed at the proper location:

Ships
Pilots
Players

If moving ships was harder, alliances would pre-position ships at strategic locations. As more ships total would be needed, I'd expect a size reduction. More battleships, fewer dreds, and so on. The pilots would get there via clone jump or interceptor.

So now to stop fast force projection you would have to get rid of jump clones and fast warping ships. Under those conditions alliances would pre-position both ships and pilots. Now to project force the players would log into the proper pilot. Again there would be a reduction in power as each player would need to spread their training over more pilots.

But the size of the blob would not be smaller. It would just be filled with smaller ships.

To stop force projection via having the players log into the proper pre-positioned pilot, you would have to restrict all accounts to one character and all players to one account.

Good luck with that one.

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Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2014-01-20 23:25:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Tyberius Franklin
Vincent Athena wrote:
To project force three things need to be placed at the proper location:

Ships
Pilots
Players

If moving ships was harder, alliances would pre-position ships at strategic locations. As more ships total would be needed, I'd expect a size reduction. More battleships, fewer dreds, and so on. The pilots would get there via clone jump or interceptor.

So now to stop fast force projection you would have to get rid of jump clones and fast warping ships. Under those conditions alliances would pre-position both ships and pilots. Now to project force the players would log into the proper pilot. Again there would be a reduction in power as each player would need to spread their training over more pilots.

But the size of the blob would not be smaller. It would just be filled with smaller ships.

To stop force projection via having the players log into the proper pre-positioned pilot, you would have to restrict all accounts to one character and all players to one account.

Good luck with that one.

Interceptors + reshipping would have to be effectively slower than taking cynos to locations and as you said it would mean a duplication of assets on differing fronts. Even with jumpclones you'd be looking at 19 hour timers for being able to relocate again or delf destructing pods and the associated cost with that. Either way the issues associated with travel, while not eliminated, would be exasperated greatly from the current jumpdrive/cyno mechanics.

Alts would still be pretty effective at moving, though as a side effect multiboxing could take a hit to the head if alts were used in that manner.
tekmin
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#24 - 2014-01-20 23:28:54 UTC  |  Edited by: tekmin
create a weather system of ionised storms that go through all eve, eve sink to have better weather coverage and use only suns that are currently ionized by these storms

standings etc with empires could improve accuracy of weather patterns
lore would be, the first missionary network has been discovered through ghost sites

plasma storms, etc... plenty more


have suns have sort of jump drive bonuses like in wh but just for how much mass it could make jump through, more ionized "due to weather" more jumps possible!

have exploration tie in all these with other spatial phenomena like black holes etc...

immagine hiding an entire fleet in the emptiness between stain and delve

i can get on...

sorry if this makes no sence at all


all this takes away cynos or maybe change cynos
needing like enourmes amount of pilots making a super cyno, it has to mimic a suns mass...


tie weather patterns to the constelations we see changing today when travelling
make an overlay on the map to see the nebulas etc... change this random weather pattern


bonus to recon, increase mass to cyno effect

so capital stay have jump drive but only to mega cyno or active suns, spatial phenomena
Felicity Love
Doomheim
#25 - 2014-01-20 23:29:13 UTC
TheMercenaryKing wrote:


My image, is a heavy fleet of sub-capitals and capitals jumping through a gate and burning out of bubbles while shooting everything in sight, while trying to warp out to get to the objective. Making it so dreads have better tracking and better overall capital mobility, which would be negated when they commit via siege and triage (or deploy fighters/drones type siege module).



The server can barely handle massive fleets as it is.

This will not end well... it will just end with 1,000 of pilots seeing the "warp tunnel" for about 2 hours before emerging into a ginormous cluster****, where nobody moves for another 2 hours.

Good times. Roll







"EVE is dying." -- The Four Forum Trolls of the Apocalypse.   ( Pick four, any four. They all smell.  )

TheMercenaryKing
Ultimatum.
#26 - 2014-01-20 23:30:52 UTC
granted when i say heavy i mean the old days of like 5 dreads and 40 battleships and maybe 10 support ships.
Marlona Sky
State War Academy
Caldari State
#27 - 2014-01-20 23:42:34 UTC
You can't keep a player from wanting to be at x,y,z system. What can be done is make changes so what ship they bring and how they bring it become strategic choices. Right now, players can pick any ship they want and get them there however they like. Even when they like. So most of these choices become no brainers as the player can have their cake and eat it too.
Sarka Tzi
Doomheim
#28 - 2014-01-20 23:45:16 UTC
Remove terrible ideas from the forums.
Galphii
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#29 - 2014-01-21 00:29:42 UTC
If jump drives were removed entirely, wars would no longer be 'the north side of eve vs the south side of eve', they would be more localised - neighbor versus neighbor. Alliances would be forced to maintain fleet HQ's at various locations in their space to project power in a reasonable span of time, much like how the US fleet keeps bases in various locations around the world (because they don't have jump drives).

