These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Does WAR make players leave Eve?

First post First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Princess Bride
SharkNado
#541 - 2013-11-15 15:03:11 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:

jsut shut up dude. So whay not make wahteve activity YOU liek to do to cost 200 BILLIOn isk per hour to run? Why not that?

I would be very very happy if that happened.


lol

You sound flustered, dude. Take a deep breath, calm down for a second, and formulate a legible response.

http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#542 - 2013-11-15 15:03:18 UTC  |  Edited by: J'Poll
Princess Bride wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
Princess Bride wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:

The same way YOU think that you deserve to push the game more to the way YOU want.


I love how the posters in this thread are constantly declaring what _I_ think and what _I_ want.

But anyway, of course I deserve to push the game in the direction I want it to go. That's how the marketplace of ideas works. I push for my idea, you push for yours. Player input is part of what makes Eve great. As for whether my view is the minority or majority view, who cares? If it matters, then when exactly does the popular vote on this issue take place?



False equivalence bullcrap lol. ideas (like people) are inherently unequal. Some great, some terrible, most falling somewhere in between.

Ideas that go counter to what EVE is, what has made EVE great for hundreds of thousands of people and that has allowed EVE to survive whole other games die are BAD ideas. Good ideas are the ones that responsibly serve the game, it's community and it's maker (CCP) AS A WHOLE.

This isn't burger king and no you can't just have it your way.


When CCP increased wardecs from min 2 mil to min 50 mil, was that a bad idea? If they increased wardecs from 50 mil to 100 mil min, would that be a bad idea? Answer and explain your reasoning.


Yes, because there is no NEED for it because the system they use now is working as intended.

They changed it from 2mil to 50mil because the old system was not working as intended. You could dec a 1 man corp for the same price as a 2000 man corp, which is weird.

And if you really like your utterly ******** idea...go, post in F&I

See what happens with it, I can tell you the outcome. CCP will print it out and pass it through the office and will laugh at it.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Princess Bride
SharkNado
#543 - 2013-11-15 15:11:07 UTC
J'Poll wrote:

Yes, because there is no NEED for it because the system they use now is working as intended.

They changed it from 2mil to 50mil because the old system was not working as intended. You could dec a 1 man corp for the same price as a 2000 man corp, which is weird.

And if you really like your utterly ******** idea...go, post in F&I

See what happens with it, I can tell you the outcome. CCP will print it out and pass it through the office and will laugh at it.


You seem to know a lot about what other people think. You know what I think. You know what every other player thinks. You know what CCP thinks.

Let's both go post our ideas in F&I.

I'll post that in my opinion, wardecs should cost a bit more.

You post your opinion that anyone who complains should be perma-banned, that high sec and low sec should be removed, and the entire game should be null sec.

Then we'll ask whose ideas got the biggest laughs around the water cooler at CCP.

http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#544 - 2013-11-15 15:16:19 UTC
Princess Bride wrote:
J'Poll wrote:

Yes, because there is no NEED for it because the system they use now is working as intended.

They changed it from 2mil to 50mil because the old system was not working as intended. You could dec a 1 man corp for the same price as a 2000 man corp, which is weird.

And if you really like your utterly ******** idea...go, post in F&I

See what happens with it, I can tell you the outcome. CCP will print it out and pass it through the office and will laugh at it.


You seem to know a lot about what other people think. You know what I think. You know what every other player thinks. You know what CCP thinks.

Let's both go post our ideas in F&I.

I'll post that in my opinion, wardecs should cost a bit more.

You post your opinion that anyone who complains should be perma-banned, that high sec and low sec should be removed, and the entire game should be null sec.

Then we'll ask whose ideas got the biggest laughs around the water cooler at CCP.


I'm not against complains.

I'm against the people who whine at CCP to change the game to suit them so that they can play in the way they want to (which in 99.99% of the cases are carebears who want risk free zones).

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Princess Bride
SharkNado
#545 - 2013-11-15 15:32:11 UTC
J'Poll wrote:
Princess Bride wrote:

You post your opinion that anyone who complains should be perma-banned, that high sec and low sec should be removed, and the entire game should be null sec.

Then we'll ask whose ideas got the biggest laughs around the water cooler at CCP.


I'm not against complains.


J'Poll wrote:
IMO CCP should perma ban anybody who ever complains about EVE or any of the game mechanics from ever play it again


Which you said here in this very thread.

So, which is it? Make up your mind.

http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#546 - 2013-11-15 15:37:23 UTC
Princess Bride wrote:
J'Poll wrote:
Princess Bride wrote:

You post your opinion that anyone who complains should be perma-banned, that high sec and low sec should be removed, and the entire game should be null sec.

