Skill Discussions

I use 90% missiles, and fly mostly caldari in pvp. I do pretty decently in pvp, especially with Vengeance. However, my corp always rags on me about missiles and how guns/lasers/drones/basically anything is better than missiles. However, I'm still able ot do very good DPS with missiles, os, I dunno. I'm bascially hoping yall will give me some evidence that I can tell them to stuff it.

Also, no T3s. I can't fly those and won't even be trying for them for a long while.

Sigh.

Please, please stop posting this. Everyone, not just you.

Optimal range has nothing to do with minimum effective range. Provided you're within optimal the only limiting factors on gun damage are 1) sig resolution/radius and 2) tracking. There is no penalty for being under optimal range.

Having said that: some missiles are fine and some aren't. HAMs, rockets, and lights are all in pretty good shape and apply good damage at reasonable range from pretty good platforms. Heavies are a bit underwhelming these days, torps are still somewhat awkward wrt damage application, and cruise -- actually, cruise are fine too if you actually bother to bring a cruise ship to an engagement.

I'd say the weakest thing about missiles at the moment is the relative dearth of effective platforms. Minmatar missile ships seem really underwhelming right now leaving just Caldari and Khanid. Well, second weakest: capital missiles are a ridiculous joke.

depends on the size of your gang, what you're doing, and what you're flying. Sometimes missiles work fine. Sometimes there isn't a missile boat that can do what you need it to do. They might just be teasing you for fun, and there may be sometimes where you being restricted to caldari missile ships is a liability.

For consideration:

Without implants, and with the default attribute mapping 20p 20w 20i 20m 19c:

* Time to train all races of frigate / destroyer / cruiser / battlecruiser / battleship to level 3: 17d 20h 52s

* Time to train small / medium / large / hybrid / laser / projectile turrets & support skills to level 3: 13d 11h 39m 30s

* Time to train rockets / heavy assault / torpedoes / light / heavy / cruise missiles & support skills to level 3: 12d 23h 6m 40s

Of course you won't be able to use T2 ships nor weapons, and other skills are required for fitting and tanking.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3821584#post3821584 No they are not worth it.

Light missiles and rockets are okay for pvp though. Edit:Seems like you have invested too far to back out. Check out my thread there is a tipping point where gunnery is still faster and more efficient to max.

In fleet it is important to have same doctrine. But if you are in small gang it doesnt matter lol. Imho assault missiles and torps are very good system if you can web+paint. Cruises and heavies are also very good for long range fights. Tengus and ravens are sometimes used as doctrines.

For years everyone said missiles were weak and the Drake was OP.
Lump all the bombers into one notch and rethink how you read kill boards.

Missed 1 Con

If you're in an Alpha Fleet your alpha lands late, if at all(primary already dead).

I prefer missiles over guns by a mile.

The main thing you got to remember about missiles is they work best against larger targets.

People say torps suck but if they are hitting a cap ship you might be putting out more damage than any other BS on grid.

You also got the stealth bomber factor. The F.O.F aspect if you are under heavy ecm.

You can even use defenders in the smaller ships to defend against larger missile ships.

They have a very different curve compared to guns as they get some aspects of those bonuses at L1.

Guns catch up and then surpass missiles for DPS v.s. same size target around L3-L4. But only then break even with the other weapon types with the other factors still applied.

They then surpass guns again using projection aspects v.s. dps as all skills max at L5.

Having the extra skill to train in missiles makes this ride go back and forth as you are between L4-L5 on all skills if you started both at the same time and trained all to L4 before training all to L5.

It's best to compare missiles to projectile weapons as they are the only ones using no cap and that can select damage type even if not as well as missiles can. When you view the range projection at the higher levels the gap for missiles on applied range dps will really start to shine.

Over all the have guns and missiles very balanced right now.
Missiles have more nuances and take a bit more SP to Max out.

Just do what you think is fun. Fun > Everything else.

this isnt actually true.
assuming the same velocity of you and your target, you'll track MUCH better at your optimal range than anywhere below it because of how transversal works.

if both you are the target are stationary, then yes, you do the same dps at and at any range below your optimal.
if there is transversal involved however, tracking comes into it and you hit best at (or sometimes even outside) your optimal range.
this is how 'getting under someone's guns' works.