EVE General Discussion

Heh

Welcome to the game.

You appear to be on the right tracks as far as thinking of your options is concerned. But let me tell you one important thing: the skill que.

One of the biggest issues with new PVPers is that they tire fast of being reaped. This is natural. Poor training is one reason. So what I would like to suggest for you, whether you get into FW, Solo PVP, small gang PVP, or even mega fleet battle blobs, is to know your goals and train directly for them.

For example. I have over 70 million SP, but only Amarr cruiser 4 and no specialization in energy weapons. So let's suppose I go up against a 2 month noob using the same layout, but is having Amarr 5 with level 5 specializations not only for the ship, but for the equipment as well. The best I could manage are support skills.

Me and that 2 month noob would be just about equally matched on those grounds.

Proper skill training will make you effective in PVP on short order. The SP system is genius, and not to be confused with any "grind" or "put in time" philosophy that we see in other MMOs. But the incredible power of the SP system also gives one a lot of rope to hang himself if lacking knowledge. This is why we have the certificate system and the new (so new I have not even used it yet) mastery rating system for ships. You see the SP system is so flexible and powerful for the new player that CCP has to make special tools and features just to we can use it.

With proper approaches to the SP system you can be quite capable in all kinds of PVP in just a couple of months at most.


The approach I would recommend - but mine is not the only one - is to decide this first:
- how you want to PVP (small gang, solo, FW, fleet, ganks, etc)
- what role you want in PVP (support, tackle, DPS, logistics, etc)
- what ships you would use in these options and....
- what bonuses these ships afford to certain equipment choices (you should never go against the bonuses it's pure waste if you do) and therefore..
- this is ultimately what you will center your skill training choices on.

Given that, you aim for level 4 of all the of the skills, the direct skills and the so-called "support" skills. For example, a specialization skill in small projective turrets is a direct skill but sharpshooting would be a support skill. Caldari Frigate would be a direct skill but Spaceship command would be a support skill. Get your direct skills to level 5 ASAP (these let you get into tech 2 variants of ships and modules you want to use) and get the support skills to 4 ASAP. Sometimes a ship skill must be level 5 to progress. For example, if you decide you want to tackle, interceptor would be a good choice, but frigate 5 is needed to get to tech 2 interceptor.

I have heard stories of 5 million SP characters PWNING 50 million SP players because one had a better handle on the SP system than the other. And the number one "killer" of players is not getting ganked or getting bored, it's stagnation brought on by poor SP application - lots of players at 5 million SP comparing themselves to 50M SP players, PVPers mainly getting spanked by veterans who have been playing since 2006 for example, and thinking they too won't have success unless they have been at this game for just as long, then assuming their opponents will be "twice as powerful" for still having been in longer. This is very incorrect thinking and should be avoided.


Everything I am telling you BTW is not what I have done. I don't write from the perspective of an expert in SP, I write from numerous mistakes made during the course of over 7 years. I didn't get maximum yield from any ship until several years into the game, in any endeavor, and this was my situation for a few years in. I could have spared a lot of ships and a lot of ISK if I learned how to train the right skills the first time around.

Run missions for isk, not mining. ISK/hr from mining is far inferior, the only way to make serious isk mining is by multi-boxing.

Also stick to small ships - frigates, interceptors, etc. There's a common thought among newbies that bigger = better. That is simply not true. A battleship can be quite easily killed by an assault frigate who knows what he is doing, if said battleship pilot is not skilled.

By sticking to smaller ships you are limiting the cost of your loss, so learning doesn't become too expensive. Everything you learn in a small ship will apply for cruisers and battlecruisers too. Battleships not so much, since they are very slow their fighting style is different. You'll learn about transversal, when to kite, when to close in, optimal range, etc. It takes a lot of practice. Also as the novelty of combat wears off (and combats start to last longer because you don't die right away!) you'll learn to figure out what weapons your enemy is fitting and how you can possibly counter them while still delivering max damage. Also at some point you will learn situational awareness. Very, very few combats in EvE are 1v1. Your target is often "bait", and his gang of buddies were just waiting for you to aggress before jumping in.

There's lots and lots of little details like this which must become instinctive, even reflexive. Also with frigates it doesn't take too long to max out the ship skills and small weapon skills. This leaves you more time to train the support skills too - since they will help you no matter which size ship you end up flying.