Then we'll ask whose ideas got the biggest laughs around the water cooler at CCP.


I'm not against complains.


J'Poll wrote:
IMO CCP should perma ban anybody who ever complains about EVE or any of the game mechanics from ever play it again


Which you said here in this very thread.

So, which is it? Make up your mind.


And again, partially quoting because if you fully qouted you wouldn't have a case.

And the first post, even heard about posting ON TOPIC, so related to the topic.

But please, keep posting, me and my friends are having a laugh about you.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Good Posting
Doomheim
#547 - 2013-11-15 15:59:56 UTC
What happened to the old J'Poll that always was giving good advices and helping new and old players? Now he's insulting back and forth and taking troll threads too seriously. Is your account under new management? Bitter vet status reached? No offense intended, of course.
Princess Bride
SharkNado
#548 - 2013-11-15 16:03:57 UTC
Good Posting wrote:
What happened to the old J'Poll that always was giving good advices and helping new and old players? Now he's insulting back and forth and taking troll threads too seriously. Is your account under new management? Bitter vet status reached? No offense intended, of course.


J'Poll wrote:

Im not a leet pvp player, hell in the last 1.5 years I havent undocked.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3868567#post3868567
IMO CCP should perma ban anybody who ever complains about EVE or any of the game mechanics from ever play it again
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3861944#post3861944


Wow, he used to be different?

http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#549 - 2013-11-15 16:59:50 UTC  |  Edited by: J'Poll
Good Posting wrote:
What happened to the old J'Poll that always was giving good advices and helping new and old players? Now he's insulting back and forth and taking troll threads too seriously. Is your account under new management? Bitter vet status reached? No offense intended, of course.


That side of me is reserved for people who I think that are worth my time to help. The people in this thread arent on that list.

If OP wouldnt have come across as whining how EVE is bad and wardecs are ruining the game (both which are false) but came to the forums for advice on how to deal with wardecs, what options he has and how to minimize risk. Sure, more then happy to help him. If all you can do is whine about a game mechanic that is working as it should, with plenty of options for you to minimize the risk you dont like. Why would I spent my time to try to help you.

To your questions:

Nope and nope.

Also, happy that you liked my posts. I still hang in NCQA to answer any question that arrises there, but lately there is less activity in NCQA. So I came to GD to alugh at the trolls and more at the whiners.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#550 - 2013-11-15 17:05:19 UTC
Princess Bride wrote:
Good Posting wrote:
What happened to the old J'Poll that always was giving good advices and helping new and old players? Now he's insulting back and forth and taking troll threads too seriously. Is your account under new management? Bitter vet status reached? No offense intended, of course.


J'Poll wrote:

Im not a leet pvp player, hell in the last 1.5 years I havent undocked.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3868567#post3868567
IMO CCP should perma ban anybody who ever complains about EVE or any of the game mechanics from ever play it again
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3861944#post3861944


Wow, he used to be different?


Yes. Unlike you.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Rhatar Khurin
Doomheim
#551 - 2013-11-15 17:22:28 UTC
As the CEO of a small corp that recently got wardecced i can safely say that it has not had any negative effects on our enjoyment of EVE.
If anything it has made us ever more vigilant and on the ball.

Oh and it would be even more fun if the peeps that 'decced us even remotely shared the same timezone.
Pew Terror
All of it
#552 - 2013-11-15 17:33:52 UTC
This question gets asked so much and is so easily solved that i decided to make my famous guide '11 successful ways of how top carebears avoid pvp' available to the public.
For the small price of 79,999,999.99 ISK sent to this character it can be yours today!
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#553 - 2013-11-15 17:49:01 UTC
K. I mean I'm still a novice at this whole wardec thing, but seriously... 2.4 billion a year to maintain one is pretty serious scratch. I'm a casual player and as such I don't accumulate that kind of cheddar all that quickly. In order for me to accumulate this kind of money in order to maintain a vendetta I'd have to do some pretty hard work on a daily basis to keep it up. Not saying that this isn't feasible, for we all know it is, but to do so requires some dedication, or at least you know... more than one person in your corporation.
As a solo corp CEO/Owner/Operator/misfit/crazy guy living under the park bench. I'm really not for the idea of making wars more expensive. I mean what if someone takes a deuce in MY sandbox? Should I be driven to bankruptcy in order to drag my arse on his best rug, to draw moustaches on the pictures of his wife, to take candid pictures of his eldest whilst they shower from the comfort of the tree outside the bathroom window? NO! By making wardecs more difficult, more expensive you don't help the n00bz, you certainly don't help me... but by golly you do help those who are spacerich and can simply write off these expenses as a daily cost of living.
Speaking of Vendetta's... I recall said CCP dude mentioning that "all player entities" should be subject to war declarations... Is it possible that perhaps in the future we see individual players being considered as "player entities"? I personally would love to see a system of Vendetta, where a single player may declare a war upon another single player for transgressions they may or may not have committed, regardless of corporate or alliance affiliation. A "have at thee" that may not be dodged, avoided, or obfuscated via corp or alliance hopping.

