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why do we perpetuate the backwards idea that our ships have crews?

Author
Renan Ruivo
Forcas armadas
Brave Collective
#101 - 2011-11-19 06:15:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Renan Ruivo
Nova Fox wrote:
Those are not windows they are sensor panels but they double up as a 'view' prot to a video screen correlated on the inside.

All ships in eve are built for non capsullers just the more recent ones are built with the capabilities in the first place instead of retrofitted. Every capsuller in the eve universe is represented by the players exception to the few named NPC ones that you cant seem to kill pernamently and are tougher than normal rats.

Capsuleer technology basically removes deparment heads and chain of commands which on real ships is a massive portion of its crew. So the only crew you have left are 'grunts' and 'expert grunts.'

Though automation technologies the pod does bring this doubles back into non capsulleer ships as well and those ships arent crewless ception to the infested ones.

Also somone has got to man the nanite pumps and tell each and every single pump what exactly they're fixing instead of slapping in glass stucturing isntead of a power conduit. The nanites in eve are pertty stupid in comparison to some of the VIs/AIs

As for all those saying they want to command the ship though a bridge needs to sit down and rethink thier posture.

When you pod jack into a ship, you become the ship. Every bit of damage the ship receives registers as pain. Warp induces a euphoria, you can potentially get motion sick from breakneck manuvers and your semi sub concious thoughts are transmitted to the crew, afterall you are thier master after god.

Luckily your training from concord on the behalf of your empire sponsorship gets you used to the idea of being the ship.


Hey, in my ship, i have a bridge and a bridge crew because i'm old school. I command and walk around the ship through a robotic clone of myself that i control from within the pod (Andromeda, i'm looking at you).

Sure though when things get rough i just relieve them all from their posts, disable the surrogate and pod-pilot the ship like everyone else.

The world is a community of idiots doing a series of things until it explodes and we all die.

Takseen
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#102 - 2011-11-19 08:22:30 UTC
Autonomous Monster wrote:


***For the piracy to pay for itself, the pirates are going to need to run many successful operations for every one the players blow up, so this doesn't help much. A quick estimate suggests I destroyed something in the region of 3.2 billion isk (...and was paid the princely sum of 24 million... I think I want a raise); how many ships do the Serp need to have out there to make that profitable? (And then- how large does the NPC economy have to be that the pirates can leech this much out of them easily and without crippling them? Shocked)


NPC pirates in Eve are a combination of
Pirates Who Don't Do Anything and Money Spiders . They're never gonna make that much sense.
Aldarica
Perkone
Caldari State
#103 - 2011-11-19 09:04:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Aldarica
Dyner wrote:
BTW: The human brain is simply not capable; nor will it EVER be capable (unless its size grows) to control a ship the size of anything larger than a Frigate

Uhh... human brain is so much more than your conscious mind. Your body is WAY more complicated than any space ship in EVE could ever be, yet your nervous system (both central and peripheral) has no problems controlling processes happening there every second. Besides, according to lore, capsuleer's capabilities are additionaly boosted beyound anything that ordinary people could even imagine.

Anyway. I know what lore says about this. But for as long as crew exists only in few lines of text burried in some chronicles I'll simply choose to think what I find more believable... and interesting: that we're flying super advanced and highly sophisticated crewless ships where all mechanical systems are directly connected to pod pilot's nervous system, literally working as extension of his organic body... something that he "feels" just as he can feel his arms, for example.

Cheap, expendable, inexperienced (average life span of PvP ships in EVE?), slow, fragile, and very likely unreliable human crews (rebellion, enyone?) just don't fit very well.

I don't have problem with classical setup pictured in Clear Skies either. Cloning? No big deal - just plant some next-gen cloning device size of implant into my head and that's it: no need to swim in pod goo ever again. Although I somehow doubt that my men, without such cloning implants, would be very happy to know that when ship goes boom I survive and they die. In fact, I would probably find myself jetissoned into the vacuum pretty soon after undocking Smile
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#104 - 2011-11-19 09:27:41 UTC
I think this is the single most immersion-breaking element missing between the lore and actual game mechanics.

1) according to lore, ships have crews

2) gameplay does include any interaction with these crews

In my opinion it would add some spice to have crew as mandatory ship element, to be treated like race-specific fuel. You would need to "hire" (buy from the market) a certain amount of crew capable of doing crew stuffs on your ship (Gallente crew for Gallente ships). These would be seeded by NPC corporations in their space, meaning that availability of crew is dependent on the part of Empire you are. Of course you could buy crew just for sales in other regions.

