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Morphite
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Sandrestal
Pakistani Taxi Drivers
#1 - 2014-01-07 15:25:45 UTC
Just to show you how far down mining has become I took a look at Morphite which is selling for around 8,000 isk each. Now in null sec I could mine this stuff all day long in my Mack and take in around 600 units of Mercoxit per hour. Yes I know you can do a bit better if in a fleet with Rorq. bonus and fleet implants etcetera etcetera. 600 units of Mercoxit yields about 1500 morphite. At about 8000 isk per unit that only gives about 12 mil per hour. With my ratting ship and running sanctums I can do over 2x that in 20 minutes. So if mining the highest value ore only gives 12 mil per hour, I guess you can see why it is a wast of time mining asteroids. Ice OTOH, is better but will still only give about 50 mil per hour mining Dark Glitter.

While one can better handle multiple accounts doing a mining fleet, still with a bit of work you can also handle a couple of accts while running anoms with Ishtar. Sadly at one time mining the high end ores in Null used to be quite profitable, alas it is no more. My advice to newbies is train up skills to run missions. When you can comfortably do level 4's, join a null sec corp and run anoms for isk.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#2 - 2014-01-07 18:37:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Morphite isn't a high-demand ore, as so little of it is used in T2 construction.

Last I looked, it was about as valuable per cycle as Pyroxeres, but that was a while ago. Modulated Deep Core Strip Miners harvest less of Mercoxit (343.75m3 / cycle) than Modulated Strip Miner II harvest of other ores (630 m3 / cycle) .

(630 - 343.75) / 630 = 45.4% m3 Mercoxit per cycle

You shouldn't look at Morphite when discussing mining profitability.
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#3 - 2014-01-07 19:12:54 UTC
Mercoxit mines at a lower rate than other ores. Even if it is the most valuable per cubic meter, its not the most valuable per hour.
With a Mack mining 4500 cu m of regular ore per 3 minute cycle mining Hedbergite is worth about 22 mil per hour. Many miners will triple box two exhumers and a booster to about triple that. Its more work, but still easier than running anoms with a single ship. And the ISK compares favorably to running missions and anoms.

Further income boosts from mining occur if instead of just selling the minerals you build stuff and sell that. I get about 50% more selling items over what I would get just selling minerals.

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Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#4 - 2014-01-07 19:47:01 UTC

The problem with miners is they mine themselves into poverty.

Ratting Anoms gives you a pretty standard isk/hr, thanks to bounties, no matter what other players are doing. The value of ratting is tied to the value of isk, which changes via inflation. In contrast, the income from mining is based on the value of minerals. When there aren't enough minerals, their price is high, and you can make decent income/hr. When they are plentiful (because too many people are mining them), their price drops and the income / hr does too. (i.e. supply & demand).

Increasing Ore yield won't help you (in the long run). Instead, there are two ways to increase income from mining: Increase mineral demand, which is generally accomplished by the large scale destruction of ships that need to be replaced, or by stopping other miners from mining.

Essentially, you need to make it harder to mine safely or you need to massive wars to cause major ship destruction in order to boost mining income.

Zifrian
The Frog Pond
Ribbit.
#5 - 2014-01-07 23:50:55 UTC
Sandrestal wrote:
Just to show you how far down mining has become I took a look at Morphite which is selling for around 8,000 isk each. Now in null sec I could mine this stuff all day long in my Mack and take in around 600 units of Mercoxit per hour. Yes I know you can do a bit better if in a fleet with Rorq. bonus and fleet implants etcetera etcetera. 600 units of Mercoxit yields about 1500 morphite. At about 8000 isk per unit that only gives about 12 mil per hour. With my ratting ship and running sanctums I can do over 2x that in 20 minutes. So if mining the highest value ore only gives 12 mil per hour, I guess you can see why it is a wast of time mining asteroids. Ice OTOH, is better but will still only give about 50 mil per hour mining Dark Glitter.

