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Caldari cross training
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Ideafix Ergel
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1 - 2013-12-12 18:55:39 UTC
Hi guys,
so im playing about a month now, started as caldari and i have read that most ppl in forums suggests not to train missiles and that caldari are very weak right now. so basically i would like to hear your opinions on should i cross train into some other race, like minmatar or should i stick to caldari
here are my skills as of today:

Armor
level4 Hull Upgrades
level3 Mechanics
level1 Repair Systems

Drones
Combat Drone Operation level1
Drone Durability level2
Drone Navigation level3
Drones level4
Salvage Drone Operation level1
Scout Drone Operation level3

Electronic Systems
level1 Electronic Warfare
level1 Propulsion Jamming
level3 Target Painting

Engineering
level3 Capacitor Management
level3 Capacitor Systems Operation
level4 CPU Management
level1 Electronics Upgrades
level4 Energy Grid Upgrades
level4 Power Grid Management
level4 Weapon Upgrades

Gunnery
level1 Controlled Bursts
level3 Gunnery
level2 Motion Prediction
level1 Rapid Firing
level1 Sharpshooter
level3 Small Hybrid Turret

Missiles
level1 Auto-Targeting Missiles
level3 Heavy Assault Missiles
level3 Heavy Missiles
level3 Light Missiles
level3 Missile Bombardment
level4 Missile Launcher Operation
level3 Missile Projection
level3 Rapid Launch
level3 Target Navigation Prediction

Navigation
level4 Afterburner
level1 High Speed Maneuvering
level3 Navigation

Neural Enhancement
level1 Cybernetics

Rigging
level1 Jury Rigging

Shields
level1 Shield Compensation
level2 Shield Management
level4 Shield Operation
level4 Shield Upgrades
level4 Tactical Shield Manipulation

Spaceship Command
level2 Caldari Battlecruiser
level3 Caldari Cruiser
level3 Caldari Destroyer
level3 Caldari Frigate
level3 Spaceship Command

Targeting
level1 Long Range Targeting
level1 Signature Analysis
level3 Target Management

as of my plans:
im playing with two friends. and my own plans - farm lvl 4, then lvl 5 maybe and then incursions someday. and joining ally for some sort of pvp maybe.

i would be really thankful for your help and suggestions
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2013-12-12 18:58:12 UTC
Depends on what you are trying to do.

There are plenty of workable Caldari ships, but its not "get a drake and sit in it for the next three years" Caldari skill progression any longer.
Miasmos
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-12-12 19:05:15 UTC
Don't spread your training too much. Caldari missiles have their place, and balance shifts happen all the time. Focus your training in what you want to do, and if you want to do more, train an alt for that.

Your skills are well on the way for caldari missileboats.
Miasmos
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2013-12-12 19:08:43 UTC
Here's a fast fit to aim for to solo L4's in a Raven. It's based on shooting from outside NPC range with microjump drive, so that you can skimp on tank and fit more dps with even low skillpoints.

Do not fly it before you can fit all of the t2 mods though, co-processor, launchers and shield boost amplifier are the only exceptions to this rule in this fit.

[Raven, Newbie PVE MJD]
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Co-Processor II

Large Micro Jump Drive
EM Ward Field II
EM Ward Field II
Thermic Dissipation Field II
Large Shield Booster II
Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Script
Shield Boost Amplifier II

Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Small Tractor Beam I

Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I

Hobgoblin II x5

Fury missile 888dps to 150km lock range, triple rigor damage application.
Precision or t1 missile 635dps to smaller targets than BS.
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#5 - 2013-12-12 19:17:20 UTC
Nothing wrong with Caldari ships. They also have the benefit of being extremely friendly to low-sp pilots for most isk-making activities, while still being competetive for high sp pilots.

If you do want to cross train, the best choice is Gallente. First, because caldari turret ships and gallente ships use hybrid turrets, meaning the sp you take away from missiles to put into gunnery is well-used for the ships you'll be able to fly. Secondly, many Gallente ships shield tank or at the very least can shield tank reasonably well. Third, you get access to guristas ships, which are pretty cool.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Ginger Barbarella
#6 - 2013-12-12 19:31:51 UTC
Caldari as a race are no more weak than every other race since Apoc. Plenty of very good Cardari ships; train what you like, have fun. True, heavies were nerfed a while back, and CCP recently castrated Rapid Lights (used to rock seriously, now just a waste), and rockets are nearly useless for anything except basic frigate brawling, but Drake is still a solid heavy platform and the SNI (Navy Issue Scorpion) is an awesome boat; Caldari & Gallente skills lead you into the Gila and Rattlesnake, awesome platforms for both drone and missile.

