These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
Previous page123
 

Handling throwaway alts

Author
Mag's
Azn Empire
#41 - 2013-11-04 15:24:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Mag's
Frozen Chief wrote:
Mag's wrote:
Antihrist Pripravnik wrote:
This thread is about all other situations where players are powerless.
I'll ask again, what situations?
Learn to communicate like a respectful human being and he might respond to you. I wouldn't have given you even 1 response so far.

I don't agree with the OP here and I do think you've touched on some fine points. Why not present them in an appropriate manner? Can make for much better discussion.
How was that question disrespectful?
He made the statement, regarding pilots being powerless in situations. I asked a simple question and was given a none answer. I asked another simple question, in order to clarify that response but it was ignored. So I asked again, but I'm the one being disrespectful?

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.

Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#42 - 2013-11-04 18:26:11 UTC
I'll support this if CCP reduces the cost of my sub by 1/3rd for each character slot that your idea locks me out of, for the duration of the lockout. Otherwise, I'm paying for them, and I will goddamned well use them as I see fit within the limitations of the TOS.
Antihrist Pripravnik
Scorpion Road Industry
#43 - 2013-11-04 19:00:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Antihrist Pripravnik
Mag's wrote:
Frozen Chief wrote:
Mag's wrote:
Antihrist Pripravnik wrote:
This thread is about all other situations where players are powerless.
I'll ask again, what situations?
Learn to communicate like a respectful human being and he might respond to you. I wouldn't have given you even 1 response so far.

I don't agree with the OP here and I do think you've touched on some fine points. Why not present them in an appropriate manner? Can make for much better discussion.
How was that question disrespectful?
He made the statement, regarding pilots being powerless in situations. I asked a simple question and was given a none answer. I asked another simple question, in order to clarify that response but it was ignored. So I asked again, but I'm the one being disrespectful?


Sorry for a late reply.

Anyway, here are two examples:

- scam/spam alt does not need to be in a corp to do what it was created for. An ever increasing block list of recycled alts is not a sane nor effective solution.

- suicide ganking alt do not need to be in a corp to do what it was created for. Even if it's banned afterwards (when recycled), the damage has already been done and CCP is pretty clear about PvP reimbursements.

In both cases throwaway alts do not need to be in a corporation to do damage that can not be prevented by other players.
Antihrist Pripravnik
Scorpion Road Industry
#44 - 2013-11-04 19:13:40 UTC
Quintessen wrote:
Might I suggest that there be a dedicated slot just for forum alts that isn't time limited. That would solve the problem of having an alt for purchases and to make anonymous comments on forums, but wouldn't allow them to abuse that capability in game. Our meta-game activities shouldn't limit our in-game activities and that's what's being crossed right now.

Other than that, I completely agree. I also believe you should be able to rename your character in the first 7 days or so of life. But after that you have a reputation. They could even make the official naming ceremony something in-game and lore-based. So you pick you short-term name which does a temporary reserve on it, but you can go to this place and rename yourself in that seven day period.

I believe that solves both major concerns nicely while preserving the purity and efficacy of the original idea.


Or even have a possibility to mask the identity (from public, not from CCP / ISD / GMs) on all buy/sell sections of the forums.

Regarding the renaming possibility and the current situation, I've managed to fix a typo in one alliance name by submitting a petition within 24 hours of creation. I don't know if you can already do that with a character as well.
Mag's
Azn Empire
#45 - 2013-11-04 19:45:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Mag's
Antihrist Pripravnik wrote:


Sorry for a late reply.

Anyway, here are two examples:

- scam/spam alt does not need to be in a corp to do what it was created for. An ever increasing block list of recycled alts is not a sane nor effective solution.

- suicide ganking alt do not need to be in a corp to do what it was created for. Even if it's banned afterwards (when recycled), the damage has already been done and CCP is pretty clear about PvP reimbursements.

In both cases throwaway alts do not need to be in a corporation to do damage that can not be prevented by other players.
No problem.

Scams.
It really makes no difference who scams you. You do not become powerless simply because someone uses an alt. Sure you may not be able to get at them by shooting them, but this remains the same for all chars that do not leave the station. Whether they be in an NPC corp or not, the anonymity is still there.
The power comes from knowing the game and avoiding such things. It also comes from learning from your mistakes and not falling for scams again, if you ever do.

Spams.
You have shown yourself that you are not powerless in this regard. If blocking is an issue for you, then close local chat. I have spent a fair few hours in Jita, I've never felt powerless by either spamming or scamming alts.

The point is it makes no difference whether these are in corps or not. People will still fall for scams, this is why Jita local is full of them. The human conditions means we love things that look good. Often without checking first that what we are buying, isn't actually a polished turd.

Suicide ganks.
We have already covered suicide ganking alts and the recycling of. It already is the case that this is against the rules and you are liable to be banned for exploiting this. We do not know what systems CCP have in place, in this regard. But if you suspect someone of doing just that, then petition it. I also have my doubts this is as rife, as people make it out to be.
It also makes no difference regarding what corp they are in. It will always remain against the rules.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.

Dr0000 Maulerant
Union Nanide and Tooling
#46 - 2013-11-04 22:30:37 UTC
I'm pretty confident the "bannable" biomass thing is strictly for toons with negative sec status, I will be filing a petition later to be certain.

