EVE General Discussion

Actually, the OP seems focused two themes: 1) He asks if wardecs cause new players to leave. 2) He suggests substantially raising the cost of wardecs. The first is a valid question. The second would indeed be a big change if implemented. However, it's also been done before, and guess what, it didn't break Eve. So I think the question of whether to raise the cost again is also a valid one.



Whether or not Eve is full of people who would gladly support your position is irrelevant because that is argumentum ad populum. What it actually boils down to is this: Would Eve be better or worse off if the cost of wardecs went up substantially again? Would that change help new player retention without causing the loss of too many butthurt bittervets? Although the OP does use words like "last resort", he does (multiple times) reaffirm the need for wardecs and suggests upping the price as a solution (multiple times) so that's really what we're talking about here.

And sorry but no, increasing the cost of wardecs is not a core aspect of the game comparable to changing to multiple servers. That's just plain ol' exaggeration.

I think you may be oversimplifying OP's assertion. My interpretation is that he feels that the low cost of wardecs may contribute to the lack of player retention. To me, that's worth discussing. While I agree that it may not be the only factor, I don't think it's ridiculous to consider if it's one of the factors. OP never suggests removing wardecs "as a concept" or otherwise, and reiterates the importance of wardecs to the game several times.

I also agree that negative interaction "happens" and I am not advocating the removal of all negative interactions nor of wardecs.

I am not 100% sure that they should be more expensive, but I think it's a worthwhile topic of discussion. As for how incredibly easy they are to just brush off with no consequences....I'm not sure I would characterize the situation that dramatically either. The current system is better than the Decshield days. Yes, people can drop out of their corps if decced, but that can have consequences if it's a "real" corp and not just a tax shelter. If it was as easy, painless, and simple to avoid decs as you describe, then why do they cause enough grief to start threads like this one?

If the cost of wars goes up, then players who declare wars will band together into bigger groups to more easily afford the fees by virtue of distribution. All this will do is push the little groups of sociopath butt-buddies out of the picture. It will do NOTHING to address the actual problem of pvp happening where it SHOULDN'T. The only way to do that is to REMOVE WARS FROM HIGH-SEC ENTIRELY, like it should have been in the first place. HIGH-sec means HIGH safety, not NO safety, like the way it is now.

And yet you haven't rebutted my argument.

1)Getting wardecced, and later on wardeccing people, was what caused me and most of the people I know in this game to stick around. As both targets and aggressors it gave us something to work at as a group, and provided a level of incentive that simply does not exist within the pve side of the game. It may be anecdotal, but then so is claiming that new players are driven away by wardecs. There will be people who leave because of bad wardecs, absolutely, but here's the thing:

They're leaving because they don't like eve.

2)It has been done before, but not to nearly the extent suggested here. The last time ccp upped wardec costs they did so to the detriment of a very small number of corps/alliances who were essentially at war with everyone. (there have been others, but those changes were largely negligible in terms of what they did to wardeccing) The OP's suggestion would be a death sentence to the majority of the smaller wardeccing corps out there. It would kill wardeccing for smaller corps, and is therefore a terrible idea.

You're trying really, REALLY hard to sound smart. Key word here is trying.
1)Among those people are the guys who actually made this game
2)We're literally talking about what makes the game popular. If you're willing to cede that people who don't think the game should be safer are the majority in eve, then you can't really argue that it should be safer based on perceived potential losses, given that there would be equal, if not greater, potential loss if wardecs were made stupidly expensive.
If you're NOT willing to cede that point with regards to this discussion, then you can't claim that it's irrelevant.

See, you're wording this question in a way to make it seem reasonable, when it really isn't. PVE in this game is boring as ****, there's literally a thread (one of many that pop up all the time) about just that on the front page of GD right now. It's not just the vets that you have to worry about losing, it's all the newer players who, without the fear of loss looming over them, have little reason to stick around. I've been playing for 7 years now, and I'd not have made it to 7 weeks if people in this game only ever wardecced corps as a last resort.

I mean come on, how many MMOs have you played where people actually make the complaint that the entirety of the game's pve is terrible, while still actively playing said game?

The main impact on sharding the server would be to massive null alliances, I actually think making small scale wardeccing prohibitively expensive would probably change how the game works for more people.

* cough *

* wheeze *

I'm about to be moved to first aid because of a partially collapsed lung. I blame that post.

OH WOW

No, we are sayign that things are already TOO easy for them and further pushign there wil make eve losoe the veterans that made eve what it is and make the real content of the game that makes eve suyrvive and not become some meaningless game about lcick f1 and nothign else.




THings shoudl be even EASIER to make wars.

ALL players over 1 year old should be EJECTED from the NPC corps safe from war dec and NEVER allowed to come back. They shoudl be moved to a NPC corp that can be wardecced.

LEaving a corp in war shoudl make you drag your war for 1 week, same way as a corp leavign an alliance does. Erasign your corp and making a new one should contaminate the new corp with the war!



THis is a PVP game! MEchanics shoudl push for MORE pvp, not less

Oh my, someone is asking to be wardecced or ganked.
Enjoy your bounty by the way.