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A question to Erotica 1, James 315 and co: do you even l̶i̶f̶t̶ PvP?
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Brusanan
Sons of Seyllin
Pirate Lords of War
#21 - 2013-11-11 10:15:21 UTC
Eduard Khil XD wrote:
I'm listening to the press conference ^^
That depends on your definition of PvP, Varius Xeral.

For example, if you begin a chess match with the same number of pieces and beat a good player, does that not show you are better at chess than if your opponent had a handicap?

Everyone starts with the same pieces in Eve too. Everyone starts with a noobship and 5k ISK in their wallet.

But seriously, that's a terrible analogy. Eve isn't a zero-sum game and the only win conditions are goals set by the players themselves.
Lady Areola Fappington
#22 - 2013-11-11 11:06:29 UTC
JC Anderson wrote:
Ankblahblah however you spelled her name was downright anti pvp uber carebear. Yet she did win a csm seat with the second highest vote count of all candidates...

Then she started throwing spoons at other csm.



SpoonGate BestGate IMHO. Didn't she get kicked off CSM for divulging NDA stuff? Just goes to show how out of bounds carebears behave, I guess.

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#23 - 2013-11-11 11:26:29 UTC
I have a fair number of solo kills of PVP ships. I'd have more if it were not for the pesky tendency of lowsec folks to escalate.

"I'm losing this 1v1, better call in four mates so I don't lose my Astarte to a solo opponent."

Them calling in friends isn't 'bad sportsmanship'. It's good tactics, and it's caused me a fair few losses.

Likewise in my New Order operations, picking a soft target is simply good tactics, and they advance the strategic objectives of the NO. Low losses, high impact - that is not 'bad PVP', it's good PVP.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com
Pak Narhoo
Splinter Foundation
#24 - 2013-11-11 11:28:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Pak Narhoo
ugh, wrong thread, cary on, cary on. /o\
Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations
#25 - 2013-11-11 11:30:28 UTC
Let's get back to the OP's original post, which was nicely written and asks good questions. Can I get everyone on this thread to join me for a discussion of the matter soon? I think we can have a good chat on comms and bond some.

See Bio for isk doubling rules. If you didn't read bio, chances are you funded those who did.
Mhax Arthie
Doomheim
#26 - 2013-11-11 11:36:29 UTC
Erotica 1 wrote:

1. I am a terrible pilot and lose ships all the time. Look at my killboard. Note my terrible fits and some of the locations, far from Jita.
...

Hell NO! As much as I love you I cannot accept intruders in our brave Teribad Shitfit Flying Circus club. Your not even close to be terrible nor have a clue what that means. So please, just stay out of this!
JC Anderson
RED ROSE THORN
#27 - 2013-11-11 11:40:44 UTC
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
JC Anderson wrote:
Ankblahblah however you spelled her name was downright anti pvp uber carebear. Yet she did win a csm seat with the second highest vote count of all candidates...

Then she started throwing spoons at other csm.



SpoonGate BestGate IMHO. Didn't she get kicked off CSM for divulging NDA stuff? Just goes to show how out of bounds carebears behave, I guess.


Yepyep. :/

And then she went and got involved in real world politics as an elected official.

No I'm not joking. O.O
Lady Areola Fappington
#28 - 2013-11-11 11:44:11 UTC
JC Anderson wrote:
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
JC Anderson wrote:
Ankblahblah however you spelled her name was downright anti pvp uber carebear. Yet she did win a csm seat with the second highest vote count of all candidates...

Then she started throwing spoons at other csm.



SpoonGate BestGate IMHO. Didn't she get kicked off CSM for divulging NDA stuff? Just goes to show how out of bounds carebears behave, I guess.


Yepyep. :/

And then she went and got involved in real world politics as an elected official.

No I'm not joking. O.O



Carebears, man...and us evil bad scammers, griefers, gankers, and legitimate ISK doublers are supposed to be bad guys....

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#29 - 2013-11-11 11:44:34 UTC
JC Anderson wrote:
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
JC Anderson wrote:
Ankblahblah however you spelled her name was downright anti pvp uber carebear. Yet she did win a csm seat with the second highest vote count of all candidates...

Then she started throwing spoons at other csm.



SpoonGate BestGate IMHO. Didn't she get kicked off CSM for divulging NDA stuff? Just goes to show how out of bounds carebears behave, I guess.


Yepyep. :/

And then she went and got involved in real world politics as an elected official.

No I'm not joking. O.O


Oh, dear...

Link, if you have one?

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
JC Anderson
RED ROSE THORN
#30 - 2013-11-11 11:51:07 UTC  |  Edited by: JC Anderson
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
JC Anderson wrote:
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
JC Anderson wrote:
Ankblahblah however you spelled her name was downright anti pvp uber carebear. Yet she did win a csm seat with the second highest vote count of all candidates...

