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Why CSM?

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Kara Trix
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1 - 2013-11-25 15:15:54 UTC
Been playing this game since May 2011

I remember the little CCP president rant issue.

But can't see why we need to give any gamer or small group of gamers any influence over this games design.

They absolutely don't speak for me.

I would rather have a REAL customer service relationship with the publishers that I have a voice rather than an Over the Top gamer who is far too interested in their own personal agenda than to promote mine.

REMOVE THIS FEATURE and fix the relationship... Give each player a voice, be it small...it's still their voice!
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#2 - 2013-11-25 15:21:48 UTC
you have plenty of voice already

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Charlie Firpol
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2013-11-25 15:33:32 UTC
Kara Trix wrote:

They absolutely don't speak for me.


This is only true if you have never voted for the CSM.

The Butcher of Black Rise - eve-radio.com
Sebastor Cane
The Outlet
#4 - 2013-11-25 16:10:13 UTC
Basically an old employee of CCP gave a lot of Tech II blueprints to an alliance he was in that gave them a lot of dominance.

There was such a fuss that CCP created the CSM to give the players the illusion that they had some control over the game


The employees name was T20 and Hilmar the CEO of CCP uses his picture for darts practise everyday.


Any questions
Midnight Firestarter
Anger Management
#5 - 2013-11-25 16:11:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Midnight Firestarter
The CSM in its current format is a crock of ****

70% of the people elected simply send out a Alliance mail and they vote. Its has nothing
to do with policies and what 's good they can bring to the game, its all about numbers.

Anyone who says it represents the gaming community, try Biomassing yourself as you are deluded.

CCP would be better to pick 10 Random Active corp CEO's.
Crumplecorn
Eve Cluster Explorations
#6 - 2013-11-25 16:12:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Crumplecorn
The CSM speaks for the majority so what you are essentially saying is that CCP should listen to you over the majority.

Unless you are a game designer at CCP, this does not hold true.

Witty Image - Stream

Not Liking this post hurts my RL feelings and will be considered harassment
Sura Sadiva
Entropic Tactical Crew
#7 - 2013-11-25 16:12:57 UTC
CSM was created by CCP after the BoB/Tech2 BPO scandal, as company pubblic relation tools; never been (and never acted) like a playerbase reppresentative. Their role is to bring/promote/advertise company policy and ideas amongst the playerbase. Not the countrary.

With few individuals excpetion, of course (f.i. Hans, but others too).

But in respect of CCP they're mostly a bunch of yesmen; not their fault, is just how the CSM is designed; so it works as intendeed.
SurrenderMonkey
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#8 - 2013-11-25 16:14:34 UTC
Batelle wrote:
you have plenty of voice already



Some might say too much, even.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
Midnight Firestarter
Anger Management
#9 - 2013-11-25 16:16:37 UTC
Quote:
CSM was created by CCP after the BoB/Tech2 BPO scandal, as company pubblic relation tools; never been (and never acted) like a playerbase reppresentative. Their role is to bring/promote/advertise company policy and ideas amongst the playerbase. Not the countrary.

With few individuals excpetion, of course (f.i. Hans, but others too).

But in respect of CCP they're mostly a bunch of yesmen; not their fault, is just how the CSM is designed; so it works as intendeed.


Not at all but its it current format 1 of the 10 large alliances sends out a eve mail and there almost guaranteed to be elected.
Thats not democracy thats a rigged system.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#10 - 2013-11-25 16:22:44 UTC
Midnight Firestarter wrote:
Not at all but its it current format 1 of the 10 large alliances sends out a eve mail and there almost guaranteed to be elected.
Thats not democracy thats a rigged system.

No, that's still a democracy — with a party system, even — only that lots of people stay home on voting day. The only thing that makes that bloc vote guaranteed is the lack of cohesion and interest in other parties.
Johnny Marzetti
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2013-11-25 16:25:39 UTC
Midnight Firestarter wrote:
Quote:
CSM was created by CCP after the BoB/Tech2 BPO scandal, as company pubblic relation tools; never been (and never acted) like a playerbase reppresentative. Their role is to bring/promote/advertise company policy and ideas amongst the playerbase. Not the countrary.

With few individuals excpetion, of course (f.i. Hans, but others too).

But in respect of CCP they're mostly a bunch of yesmen; not their fault, is just how the CSM is designed; so it works as intendeed.


Not at all but its it current format 1 of the 10 large alliances sends out a eve mail and there almost guaranteed to be elected.
Thats not democracy thats a rigged system.


It's rigged in favor of majorities?
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#12 - 2013-11-25 16:25:56 UTC
Midnight Firestarter wrote:
Quote:
CSM was created by CCP after the BoB/Tech2 BPO scandal, as company pubblic relation tools; never been (and never acted) like a playerbase reppresentative. Their role is to bring/promote/advertise company policy and ideas amongst the playerbase. Not the countrary.

With few individuals excpetion, of course (f.i. Hans, but others too).

But in respect of CCP they're mostly a bunch of yesmen; not their fault, is just how the CSM is designed; so it works as intendeed.


Not at all but its it current format 1 of the 10 large alliances sends out a eve mail and there almost guaranteed to be elected.
Thats not democracy thats a rigged system.

No that is pretty much exactly what democracy is. Everyone gets to vote, people organizing as voting blocks to futher shared political beliefs, the ones who got the most votes win and the losers come up with excuses why it really wasn't fair to them.
Sipphakta en Gravonere
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2013-11-25 16:39:29 UTC
Midnight Firestarter wrote:
Not at all but its it current format 1 of the 10 large alliances sends out a eve mail and there almost guaranteed to be elected.
Thats not democracy thats a rigged system.


Isn't that exactly like a democracy? You find people with the same ideals and values and band together for a common goal. It's not the elected CSM's fault that you can't find a majority for your candidate.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2013-11-25 16:40:37 UTC
Midnight Firestarter wrote:
Quote:
CSM was created by CCP after the BoB/Tech2 BPO scandal, as company pubblic relation tools; never been (and never acted) like a playerbase reppresentative. Their role is to bring/promote/advertise company policy and ideas amongst the playerbase. Not the countrary.

With few individuals excpetion, of course (f.i. Hans, but others too).

But in respect of CCP they're mostly a bunch of yesmen; not their fault, is just how the CSM is designed; so it works as intendeed.


Not at all but its it current format 1 of the 10 large alliances sends out a eve mail and there almost guaranteed to be elected.
Thats not democracy thats a rigged system.

I bet you're one of those people who thinks that compulsory voting is actually a good idea.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
atpc
Lost in Space Inc.
#15 - 2013-11-25 16:42:13 UTC
Its funny because people complain about Alliances sending out mails for votes to their alliance. But the highsec populace is much higher than low/null sec. It's just that Highsec doesn't care enough to vote. Then complains for the rest of the year when they arent represented.
mynnna
State War Academy
Caldari State
#16 - 2013-11-25 16:55:48 UTC  |  Edited by: mynnna
Kara Trix wrote:
Been playing this game since May 2011

I remember the little CCP president rant issue.

But can't see why we need to give any gamer or small group of gamers any influence over this games design.

They absolutely don't speak for me.

I would rather have a REAL customer service relationship with the publishers that I have a voice rather than an Over the Top gamer who is far too interested in their own personal agenda than to promote mine.

REMOVE THIS FEATURE and fix the relationship... Give each player a voice, be it small...it's still their voice!




I said this in a podcast, and I'll say it again here.

Interceptors have nullification because of something that a player suggested.

Interdictor's bubble launcher functions the way it does now because of something a player suggested (that a few of us on the CSM then brought to CCP's attention, incidentally)

If you have an idea, visit the features & ideas suggestion and post it. And incidentally, CCP is taking player suggestions for future personal deployable structures right now, in that very forum.

And frankly, devs are all over the forums posting, especially near patch time when they're looking for feedback. See that "Dev Posts" button at the top of the forum? Try it out sometime.

Basically, if you think there's "no relationship", I think it's your fault.


e: And incidentally, highsec is better represented on the council than pretty much ever before, thanks to Mike Azariah. If you have issues you want brought to CCP, you could also evemail him directly.

Member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal
Kara Trix
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#17 - 2013-11-25 17:01:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Kara Trix
Crumplecorn wrote:
The CSM speaks for the majority so what you are essentially saying is that CCP should listen to you over the majority.

Unless you are a game designer at CCP, this does not hold true.





That is EXACTLY what I am saying.

"IF" CCP wants to communicate to the players at all?

They should listen to each player account, not a small group of players.

Players should not create content, they are not game designers.

CSM players are not game designers and only voice their personal opinions of the game as I do. If you think for one second that ANY CSM member speaks for the majority you are delusional at best. They ONLY speak for their personal interests and the very small group of people they play with and their interests if at all.

If the CSM has any say at all (which is unlikely) it is a farce that they speak for the people and CCP should remove them and replace them with a standard customer service inquiry form with the following information on it.

1) Do you like the new feature "X" we added? If so, why?. If not, why?
2) We are considering three new features. Of these new features which would like most to see and why?
3) We've read the forums and would like to know what you think about "X" Suggestion? Unlikely!

Etc....

Anything else is stupid politics... CCP Devs can read the forums just like everyone else... there is no need for a middle man that has more voice than me or you.
Mangala Solaris
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
#18 - 2013-11-25 17:20:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Mangala Solaris
So if Devs are now acting like those time wasters in supermarkets taking surveys and spending all day to follow up on feedback, when will they develop the game?

Would you like the same from your real life elected officials? Spend all day kissing babies and as a result not (trying) to run a country?
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2013-11-25 17:25:59 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Cura Ursus
REDACTED.

Please post in English.


ISD Cura Ursus.
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#20 - 2013-11-25 17:27:01 UTC
The real question is why the OP displays such a huge amount of hatred.
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