Learn when it's worth it to buy T2 modules, and when meta 3 or meta 4 is good enough. A lot of people think that EvE is won by whichever toon has more skill-points but that's not true. It takes skill at combat - real life skill. And that can only be earned by practicing. Oh and don't be afraid to talk to people whether you win or lose. Don't smack, be friendly, and you might make friends (always useful when you don't want to be on the outnumbered side all the time) and learn many different techniques from them. Don't be afraid to join corps and alliances either. Get yourself Teamspeak 3 or mumble, and be on comms with your buddies.

That's about it for a summary. Good luck!

Can't recommend FW. Tried it 3 weeks long. Was fine at first, joined fleets, got onto the TS they advertised in fleet chat. The third or second time i got onto TS (nearly one week passed) they thought they had a spy. Being the new guy, i was accused and found "guilty" in ~20s without me being able to defend myself, because nobody bothered to give me the rights to unlock my microphone.

After that? Shut out from fleets, I tried for 2 weeks to roam solo. With only a good 4mil SP (mostly drone skills) you can guess how that went. Only thing i learned in that time was how to evade others in lowsec and what i was able to pick up in fleet before that.

Didn't make a positive wallet balance in this 3 weeks time, either. Even flying solo for 2 weeks, i wasn't able to break even. And you can forget about achieving this in a fleet.

FW? Stay away from it.

Faction was Tier 1 the whole time, isk to lp ratio ~1k isk/lp. Lost about 15 T1 frigs ~10m isk a piece. To get even, i would have had to offensive plex a minimum of 2 novice sites solo per lost frig. Well, good luck with that. FW lowsec is crawling with pirates and in the few quiet systems sites are already "occupied" by other militia members that all go "wtf dude?!" if you show up in "their" plex .

And you can forget to earn substantial LP when in fleet most of the time.

Granted, it got better towards the end of these 3 weeks. But only because i was avoiding combat at all costs. Which made the whole thing kinda pointless because i joined FW to train combat skills.

You've got 4M sp and your T1 frigs cost 10m?

ISK is no trouble in FW, really, as long as you take the time to do some plexes inbetween losing ships.

You can also train level 3 PI skills, get a 500k/hour passive income stream, and never go broke losing T1-fitted T1 ships.

Most players run at least 2 accounts some more. Key is to get the account self sufficient.

1. Great option will learn how to fly small to large gange pvp. Limited ability to maker money on solo account bc always at war.


2. Also good option will make tons of isk converting LP while learning to PVP. Will learn low sec combat mechanics and fits but will have to adapt should you go to null sec.

3. PVP corps are fun but without another form of income you will always be broke and scrambling to make isk.

Some might argue this isn't "real" PvP since it has a scripted and controlled feel. You don't get the full brunt of Eve's asymmetrical warfare here.




So long as you don't go nuts on shooting allies/neutral people in lowsec, you will still be able to dwell and make ISK in hisec. Additionally due to the current way FW functions, it is one of the best ways for a new character to make ludicrous piles of money at next to no risk. I will not detail that blasphemous practice here, though.



Some of us do . Check my sig.

I strongly recommend not trying to learn PvP on your own. There are a lot of nuances, tactics, and details that are easy to miss as you're learning, and having someone to mentor you is a huge help. On top of this, solo PvP is difficult for pilots of any age, which is why I encourage new players to look into participating in small gangs or fleets, where they can be very useful from day one.

I think it's great that you're looking at getting into PvP. I think it's also great that you are looking at RvB as an option for getting into it. I think the most important thing here is to find a group (any group - even if it's not with me) to roam with. Having companions in the game, taking advantage of their experience and learning while doing are all important in this game. Eve is just as much a social experience as it is an explosive one. Try things out, find a ship that is comfortable and hone the skills needed to fly it, pretty soon it'll be like a part of you. (Gawd that sounded pretty lame I know).

When it comes to isk, it's always a good idea to have a character that is doing the grinding for you. I have a couple of "carebears" that keep me in ships and isk so that I can continue blowing up things. If you do decide to learn a few things in RvB I'll hook you up with a few replacement hulls - you'll need them