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#554 - 2013-11-15 17:52:29 UTC
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
K. I mean I'm still a novice at this whole wardec thing, but seriously... 2.4 billion a year to maintain one is pretty serious scratch. I'm a casual player and as such I don't accumulate that kind of cheddar all that quickly. In order for me to accumulate this kind of money in order to maintain a vendetta I'd have to do some pretty hard work on a daily basis to keep it up. Not saying that this isn't feasible, for we all know it is, but to do so requires some dedication, or at least you know... more than one person in your corporation.
As a solo corp CEO/Owner/Operator/misfit/crazy guy living under the park bench. I'm really not for the idea of making wars more expensive. I mean what if someone takes a deuce in MY sandbox? Should I be driven to bankruptcy in order to drag my arse on his best rug, to draw moustaches on the pictures of his wife, to take candid pictures of his eldest whilst they shower from the comfort of the tree outside the bathroom window? NO! By making wardecs more difficult, more expensive you don't help the n00bz, you certainly don't help me... but by golly you do help those who are spacerich and can simply write off these expenses as a daily cost of living.
Speaking of Vendetta's... I recall said CCP dude mentioning that "all player entities" should be subject to war declarations... Is it possible that perhaps in the future we see individual players being considered as "player entities"? I personally would love to see a system of Vendetta, where a single player may declare a war upon another single player for transgressions they may or may not have committed, regardless of corporate or alliance affiliation. A "have at thee" that may not be dodged, avoided, or obfuscated via corp or alliance hopping.


I hope they do this...I really do.

No more hiding in NPC corps and no ways to fight the person....

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Good Posting
Doomheim
#555 - 2013-11-15 18:42:23 UTC
J'Poll wrote:
Good Posting wrote:
What happened to the old J'Poll that always was giving good advices and helping new and old players? Now he's insulting back and forth and taking troll threads too seriously. Is your account under new management? Bitter vet status reached? No offense intended, of course.


That side of me is reserved for people who I think that are worth my time to help. The people in this thread arent on that list.

If OP wouldnt have come across as whining how EVE is bad and wardecs are ruining the game (both which are false) but came to the forums for advice on how to deal with wardecs, what options he has and how to minimize risk. Sure, more then happy to help him. If all you can do is whine about a game mechanic that is working as it should, with plenty of options for you to minimize the risk you dont like. Why would I spent my time to try to help you.

To your questions:

Nope and nope.

Also, happy that you liked my posts. I still hang in NCQA to answer any question that arrises there, but lately there is less activity in NCQA. So I came to GD to alugh at the trolls and more at the whiners.



All right, i understand your point of view. Fly safe J'
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#556 - 2013-11-16 00:38:40 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
I have removed some rule breaking posts and those quoting them. As always I let some edge cases stay.
Please people, keep it on topic and above all civil!

The rules:
4. Personal attacks are prohibited.

Commonly known as flaming, personal attacks are posts that are designed to personally berate or insult another forum user. Posts of this nature are not beneficial to the community spirit that CCP promote and as such they will not be tolerated.

ISD Ezwal Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Heavypredator Singh
TEMPLAR.
The Initiative.
#557 - 2013-11-16 12:31:08 UTC
If You don't want to be in war don't join player corp. Not being in war will not make You safe.

People making/joining corps should be able to defend it - if You can't You don't deserve to have a corp.

If You want to play safe this is not the game for You - this is not safe game. Play some single player game with easy option instead.

This game is already safe enough for people who don't want to pvp. I have friends who don't leave hisec, don't have any pvp encounters etc. For me hisec is boring - like playing single player game - there is no challenge.

Hisec should be only for noobs and when they are mature enough they should be pushed to the low/null sec world where You need to interact with other pople.

Make hisec a state in time not a teritory :) This is so stupid when people are afraid to go to low/null sec.

Hisec is only teaching some people that they can play it like single player game. It is not teaching people to be smart and play the sandbox. They play missions/mining that are game created content, not the player created content.

I remember small pirates game - You got small ship and You started on noob waters. But noob waters were allowed to be attacked at any time by other faction players. What happened then? Older players were defending noobs - WITH noobs. Noobs were part of faction fighting for their teritory with older players - bonding and learning.