Tell me again about how every playstyle you dont engage in "doesn't require any effort" and everyone who does it needs to die in a fire. Be sure to mention about how you tried it once but it was too easy/boring/ethnic-homophobic slur. 

Mag's
Azn Empire
#47 - 2013-11-05 06:50:04 UTC
Dr0000 Maulerant wrote:
I'm pretty confident the "bannable" biomass thing is strictly for toons with negative sec status, I will be filing a petition later to be certain.
It is. It was a way to avoid that consequence and deemed an exploit.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.

Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
#48 - 2013-11-05 07:06:31 UTC
What, exactly, is this solving?

The main problem with 'bad' alts are those that get deleted incorrectly and CCP deals with them (presumably since it is against the TOS).

So, what is the problem that this is supposed to solve? I am not seeing it.

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.

Debora Tsung
Perkone
Caldari State
#49 - 2013-11-05 09:39:45 UTC
Mag's wrote:
I'm guessing the OP has some statistics on the amount of people that exploit this and are subject to a ban where applicable?


Throwaway alts are only there to avoid the consequences of your actions, as such they go against one of the core principles of eve.

Couldn't care less tbh, but that's how it is. Straight

Stupidity should be a bannable offense.

Fighting back is more fun than not.

Sticky: AFK Cloaking Thread It's not pretty, but it's there.

Kenrailae
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#50 - 2013-11-05 09:41:38 UTC
Petrified wrote:
What, exactly, is this solving?

The main problem with 'bad' alts are those that get deleted incorrectly and CCP deals with them (presumably since it is against the TOS).

So, what is the problem that this is supposed to solve? I am not seeing it.





After reading through this, it LOOKS like the problem it's aimed at 'solving' is reducing the frequency/flexibility of bannable alt recycling. CCP doesn't/can't get all of them, probably not even most of them, but this LOOKS like an attempt to slow the cycling of them.

It's not an unreasonable idea.... but it's not quite as simple as what's been proposed either, I don't think.

The Law is a point of View

The NPE IS a big deal

Delt0r Garsk
Shits N Giggles
#51 - 2013-11-05 16:16:19 UTC
+1

What i don't understand is why anyone needs to delete an alt (same account) in less than 30,60 or 90 days? What case is legit here? If the character does not have negative status etc? Why does it need to be deleted?

In fact they only reason i see is to avoid consequences of your actions with that character. If that's a reputation as a spammer or scamer, how is that different? If its because you where in goon swarm for 30 days? Well its an action and the character is suppose to endure consequences for that.

I'd go one further. These forums are part of the game in that accounts are linked... So posting here is also part of those consequences. There are other fan forums for anonymity.

Yes this is my main, and i have only one account.

AKA the scientist.

Death and Glory!

Well fun is also good.

Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
#52 - 2013-11-05 23:08:05 UTC
Kenrailae wrote:
Petrified wrote:
What, exactly, is this solving?

The main problem with 'bad' alts are those that get deleted incorrectly and CCP deals with them (presumably since it is against the TOS).

So, what is the problem that this is supposed to solve? I am not seeing it.





After reading through this, it LOOKS like the problem it's aimed at 'solving' is reducing the frequency/flexibility of bannable alt recycling. CCP doesn't/can't get all of them, probably not even most of them, but this LOOKS like an attempt to slow the cycling of them.

It's not an unreasonable idea.... but it's not quite as simple as what's been proposed either, I don't think.


Two problems here: CCP should have no issue identifying bannable alt recycling - A database check during the freeze period an account goes through would effectively catch any of these. In fact, a data base check performed at the time you try to biomass your character would discover if the character is in a state of violation and thus prevent the character from being bio-massed.

Coding issue that self-checks. Easily done ultimately.

So... aside from this, what is the reason to prevent people from creating alts and biomassing a short time later when they are within TOS? I see no reason to as there are plenty of valid reasons to continue to allow people the flexibility to create a character and delete it later.

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.

Kenrailae
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#53 - 2013-11-05 23:12:24 UTC
Petrified wrote:
Two problems here: CCP should have no issue identifying bannable alt recycling - A database check during the freeze period an account goes through would effectively catch any of these. In fact, a data base check performed at the time you try to biomass your character would discover if the character is in a state of violation and thus prevent the character from being bio-massed.

Coding issue that self-checks. Easily done ultimately.

So... aside from this, what is the reason to prevent people from creating alts and biomassing a short time later when they are within TOS? I see no reason to as there are plenty of valid reasons to continue to allow people the flexibility to create a character and delete it later.




CCP should also have no problem looking at logs and seeing 'oh Hey, 120k alpha Curator II's are a bad thing....'


But.... ya know.



The Law is a point of View

The NPE IS a big deal

Jasmine Assasin
The Holy Rollers
#54 - 2013-11-05 23:20:58 UTC
Some of this is outright insane, why even be able to biomass a character at all you should just have to deal with the ~consequences~ forever, no matter what right?

Get real.

If I create a character I should have full rights to delete it. If CCP feels there is a problem they can lock it and investigate. There is no need for what is being called for here.

Previous page123