While one can better handle multiple accounts doing a mining fleet, still with a bit of work you can also handle a couple of accts while running anoms with Ishtar. Sadly at one time mining the high end ores in Null used to be quite profitable, alas it is no more. My advice to newbies is train up skills to run missions. When you can comfortably do level 4's, join a null sec corp and run anoms for isk.

One max hulk with rorq boosts can make roughly 45mil an hour with hed/hemo. Ark is around 39.

One max hulk for mercoxit with rorq boosts can make roughly 38mil an hour.

Running missions/anomolies has a limit on the number of characters you can run. If you try using 12 toons in a Sanctum, you'll quickly find most of those are either doing nothing or you can't react quickly enough to do them.

Mining with 12 toons is much more manageable, hence why people do it and why mineral prices are low.

So yeah, mining solo in null is going to yield you less than if you ran sanctums but there have been, and always will be, upsides and downsides to both activities.

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Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#6 - 2014-01-08 14:37:14 UTC
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:

The problem with miners is they mine themselves into poverty.


Speak for yourself.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#7 - 2014-01-09 11:24:14 UTC
dont mine it and wait till price raises.
mine something else with better ISK/h.
Styth spiting
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2014-01-11 10:49:53 UTC
Sandrestal wrote:
Just to show you how far down mining has become I took a look at Morphite which is selling for around 8,000 isk each. Now in null sec I could mine this stuff all day long in my Mack and take in around 600 units of Mercoxit per hour. Yes I know you can do a bit better if in a fleet with Rorq. bonus and fleet implants etcetera etcetera. 600 units of Mercoxit yields about 1500 morphite. At about 8000 isk per unit that only gives about 12 mil per hour. With my ratting ship and running sanctums I can do over 2x that in 20 minutes. So if mining the highest value ore only gives 12 mil per hour, I guess you can see why it is a wast of time mining asteroids. Ice OTOH, is better but will still only give about 50 mil per hour mining Dark Glitter.

While one can better handle multiple accounts doing a mining fleet, still with a bit of work you can also handle a couple of accts while running anoms with Ishtar. Sadly at one time mining the high end ores in Null used to be quite profitable, alas it is no more. My advice to newbies is train up skills to run missions. When you can comfortably do level 4's, join a null sec corp and run anoms for isk.


Nullsec isn't any different then any place else in New Eden. Solo mining in HS is crap, solo in low, WH, Null are crap. You're making 12M isk/hour solo, low skills, no boosting, no implant, etc. etc. etc. While with a maxed out boosting ship, properly setup ship, implants etc. you can make 45M isk/hour. And since multiboxing accounts is so easy (and is why most people don't solo mine with one account) you're looking at 225M isk/hour with 5 accounts.

People who multibox can benefit from it. manufacturers will, people who have access to boosters will, maxed out miners will and so on. Just because it doesn't work for you does not mean others wont benefit from it.

I'm guessing the idea that you're doing it wrong never crossed your mind did it?
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#9 - 2014-01-14 01:30:55 UTC
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Essentially, you need to make it harder to mine safely or you need to massive wars to cause major ship destruction in order to boost mining income.


You left out raising the mineral cost of stuff. More minerals needed, more demand for minerals, more minerals used, mineral shortfall, prices go up.

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Felicity Love
Doomheim
#10 - 2014-01-14 03:12:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Felicity Love
... posting in another stealth "I can't pay my rent in Null because those bastards in Empire have ruined mining for us in Null" thread.

Or, you could stockpile and hope the Fool's Hope that player built stargates ("Someday", TM ) use freighter-loads of the stuff...

Don't laugh. Stranger things have happened and made paupers into multi-billionaires literally overnight, albeit rarely. Pirate

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Zerlestes
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#11 - 2014-01-15 03:49:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Zerlestes
a sec who told you guys that **** i mine with rorqual boost and i dont come near 40 mio isk /h in theory its possible
in real its abou 20 mio/h that stuff needs to jumpet out to pos /station and out to empire
Aviendha Star
#12 - 2014-01-19 05:07:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Aviendha Star
I've been mining in Eve for 11 years now...