If You can do this in eve, make noobs bond with older players to protect their teritory and themselves it would be more fun. Don't teach them running missions and mining - this is making them into pussies that are afraid to move trough the world. More player interaction at begining of the game would be great. Now when You start You are alone in what it seems empty space without interaction from other players.
Princess Bride
SharkNado
#558 - 2013-11-16 17:14:23 UTC
J'Poll wrote:
Princess Bride wrote:
Good Posting wrote:
What happened to the old J'Poll that always was giving good advices and helping new and old players? Now he's insulting back and forth and taking troll threads too seriously. Is your account under new management? Bitter vet status reached? No offense intended, of course.


J'Poll wrote:

Im not a leet pvp player, hell in the last 1.5 years I havent undocked.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3868567#post3868567
IMO CCP should perma ban anybody who ever complains about EVE or any of the game mechanics from ever play it again
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3861944#post3861944


Wow, he used to be different?


Yes. Unlike you.


You don't know me.

http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#559 - 2013-11-16 17:25:23 UTC
Heavypredator Singh wrote:
If You don't want to be in war don't join player corp. Not being in war will not make You safe.

People making/joining corps should be able to defend it - if You can't You don't deserve to have a corp.

If You want to play safe this is not the game for You - this is not safe game. Play some single player game with easy option instead.

This game is already safe enough for people who don't want to pvp. I have friends who don't leave hisec, don't have any pvp encounters etc. For me hisec is boring - like playing single player game - there is no challenge.

Hisec should be only for noobs and when they are mature enough they should be pushed to the low/null sec world where You need to interact with other pople.

Make hisec a state in time not a teritory :) This is so stupid when people are afraid to go to low/null sec.

Hisec is only teaching some people that they can play it like single player game. It is not teaching people to be smart and play the sandbox. They play missions/mining that are game created content, not the player created content.

I remember small pirates game - You got small ship and You started on noob waters. But noob waters were allowed to be attacked at any time by other faction players. What happened then? Older players were defending noobs - WITH noobs. Noobs were part of faction fighting for their teritory with older players - bonding and learning.

If You can do this in eve, make noobs bond with older players to protect their teritory and themselves it would be more fun. Don't teach them running missions and mining - this is making them into pussies that are afraid to move trough the world.More player interaction at begining of the game would be great. Now when You start You are alone in what it seems empty space without interaction from other players.


Underlined the important parts that are great

Bold and underlined, that isn't just great, it's perfect and the truth.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Chin MonWang
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#560 - 2013-11-16 19:13:17 UTC
This thread : "Does WAR make players leave EVE? "

Imo WAR does absolutely NOT make players leave!...even to the contrary, war should make it adventurous for all...& adventure is what most new players made decide to join-up. So, WAR should be an important entertaining asset of the great possibilities that EVE can (& should ) offer to us.

But in practice, it often works out the false way, I give an example that happened to me:

Some time ago I joined a corp, and when that corp received a war-dec I thought by myself: "no the fun starts. at last!" and I went attacking the other corp...& a new player also part of my corp joint me enthousiastically(!) ....so we both went in for our first fight with the other corp in high-sec....& though we were out-numbered and finally lost that fight we both stated it was real entertaining, since we both liked it! Was real fun!

But, what happened next: the corp "blaming the new player for fighting along side me" & I was more or less told "that I was not allowed to search for fights...and certainly not allowed to loose any expensive ships (my own ships!)...(since such would attract other corps to wardecs) & would also prolong the current wardec. Instead I was told to fly cheap frigates as for the duration of the wardec(???????)...so to make sure that the other corp would not benefit from any looting???!?

Next I send kind message to corp ceo (were in fact all kind people) saying I had to quit the corp because WAR was my main reason to play EVE.

So, that did not work out well...& for me it meant: "back to the impossible fights at the heavily (unfair) ganked low-sec gate entries.

In my opinion WAR is: both opponents having the possibility to fire missiles and/or turrets (& laying out tactics & strategics)...that is WAR. Any attacker should normally bear in mind that if he goes shooting at another player...that the attacked player WOULD FIGHT/SHOOT back...that is what makes WAR entertaining...the RISKS involved for BOTH.

But in practice EVE we see rules & circumstances are being succesfully bend so that for gangs there iare no risks involved anymore whatsoever: they win & know so beforehand due to the scannings, out-numberings, consulting EVEboard for player stats, Killboard-stats, using ECM, fully crippling down the other player in low sec when entering...IMO that is NOT WAR (...since there obviously is no risk involved for the other party).

So, IMO WAR is essential for real good entertainment...but please try to make it REAL WAR...i.e. risks involved for both parties...such wouild be real entertaining for all.