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
Odithia
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2013-12-12 21:11:46 UTC
Look at faction ship, might give you some idea.

Skill wise this is what will provide synnergy with Caldari skills :
Amarr : missile skills on some of their T2/T3 ships and thats all.
Gallente : hybrid turrets on most of their ships, some gallente ship can be OK shield tanked
Minmatar : missile on half of their ships and good shield tank
Ideafix Ergel
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#8 - 2013-12-13 18:24:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Ideafix Ergel
So i guess ill stick to caldari with a chance to go for some minmatar ships later. Thx for answers guys and girls :)
Ideafix Ergel
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-12-13 18:25:30 UTC
Ideafix Ergel wrote:
So i guess ill stick to caldari with a chance to go for some minmatar ships later. Thx for answers guys and girls :)
Alcorak
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#10 - 2013-12-13 19:01:22 UTC
Best thing to do is to find a corp based in high-sec for you and your friends early (this is more important than what to train). I'd say stick with caldari for now if PvE is your plan. You'll end up training armor skills eventually as a core skillset and hybrid turrets b/c a bunch of caldari ships use them. You already seem to be training up some drone skills. From there, it'll be a short hop over to Gallente ships.
Sasha Nourvarii
Brand Newbros
#11 - 2013-12-13 19:34:52 UTC
Ideafix Ergel wrote:
Ideafix Ergel wrote:
So i guess ill stick to caldari with a chance to go for some minmatar ships later. Thx for answers guys and girls :)



I'd really go the Cal/Gallente path.
Ideafix Ergel
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#12 - 2013-12-13 20:55:36 UTC
OK, ill think about it, thx again. Good active community here :)
scorchlikeshiswhiskey
Totally Abstract
O X I D E
#13 - 2013-12-15 02:41:24 UTC
As a missile pilot, unless you want to do a lot of mission running I'd start looking to ditch missiles. They're not, overall, in a very good place and there is no indication that anything is going to change in a positive way.
I use my Navy Raven with T2 Cruises for level 4 missions all the time, it's great for that. But for most other things you will find missiles are seriously lacking in viability. If you intend to stick with PvE for ISK, you will be looking at incursions soon, and missiles have no place in an incursion fleet either.
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#14 - 2013-12-16 00:46:56 UTC
On your plans: Be aware that the strategies used for level 5 missions and for Incursions don't really overlap as much as you might think. Level 5 missions are usually run in carriers or in subcapital ships that have extremely carefully designed passive shield tanks (set up to be unconcerned about energy neutralizers), while incursions are run in fleets with logistics support. Training into a level 5 Slepnir fit or a level 5 Archon fit will not help you in incursions at all, neither will training into an incursion Oneiros or Navy Apocalypse help you in level 5s.

Also be aware that you don't need to be 'super ready' for PVP, and in fact, PVP can find you before you feel you are ready for it. Don't be the person whose first PVP experience is losing their 1200m mission Proteus to being foolish - instead be the person that has had 20 or 30 PVP experiences (winning some, and losing most) before they undock in a 1200m Proteus.


As for skill choices: Right now, Gallente ships are the flavour of the month for subcapitals, with the Dominix, Ishtar, Proteus, Phobos and Oneiros all seeing significant use in nullsec wars, and the first two being incredibly effective in PVE as well. However, this can and will change. It's only a few months ago that the Tengu was the best ship in EVE.

My recommendation is that you dabble early on. Train all the racial cruiser skills to 3 (this won't take long and isn't a waste of SP as they are prerequisites for various powerful pirate ships), and try them all out. See what you find more fun - flying a drone boat, a missile ship, a turret ship, or something else. Once you know that, come back and ask us again for advice on where to train.

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Chi Garu
Perkone
Caldari State
#15 - 2013-12-16 11:26:51 UTC
You've got some good advice here so far, I'll just add that the current meta leans more towards drone and gunnery skills than anything else, but mostly drones, drones, drones. Skill up towards T2 sentry drones early on and look towards a dominix as your battleship hull of choice. That will cover you for missions and later for pvp unless something changes dramatically in the next 12 months.
Caitlyn Tufy
Perkone
Caldari State
#16 - 2013-12-16 11:35:43 UTC
Ideafix Ergel wrote:
Hi guys,
so im playing about a month now, started as caldari and i have read that most ppl in forums suggests not to train missiles and that caldari are very weak right now. so basically i would like to hear your opinions on should i cross train into some other race, like minmatar or should i stick to caldari


Here's my honest suggestion: change your informants.
Odithia
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#17 - 2013-12-16 15:56:49 UTC
For frigates, missiles mean business.
Can't tell for bigger hulls, people says they suck on cruiser and dread.