Then she started throwing spoons at other csm.



SpoonGate BestGate IMHO. Didn't she get kicked off CSM for divulging NDA stuff? Just goes to show how out of bounds carebears behave, I guess.


Yepyep. :/

And then she went and got involved in real world politics as an elected official.

No I'm not joking. O.O


Oh, dear...

Link, if you have one?


Her real life campaign video for the Piratenpartij.

I do know she actually won a seat in that election. But I have no idea what she is actually saying in the video itself. ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sZXB8HtLBo

And her CSM Campaign video where she also won a seat.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJI7bUtKMdg

She was rabidly anti PVP (Aside from Faction Warfare) and even more-so against pirates. She actually went as far as to say all pirates in EVE should be locked up in real life.

Then she won a CSM spot.. Go figure.... With the 2nd highest amount of votes between all candidates... Was quite strange. Then she ended up being crazy with a side of spoons and topped with an NDA violation.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#31 - 2013-11-11 11:53:29 UTC
JC Anderson wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
JC Anderson wrote:
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
JC Anderson wrote:
Ankblahblah however you spelled her name was downright anti pvp uber carebear. Yet she did win a csm seat with the second highest vote count of all candidates...

Then she started throwing spoons at other csm.



SpoonGate BestGate IMHO. Didn't she get kicked off CSM for divulging NDA stuff? Just goes to show how out of bounds carebears behave, I guess.


Yepyep. :/

And then she went and got involved in real world politics as an elected official.

No I'm not joking. O.O


Oh, dear...

Link, if you have one?


Her real life campaign video for the Piratenpartij.

I do know she actually won a seat in that election. But I have no idea what she is actually saying in the video itself. ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sZXB8HtLBo

And her CSM Campaign video where she also won a seat.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJI7bUtKMdg

She was rabidly anti PVP (Aside from Faction Warfare) and even more-so against pirates. She actually went as far as to say all pirates in EVE should be locked up in real life.

Then she won a CSM spot.. Go figure.... With the 2nd highest amount of votes between all candidates... Was quite strange. Then she ended up being crazy.



Aaaaaand /brain.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
JC Anderson
RED ROSE THORN
#32 - 2013-11-11 11:56:23 UTC  |  Edited by: JC Anderson
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:


Aaaaaand /brain.


Really the reason why she won and by such a margin was because she went out and spammed and mass mailed every single player in all the best hi sec mission and mining spots.

She was able to get a whole bunch of people to vote for her that normally wouldn't even bother voting in the CSM elections.
Mhax Arthie
Doomheim
#33 - 2013-11-11 12:27:46 UTC
JC Anderson wrote:


Her real life campaign video for the Piratenpartij.

I do know she actually won a seat in that election. But I have no idea what she is actually saying in the video itself. ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sZXB8HtLBo

And her CSM Campaign video where she also won a seat.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJI7bUtKMdg

She was rabidly anti PVP (Aside from Faction Warfare) and even more-so against pirates. She actually went as far as to say all pirates in EVE should be locked up in real life.

Then she won a CSM spot.. Go figure.... With the 2nd highest amount of votes between all candidates... Was quite strange. Then she ended up being crazy with a side of spoons and topped with an NDA violation.

This was an interesting read.

So let me get this straight because I have the feeling that something is missing in this picture. Eva was a CSM member who, quote: "She actually went as far as to say all pirates in EVE should be locked up in real life.".

And then she run for a seat as a candidate from Piratenpartij which is the political arm of thepiratebay, the homeland of the internet pirates. And she also work at a game development company. I'm sober, so my brain hurts.. what's wrong in this picture, what I'm missing here?
JC Anderson
RED ROSE THORN
#34 - 2013-11-11 12:31:45 UTC  |  Edited by: JC Anderson
Mhax Arthie wrote:
JC Anderson wrote:


Her real life campaign video for the Piratenpartij.

I do know she actually won a seat in that election. But I have no idea what she is actually saying in the video itself. ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sZXB8HtLBo

And her CSM Campaign video where she also won a seat.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJI7bUtKMdg

She was rabidly anti PVP (Aside from Faction Warfare) and even more-so against pirates. She actually went as far as to say all pirates in EVE should be locked up in real life.

Then she won a CSM spot.. Go figure.... With the 2nd highest amount of votes between all candidates... Was quite strange. Then she ended up being crazy with a side of spoons and topped with an NDA violation.

This was an interesting read.

So let me get this straight because I have the feeling that something is missing in this picture. Eva was a CSM member who, quote: "She actually went as far as to say all pirates in EVE should be locked up in real life.".

And then she run for a seat as a candidate from Piratenpartij which is the political arm of thepiratebay, the homeland of the internet pirates. And she also work at a game development company. I'm sober, so my brain hurts.. what's wrong in this picture, what I'm missing here?