Jump clones and interceptors would be used to move pilots to their ships as required.

It becomes problematic for stragglers or players just logging on to join a fleet already in progress. So to is it difficult to bring in capital reinforcements, although this could be a good thing in terms of server lag in the battle zone. Certainly it's more difficult to crash a node by bringing in every capital ship an alliance has at their disposal.

Moving through bottleneck systems can be difficult too, especially if the defender has already camped it out with most of their fleet. If memory serves, this was one of the reasons for introducing jump drives in the first place. This can be mitigated to some degree by increasing the number of linked systems, especially between regions. Space is vast, but Eve reduces this expanse to a few narrow corridors, and this would need to be remedied at the same time.

With large capital fleet movements taking much longer, defending the home systems becomes a consideration if your capital fleet is 25 jumps away at the time. Keeping duplicate capital ships at various is expensive, but doable for the larger alliances.

Without the ability to project capital power within minutes and hours to practically anywhere outside of HS, smaller alliances might be able to carve a niche in the abandoned areas in space as alliance borders contract and the shadow of titan bridging (removed) is no longer an issue.

So there's benefits and problems that comes with a change of this magnitude. Simply halving jump range would be a better first step to see how it affects the game. Bottom line - the biggest ships in the game shouldn't also be the fastest, as their speed is dictated by the speed of their cyno ships.

"Wow, that internet argument completely changed my fundamental belief system," said no one, ever.

Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations
#30 - 2014-01-21 01:14:43 UTC
What if all titans appeared in space at once, despite being logged off, and were popped out of their POSes with their jumpdrives and warp drives broken? It could be like a weird y2k type of glitch preprogrammed into them all.

That would be funny.

See Bio for isk doubling rules. If you didn't read bio, chances are you funded those who did.

Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#31 - 2014-01-21 05:41:45 UTC
Actually, I once had the reverse idea:

1) Put jump drives in every ship in EvE.

2) Remove the need for cyno beacons. Ships would randomly appear someplace within 50AU of the target star.

Effect: Gate camp? What's that? Jump in, jump out.

Falcons start to collect dust on the market. And there was much rejoicing.

Note that while this would make moving fleets into systems easier, there would be a significant delay for actual blobbing because all those ships would have to regroup first. The bigger the blob, the longer it would take them to group up.

Hit and run strategies would become a real thing, because a dozen ships could organize and move faster than two thousand. In fact, all kinds of strategies open up.

Meanwhile, lone wolves, explorers and even just commercial ships would be far more willing to do their business in null. More traffic = more null action. That's what the nullbears want, right? Or at least what they say they want. Of course that's not actually true - what they really want is just more serfs to make the stroke their egos, which is why non-aligned pilots are about as welcome as new strategies (see above).

Oh well.



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Kytayn
Kronos TEchnologies
#32 - 2014-01-21 05:51:50 UTC
What if...


  • ...you could build your own stargate to new kinds of space?
  • ...this new space was beyond jump range of all capital ships?
  • ...capital ships couldn't use the player-made gates?
  • ...it had delayed local like J-Space?


We're on a journey...

Be careful in Pulsar systems, you might get Pod Flu.

(Bio for YouTube reading)

TheMercenaryKing
Ultimatum.
#33 - 2014-01-21 06:02:21 UTC
Kytayn wrote:
What if...


  • ...you could build your own stargate to new kinds of space?
  • ...this new space was beyond jump range of all capital ships?
  • ...capital ships couldn't use the player-made gates?
  • ...it had delayed local like J-Space?


We're on a journey...


what if...

Eve isn't real?
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
#34 - 2014-01-21 09:38:07 UTC
This proposal belongs in Feature & Ideas Discussion.
But as this proposal is neither new or original, it would get locked for redundancy.
So I might as well lock it here.

The rules:
16. Redundant and re-posted threads will be locked.

As a courtesy to other forum users, please search to see if there is a thread already open on the topic you wish to discuss. If so, please place your comments there instead. Multiple threads on the same subject clutter up the forums needlessly, causing good feedback and ideas to be lost. Please keep discussions regarding a topic to a single thread.

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