In addition to market price, hiring crew (loading them in your ship) would incur Employment costs, which would depend on your standings toward the original supplier, and your security status. So in low sec, people with neg status and better standings toward pirate corps would pay less Employment costs for local crews, and in hisec the other way around. Maybe some crew would not even board your ship.

Crew would blow up with your ship, adding crew deaths and mechanics to combat is probably not realistic resource-wise.

Better immersion, an ISK sink, new trade item and not much FiS resource overhead?

.

Ayame Tokugawa
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#105 - 2011-11-19 09:48:58 UTC
How about having maintenance robots? You don't need to feed or pay them and they do not complain.
Linda Shadowborn
Dark Steel Industries
#106 - 2011-11-19 17:29:51 UTC
Toshiroma McDiesel wrote:
To OP's question :

Because there will never be Brains without the Brawn's.


Brainships ftw :)

I always thought the Brainship series explained the whole human hooked up into ship and crew interaction very well. I sooo love the ship who searched, must have read it 10 times by now.
Wilhelm Riley
Doomheim
#107 - 2011-11-19 17:45:48 UTC
Linda Shadowborn wrote:
[quote=Toshiroma McDiesel]To OP's question :

Because there will never be Brains without the Brawn's.


Tell that to the Giant Brains in Last and First Men.

Russell Casey
Doomheim
#108 - 2011-11-19 17:45:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Russell Casey
No sane crew would think suicide ganking was a good idea.

Capsuleer: Fire on that Hulk!

Crew: Uh, we're in a 1.0 system, sir, CONCORD will kill us.

Capsuleer: No, CONCORD will kill you. I will fly away in my pod and collect my insurance while my buddy loots/salvages the wrecks.

Crew: **** you, sir. /Mutiny.
Hauling Hal
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#109 - 2011-11-19 18:34:34 UTC
Morganta wrote:
Who is the DEV who first floated the idea that our ships are crewed?

it makes no sense
every facet of our ship's operations is governed by our skills, not the crew's skills
the podster operates all the weapons, support and defensive systems

lets imagine for a moment that you are a lowly yeoman on a calradi BC and you need to so see the captain about something

do you go to a little room with a pod in the center of it and talk to a speaker in a console?
is it like John Carpenter's Dark Star where we open a little hatch and talk to the frozen body of our captain?

do you see that this makes no sense?
if theres dozens if not hundreds of people running around my ship like its some kind of office building, then why am I sitting in a bucket of goo isolated from, but lording over them like some sort of clone Svengali

really, how was it decided that ships have crews?


Didn't you get the memo, it's a game? There isn't actually any crew at all. In fact, there aren't even any ships, it's just a graphical representation on your screen.

Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#110 - 2011-11-19 18:45:02 UTC
I demand that when I turn on my armor repairer a bunch of dudes in space suits dragging hoses come out of hatches on my ship and start spraying space concrete onto the damaged bits.

Also damage control modules are just a bunch of guys with fire extinguishers.
JC Anderson
RED ROSE THORN
#111 - 2011-11-19 18:59:36 UTC  |  Edited by: JC Anderson
Jovians walked up to the object and made a quick inspection of it.

"This is a capsule," Anu said to the Caldari. "It is used to control a ship. With it a ship as big as this one can be controlled with only a handful of crew and smaller ships, like your frigates, can even be controlled by a single person."
"How is this possible?" Ouriye asked. He was obviously skeptical, even if he didn't seem as surprised by what Anu said as the other Caldari.
Klandi
Consortium of stella Technologies
#112 - 2011-11-19 19:13:24 UTC
Yep - absolutely reediculous

Almost as silly as having to wait to be towed into a station

I am aware of my own ignorance and have checked my emotional quotient - thanks for asking

Jonni Favorite
Militant Industrialists LLC
Militant Consortium
#113 - 2011-11-19 20:07:21 UTC
Roime wrote:
I think this is the single most immersion-breaking element missing between the lore and actual game mechanics.

1) according to lore, ships have crews

2) gameplay does include any interaction with these crews

In my opinion it would add some spice to have crew as mandatory ship element, to be treated like race-specific fuel. You would need to "hire" (buy from the market) a certain amount of crew capable of doing crew stuffs on your ship (Gallente crew for Gallente ships). These would be seeded by NPC corporations in their space, meaning that availability of crew is dependent on the part of Empire you are. Of course you could buy crew just for sales in other regions.

In addition to market price, hiring crew (loading them in your ship) would incur Employment costs, which would depend on your standings toward the original supplier, and your security status. So in low sec, people with neg status and better standings toward pirate corps would pay less Employment costs for local crews, and in hisec the other way around. Maybe some crew would not even board your ship.