If folks believe all there is to mining is to simply sell the ore, they are seriously mistaken. Typically, it's the crowd that grinds missions who believes wealth is only depicted by a flat time rate. Please allow me to enlighten those minds to the wonderful world of research, manufacturing, marketing, trade and, oh yeah --mining. First, you train your skills, then you work at creating a manufacturing base, while researching and developing all those cool modules you kids love blowing up. Next, market, trade and promote your goods or find a niche and become a tycoon.

Players worried about who becomes richest the fastest are often the ones supplying us with isk because they are going through ships and modules and ammunition fast as can be. Of course, there are always the players in Eve, in which we are in no short supply of, who like to pretend to be great and powerful and awesome because they can blow something up. They try their hardest to invite more players to null sec, too. Granted, every corner of Eve has its advantages, but in the universe of supply and demand, miners are on top of the world.

Fact.
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#13 - 2014-01-19 07:10:57 UTC
Aviendha Star wrote:


If folks believe all there is to mining is to simply sell the ore, they are seriously mistaken. Typically, it's the crowd that grinds missions who believes wealth is only depicted by a flat time rate. Please allow me to enlighten those minds to the wonderful world of research, manufacturing, marketing, trade and, oh yeah --mining. First, you train your skills, then you work at creating a manufacturing base, while researching and developing all those cool modules you kids love blowing up. Next, market, trade and promote your goods or find a niche and become a tycoon.

Players worried about who becomes richest the fastest are often the ones supplying us with isk because they are going through ships and modules and ammunition fast as can be. Of course, there are always the players in Eve, in which we are in no short supply of, who like to pretend to be great and powerful and awesome because they can blow something up. They try their hardest to invite more players to null sec, too. Granted, every corner of Eve has its advantages, but in the universe of supply and demand, miners are on top of the world.


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Sandrestal
Pakistani Taxi Drivers
#14 - 2014-01-20 00:14:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Sandrestal
Styth spiting wrote:
Sandrestal wrote:
Just to show you how far down mining has become I took a look at Morphite which is selling for around 8,000 isk each. Now in null sec I could mine this stuff all day long in my Mack and take in around 600 units of Mercoxit per hour. Yes I know you can do a bit better if in a fleet with Rorq. bonus and fleet implants etcetera etcetera. 600 units of Mercoxit yields about 1500 morphite. At about 8000 isk per unit that only gives about 12 mil per hour. With my ratting ship and running sanctums I can do over 2x that in 20 minutes. So if mining the highest value ore only gives 12 mil per hour, I guess you can see why it is a wast of time mining asteroids. Ice OTOH, is better but will still only give about 50 mil per hour mining Dark Glitter.

While one can better handle multiple accounts doing a mining fleet, still with a bit of work you can also handle a couple of accts while running anoms with Ishtar. Sadly at one time mining the high end ores in Null used to be quite profitable, alas it is no more. My advice to newbies is train up skills to run missions. When you can comfortably do level 4's, join a null sec corp and run anoms for isk.


Nullsec isn't any different then any place else in New Eden. Solo mining in HS is crap, solo in low, WH, Null are crap. You're making 12M isk/hour solo, low skills, no boosting, no implant, etc. etc. etc. While with a maxed out boosting ship, properly setup ship, implants etc. you can make 45M isk/hour. And since multiboxing accounts is so easy (and is why most people don't solo mine with one account) you're looking at 225M isk/hour with 5 accounts.

People who multibox can benefit from it. manufacturers will, people who have access to boosters will, maxed out miners will and so on. Just because it doesn't work for you does not mean others wont benefit from it.

I'm guessing the idea that you're doing it wrong never crossed your mind did it?


I guessing you're clueless as to how to make isk. With one ship I can run null anoms and make 75 mill per hour. Why in gods name would I want to invest in multiple accts, spend billions to get set up just to make 45 mil and hour.