Pretty much everything is wrong with it. ;)

Though her affiliation with the Piratenpartij supposedly didn't start until after she had been booted from the CSM. Regardless, there is some humor to it all when you consider both factors.

She made it perfectly clear and directly used a reference to call pirates in EVE, parasites in real life. To be exact, she said to lock them up and went on to express how she felt they likely had real life mental disorders. :P Her biggest peeve was being able to be killed in hi sec. She wanted it to be impossible to successfully do it, whether by suicide ganking or any other means.

The big surprise.... For me at least. Was that she actually won a CSM seat when she had said so many things via posts, or in-game that made her seem like she was the one with some serious mental issues. It was all quite strange.

As a side note, she gained the title Queen of Spoons because she threw a big metal spoon at another CSM member in anger across the table during the summit.
admiral root
Red Galaxy
#35 - 2013-11-11 12:35:42 UTC  |  Edited by: admiral root
Eduard Khil XD wrote:
Do you often PvP where there is a risk of you losing? And if not, can what you do really be called PvP if there is only one side to the engagement?


I regularly saw Erotica flying around in Fountain during the recent war there. I sent some DPS his way and he very kindly sent double back to me.

No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#36 - 2013-11-11 12:40:02 UTC
Ryhss wrote:
No, this new order does not pvp. They are spineless cowards picking on defenseless ships(drones don't count)


Do they attack other players?
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#37 - 2013-11-11 12:46:47 UTC
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:

If we must, think back to the days of high piracy. Pirates and privateers didn't attack military ships. They went after lightly armed traders for the precise reason we do....they can't fight back.


Wrong, wrong, wrong.

They went after them to disrupt trade and ruin their economies. How well armed they were was irrelevant.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#38 - 2013-11-11 12:50:46 UTC
Eduard Khil XD wrote:
Hi. I'd like to start this post by saying I'm a big fan of James 315's writing, the work he does, and the concepts he presents.
I don't know much about Erotica or if he writes well, so I'll reserve my judgement about him.

However, I have a question for Erotica, James 315 and hisec scammers/gankers in general:

Do you often PvP where there is a risk of you losing? And if not, can what you do really be called PvP if there is only one side to the engagement?

Allow me to elaborate. Two fleets meet in a situation where they can engage freely.
Battle commences, FCs make their plays, skill, strategy and other factors decide the winner— the fight is wrapped up.
Every time you engage, you're putting your own assets and time on the line, as are your opponents.
Who the enemy are is totally transparent. Finding their staging system is usually no problem—you can often attack said group at your leisure, or even follow them around if you hold a grudge.

Now enter the world of hisec ganking and scamming. There is no way to hold a grudge or retaliate against an alt that does not undock in ships that are significantly valuable, and the way most scammers behave, no way to scam them back.

Now, before you call me a supporter of risk free PvE or hisec, I'm not.
In fact, EVE might be a better game if they just removed hisec altogether v0v.
Risk free PvE income that can be used in PvP is imbalanced.

You'd probobly agree that when players do these kind of activities there is minimal risk of loss to them. There's no point in attacking their gank catalyst, and no way to find out their main.

Why should CCP work to preserve this kind of playstyle?
If you are not in a conflict where your enemy can retaliate, why do you find it fun?
Should you be allowed to perform any activity in EVE without repercussions/consequences?
Why should you be allowed to use any method for scamming if you are completely detached from your PvP main?


According to the killboards, you don't actually PVP at all.


.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#39 - 2013-11-11 12:54:04 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:

If we must, think back to the days of high piracy. Pirates and privateers didn't attack military ships. They went after lightly armed traders for the precise reason we do....they can't fight back.


Wrong, wrong, wrong.

They went after them to disrupt trade and ruin their economies. How well armed they were was irrelevant.


It was enough of a worry for Drake to fly a false flag to catch the heavily armed Spanish gold ships off guard.
Lady Areola Fappington
#40 - 2013-11-11 13:03:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Lady Areola Fappington
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:

If we must, think back to the days of high piracy. Pirates and privateers didn't attack military ships. They went after lightly armed traders for the precise reason we do....they can't fight back.


Wrong, wrong, wrong.

They went after them to disrupt trade and ruin their economies. How well armed they were was irrelevant.


Yeah, because if I were a pirate on the high seas, I'd totally go pick on the well-armed convoys floating by, and ignore the minimally defended traders. I'd ~totally~ not use devious and underhanded tricks in order to win.

Common sense man, the "commerce raiders" of old, be it full-blown pirates or Marque'ed privateers, went after the easy targets. Their goal was making cash. Pretty sure Blackbeard and his ilk weren't in it for ~gudfites~.

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide