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DED complex runners completely safe - redesign mechanic

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Author
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
#21 - 2013-12-03 21:45:59 UTC
The OP has the right to post an idea to discuss and has the right to expect a civil and healthy discussion as a result. You don't have to agree, but post your arguments in a civil manner please!
I have removed some rule breaking posts and those quoting them. As always I let some edge cases stay.

The rules:
4. Personal attacks are prohibited.

Commonly known as flaming, personal attacks are posts that are designed to personally berate or insult another forum user. Posts of this nature are not beneficial to the community spirit that CCP promote and as such they will not be tolerated.


5. Trolling is prohibited.

Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote.

ISD Ezwal Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

ghosttr
CRUZADOS
Goonswarm Federation
#22 - 2013-12-03 22:17:44 UTC
Why dont we just introduce a combat probe module that instapops ships in explorations sites when you get a hit, giving you free killmails. A message should also pop up when this happens telling the 'leet pvper' that he is the 'bestest pvper in the game, and ships explode at the sight of you'.

Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#23 - 2013-12-03 22:53:30 UTC
ghosttr wrote:
Why dont we just introduce a combat probe module that instapops ships in explorations sites when you get a hit, giving you free killmails. A message should also pop up when this happens telling the 'leet pvper' that he is the 'bestest pvper in the game, and ships explode at the sight of you'.



Only if it plays cool music and bells and **** like a carnival game.
Karma Codolle
Chimera Research and Development
#24 - 2013-12-03 23:25:14 UTC
You know this kind of reminds me of when "pvpers" were complaining when the rat AI was updated so they'd switch targets, and all of a sudden they had to use their brains because they could no longer warp in with a point and nuet and sit back while all the rats finished off their target for them.


Camp his out gates or try to chase him down in the plex, if he runs oh well you could potentially make a couple bill stealing his loot.

Majority of plex's have 2-3 rooms that's not hard at all for inty's to speed through and catch a target.

Hell with the new scan system you should have him scanned down before he even realizes you launched and retracted probes

We really don't need pvp dumbed down.

Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#25 - 2013-12-03 23:29:08 UTC
Karma Codolle wrote:
You know this kind of reminds me of when "pvpers" were complaining when the rat AI was updated so they'd switch targets, and all of a sudden they had to use their brains because they could no longer warp in with a point and nuet and sit back while all the rats finished off their target for them.


Camp his out gates or try to chase him down in the plex, if he runs oh well you could potentially make a couple bill stealing his loot.

Majority of plex's have 2-3 rooms that's not hard at all for inty's to speed through and catch a target.

Hell with the new scan system you should have him scanned down before he even realizes you launched and retracted probes

We really don't need pvp dumbed down.



How dare you discuss tactics in here?

This thread is abut more free kills, not doing work.
Zircon Dasher
#26 - 2013-12-04 00:03:02 UTC
Personal attacks and trolling indeed.....

Well at least I know who my competition is for selling key packages to people who want to shoot plex runners!

Nerfing High-sec is never the answer. It is the question. The answer is 'YES'.

NaK'Lin
7-2 Ronin
#27 - 2013-12-04 05:05:25 UTC
i CBA to read the whole thread as it's going to be full of QQ, but to the OP:

NO and -1

Noone enjoys an easy gank more than the united did in Rancer, but still; just NO.
You don't ALWAYS land within 2000 of the beacon after an accel gate, so you sometimes can remain cloaked.
I would like to see the ability again to pass accel gates cloaked if navigating precisely between 2,5 and 2 km; but that's just because it would segregate players more.

you can make it to catch plexers, i do.

and if he is too far along, unless its a stationed system and he lives there, he has to eventually get back out through a gate, right?
It's not like gates weren't already chokepoints to catch people; oh, wait.
Bobby Frutt
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2013-12-04 07:03:27 UTC
LUMINOUS SPIRIT wrote:
Your probes find a machariel in a DED plex. You warp to zero to tackle, but land on the entrance gate instead. Machariel in the 5th room just laughs at you in local, takes his time to finish the plex, and warps off. To add insult to injury, you cant light cynos in DED complexes, and you cant move around cloaked either throught room gates, and you always land to zero on the gate.

Ratters in null-sec should NOT be this safe.

Please consider redesigning mechanic so that

a) prober can warp directly to the ratter no matter what room he is in
b) remove cov cyno restriction
c) allow warping to gates at range without workarounds.

This does not make running complexes any easier. The only way it makes things easier is if a ratter was forced to warp out, he can now warp to his cloaked alt in the right room right away, without going through cleared rooms again. This is not a big deal. And no, sometimes setting up an ambush on the entrance is NOT a viable alternative, sometimes, with 50+ in local, you need to get a gank in 1-2 mins and get out, or youre dead.

How about: Go find people to fight that are looking to fight you.

I don't want to sound like you don't have a point, because you do to some extent. With the new interceptor changes though, the "rooms" are necessary.

Imagine an empty system, 1 Machariel doing PVE. It would have no chance escaping if an inty, or most frigs even, jumped in and warped to it's site immediately. No chance at all. Tackled, support comes in, pop goes Machariel. Every time.
Seranova Farreach
Biomass Negative
#29 - 2013-12-04 07:09:31 UTC
LUMINOUS SPIRIT wrote:
Your probes find a machariel in a DED plex. You warp to zero to tackle, but land on the entrance gate instead. Machariel in the 5th room just laughs at you in local, takes his time to finish the plex, and warps off. To add insult to injury, you cant light cynos in DED complexes, and you cant move around cloaked either throught room gates, and you always land to zero on the gate.

Ratters in null-sec should NOT be this safe.

Please consider redesigning mechanic so that

a) prober can warp directly to the ratter no matter what room he is in
b) remove cov cyno restriction
c) allow warping to gates at range without workarounds.

This does not make running complexes any easier. The only way it makes things easier is if a ratter was forced to warp out, he can now warp to his cloaked alt in the right room right away, without going through cleared rooms again. This is not a big deal. And no, sometimes setting up an ambush on the entrance is NOT a viable alternative, sometimes, with 50+ in local, you need to get a gank in 1-2 mins and get out, or youre dead.



dont forget mobile cyno jammer deplyable is out now. no more hotdrops for you Nullsec people ;p

[u]___________________ http://i.imgur.com/d9Ee2ik.jpg[/u]

Seranova Farreach
Biomass Negative
#30 - 2013-12-04 07:12:42 UTC
Zircon Dasher wrote:
Personal attacks and trolling indeed.....

Well at least I know who my competition is for selling key packages to people who want to shoot plex runners!



your sig is bad. nullbears already live the life of luxury. high sec people are what keep the gears moveing and highsec carebears make their iskies by doing dull repetative monotinous activities while you nullbears can just semi-afk rat with sentry carrior or w/e in nullsec for 10x the isk ;p

[u]___________________ http://i.imgur.com/d9Ee2ik.jpg[/u]

Colt Blackhawk
Doomheim
#31 - 2013-12-04 08:14:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Colt Blackhawk
A thread from cowards for cowards^^

So you are angry that you can´t kill a pve fitted ship without a point. Very risky plan to hunt down and engage a ship without a point.
Congrats. You are a true pvper.
Grow some ***** and let the pve peeps do what they want. I have honestly no clue what you are doing^^
Shooting juicy targets that are pve fitted in lowsec?! Very risky!!!
I already can imagine: "Oh he could have a point fitted, I won´t engage..."
And then you even start moaning.... Jesus.

Eve seems to have 3 types of peeps:
1.) PVE carebears....
2.) PVP...
3.) People who have some serious rl issues and should better grab a psychiatrist than trying to ruin the day for people that are REALLY not searching for pvp in an internet ship shooting program^^

[09:04:53] Ashira Twilight > Plant the f****** amarr flag and s*** on their smoking wrecks.

Dav Varan
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#32 - 2013-12-04 10:05:16 UTC
Its not hard to catch people is plex , you just need to get better.

Making the probe launcher do all the work for you will just make it easy to pie and impossible to plex.

All plexers will leave for high sec and then the good pies will have no one to catch either.



In short , get better and don't expect the game to do everything for you.
Dav Varan
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#33 - 2013-12-04 10:23:30 UTC
Quontor Zarrkos wrote:
Haha, a week ago we saw a kronos/proteus/proteus group running a serpentis annex site.
We got some guys on the wh to go gank them, ceptor warps to the plex...

We wait with tensions high cause they might warp off...

Ceptor pilot: "this gate is locked, I can't get in further to tackle them"

Turned out to enter that plex you needed a gold tag, we got trolled so hard by the dudes running it in local chat as they saw our fleet sitting on the gate.

I'm all for changing this bullcrap so that if you probe someone in a plex you can warp to them directly!


People who knew what they were doing outwitted those that didn't
seems to be working perfectly.

Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
#34 - 2013-12-04 12:32:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Sura Sadiva
Quontor Zarrkos wrote:
Haha, a week ago we saw a kronos/proteus/proteus group running a serpentis annex site.
We got some guys on the wh to go gank them, ceptor warps to the plex...

We wait with tensions high cause they might warp off...

Ceptor pilot: "this gate is locked, I can't get in further to tackle them"

Turned out to enter that plex you needed a gold tag, we got trolled so hard by the dudes running it in local chat as they saw our fleet sitting on the gate.



Of course they trolled you, why shouldn't. I'd also troll in local wannabe pirate trying to enter a FW small plex with a cruiser.

Fact is: if you want to hunt you have to know the territory. If you want to chase plexer inside DED you have to be able to deal with the envinroment and outplay them.

(Beside the hylarious idea about direct teleport on the target inside the DED could offer countless exploits related with summoning inside alts and friendly ships).
Lokar Griman
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#35 - 2013-12-04 13:50:47 UTC
jeesus if you cant get plexer got hunt similar plexer hunters like you. sThat way should get lot of pvp, unless your coward at hunting a target that bites back.
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