Crew would blow up with your ship, adding crew deaths and mechanics to combat is probably not realistic resource-wise.

Better immersion, an ISK sink, new trade item and not much FiS resource overhead?

Yes but I would make recruitment an automatic feature, between my toons I have dozens of ships, buying and fitting crew would be micromanagement hell..
Maxpie
MUSE LLP
#114 - 2011-11-19 20:40:00 UTC
This thread got me thinking about crew. Apparently I have thousands upon thousands of crewmembers in probably a hundred ships who have not even undocked in a year. Some of them are sitting in systems I have not even visited in years. What am I paying these people for? Actually, I don't seem to be paying them - how do they support themselves? Meanwhile, the poor crew in a select few ships never get a break.

No good deed goes unpunished

Autonomous Monster
Paradox Interstellar
#115 - 2011-11-19 20:49:16 UTC
Maxpie wrote:
This thread got me thinking about crew. Apparently I have thousands upon thousands of crewmembers in probably a hundred ships who have not even undocked in a year. Some of them are sitting in systems I have not even visited in years. What am I paying these people for? Actually, I don't seem to be paying them - how do they support themselves? Meanwhile, the poor crew in a select few ships never get a break.


Hey, I've got 30 Exotic Dancers sitting in a hanger in Mormoen. ...as well as 20 Homeless, 40 Janitors, 10 Marines, 90 Militants and 10 Tourists.

What the hell have they been up to in there for the past four years? Shocked
Morganta
The Greater Goon
#116 - 2011-11-19 21:17:25 UTC
Autonomous Monster wrote:
Maxpie wrote:
This thread got me thinking about crew. Apparently I have thousands upon thousands of crewmembers in probably a hundred ships who have not even undocked in a year. Some of them are sitting in systems I have not even visited in years. What am I paying these people for? Actually, I don't seem to be paying them - how do they support themselves? Meanwhile, the poor crew in a select few ships never get a break.


Hey, I've got 30 Exotic Dancers sitting in a hanger in Mormoen. ...as well as 20 Homeless, 40 Janitors, 10 Marines, 90 Militants and 10 Tourists.

What the hell have they been up to in there for the past four years? Shocked


one **** of a raging party, thats what
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#117 - 2011-11-19 21:35:56 UTC
Linda Shadowborn wrote:
Toshiroma McDiesel wrote:
To OP's question :

Because there will never be Brains without the Brawn's.


Brainships ftw :)

I always thought the Brainship series explained the whole human hooked up into ship and crew interaction very well. I sooo love the ship who searched, must have read it 10 times by now.


M.A.X. anyone ?
Logan LaMort
Screaming Hayabusa
#118 - 2011-11-19 22:26:04 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
I demand that when I turn on my armor repairer a bunch of dudes in space suits dragging hoses come out of hatches on my ship and start spraying space concrete onto the damaged bits.

Also damage control modules are just a bunch of guys with fire extinguishers.


Now that's a ship repair animation I want to see!

At least on Minnie ships anyway.
Morganta
The Greater Goon
#119 - 2011-11-19 22:27:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Morganta
Logan LaMort wrote:
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
I demand that when I turn on my armor repairer a bunch of dudes in space suits dragging hoses come out of hatches on my ship and start spraying space concrete onto the damaged bits.

Also damage control modules are just a bunch of guys with fire extinguishers.


Now that's a ship repair animation I want to see!

At least on Minnie ships anyway.


It's not pretty...remember Richard Pryor?
Shivus Tao
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#120 - 2011-11-19 22:37:21 UTC
Roime wrote:
I think this is the single most immersion-breaking element missing between the lore and actual game mechanics.

1) according to lore, ships have crews

2) gameplay does include any interaction with these crews

In my opinion it would add some spice to have crew as mandatory ship element, to be treated like race-specific fuel. You would need to "hire" (buy from the market) a certain amount of crew capable of doing crew stuffs on your ship (Gallente crew for Gallente ships). These would be seeded by NPC corporations in their space, meaning that availability of crew is dependent on the part of Empire you are. Of course you could buy crew just for sales in other regions.

In addition to market price, hiring crew (loading them in your ship) would incur Employment costs, which would depend on your standings toward the original supplier, and your security status. So in low sec, people with neg status and better standings toward pirate corps would pay less Employment costs for local crews, and in hisec the other way around. Maybe some crew would not even board your ship.

Crew would blow up with your ship, adding crew deaths and mechanics to combat is probably not realistic resource-wise.

Better immersion, an ISK sink, new trade item and not much FiS resource overhead?


Why would we interract with our crews? We are living gods, they are mere mortals.