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Interdictors, Bubbles and Aggro

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Author
TinkerHell
Nocturnal Romance
Cynosural Field Theory.
#1 - 2013-11-04 23:21:21 UTC  |  Edited by: TinkerHell
Interdictor bubbles should cause aggro, this current state is stupid.

Tonight i jumped a gang of capitals to a Gallente station, a flycatcher then undocked and dropped a bubble on us, we couldnt warp in the bubble to cause it aggression, so it just docked, waited a bit and dropped another bubble. We had no choice but to slowboat the carrier fleet 35km to get out of range of the dictor undocking and slowboating with invul and then dropping the bubble and docking.

Yesterday we had 2 of our carriers tackled on a gate by a long range sniper gang, that had 2 sabres and 2 Arazus. The arazus were no problem we could shoot them and push the points off field, the sabres however, not so much, they could jump in, mwd cloak, bubble and jump back out of system. Our carriers were stuck for over an hour by two ships that didnt even get aggression.

Last week, we dropped dreads on a gate and sieged. The enemy gang responded by running back home keeping the gang docked and sending 6 interdictors back to the dreads, and using the same tactic of mwd/cloak/uncloak/bubble jump. We managed to slowboat the dreads out of the bubbles which took 30 minutes before their batphone arrived.

To me this all seems a bit wrong? Why should a ship have such an effect without even getting aggression? The only counter i have at my disposal that i can see is smartbombs, but i cant smartbomb bubbles on a station so they are useless to me there. So basically if a dictor wants to waste 30minutes of my life with no risk they can.



Edit: Capital ships are used as the example as they are ships that are slow and therefore cant burn out of a bubble easily
Liam Inkuras
dead.Orbit
#2 - 2013-11-04 23:25:42 UTC
TLDR: Make Dictor bubble launchers give an aggression timer when activated, or when someone tries to warp out of one

Also, First

I wear my goggles at night.

Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone

God's Apples
Wilderness
lllllllllllllllll
#3 - 2013-11-04 23:26:21 UTC
nomad pls

"Hydra Reloaded are just jealous / butthurt on me / us because we can get tons of PVP action in empire while they aren't good enough to get that." - NightmareX

Sachial
Chaotic Tranquility
#4 - 2013-11-04 23:27:22 UTC
Liam Inkuras wrote:
TLDR: Make Dictor bubble launchers give an aggression timer when activated, or when someone tries to warp out of one

Also, First


Sense makes this.
Daemon Lucifus
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2013-11-04 23:31:44 UTC
i totally second this post
KhalimAmnov
OpSec.
Wrong Hole.
#6 - 2013-11-04 23:32:42 UTC
Yeah. Bubbles causing aggro would make far too much sense...
Ponder Stuff
Hostile.
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#7 - 2013-11-04 23:46:39 UTC
Bubbles need to cause aggro, this is probably the most broken they have ever been...
Meyr
Pirannha Corp
#8 - 2013-11-05 00:14:35 UTC
I heartily endorse the above-mentioned product and/or service!

Having taken advantage of this mechanic a time or two, it does seem a bit broken.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#9 - 2013-11-05 00:14:35 UTC
Bastion modules cause a weapons timer but bubbles apparently don't....
Yea... That's kinda broken when a purely defensive module causes a timer but an attacking module doesn't.
GeeShizzle MacCloud
#10 - 2013-11-05 00:35:58 UTC
trying to engage warp to a location off grid whilst in the bubble creates an aggro timer, you just need to be quick to do it to a ship thats trying to complete its job and get back into safety. if you do i believe the ship/pilot gets an aggro timer and cant dock/jump.

if dictors never got aggro from bubbles you would never see dictors on killmails because of a warp interdiction probe, and i can tell you ive been on killmails since the last patch for precisely that.
Ponder Stuff
Hostile.
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#11 - 2013-11-05 00:56:51 UTC
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:
trying to engage warp to a location off grid whilst in the bubble creates an aggro timer, you just need to be quick to do it to a ship thats trying to complete its job and get back into safety. if you do i believe the ship/pilot gets an aggro timer and cant dock/jump.

if dictors never got aggro from bubbles you would never see dictors on killmails because of a warp interdiction probe, and i can tell you ive been on killmails since the last patch for precisely that.




You do not appear to have read or understood the first post...
GeeShizzle MacCloud
#12 - 2013-11-05 01:26:40 UTC
Ponder Stuff wrote:
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:
trying to engage warp to a location off grid whilst in the bubble creates an aggro timer, you just need to be quick to do it to a ship thats trying to complete its job and get back into safety. if you do i believe the ship/pilot gets an aggro timer and cant dock/jump.

if dictors never got aggro from bubbles you would never see dictors on killmails because of a warp interdiction probe, and i can tell you ive been on killmails since the last patch for precisely that.




You do not appear to have read or understood the first post...


i have and the only issue i see is that trying to warp whilst either in siege or in triage meant the checksum hit the siege/triage brick wall before the bubble stopping warp brick wall.

the only other possible issue is if technically the dictors can bubble up after they've sent the jump request (ie the server processes the deployment of a warp interdiction probe after/during its processed the jump command)
Benny Ohu
Chaotic Tranquility
#13 - 2013-11-05 02:01:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Benny Ohu
Weapons timers were removed from interdictor bubbles soon after the implementation of the new Crimewatch to allow the dictors to jump and keep up with their fleets, if I remember correctly.

e: nope, retribution 1.0. perhaps the change was before release. the reason is correct, though. i'm not arguing against the OP, mind, i'm just producing the reason probes don't give a weapons timer. allowing the interdictors to remain with the fleet is important, but the situation described in the OP is bordering on abuse of the mechanic
F3X5ON
Zero Fun Allowed
#14 - 2013-11-05 02:29:08 UTC
And shorten the invul timer from undocking/jumping from 60 to 30s aswell.
Maelgar
Nocturnal Romance
Cynosural Field Theory.
#15 - 2013-11-05 03:33:05 UTC
Put it back to the old days of when you dropped the bubble and someone had the foresight to try to warp in said bubble aggro was started. Make these lazy dictor pilots learn what it really means to time things or beat feet.

Seems an exploit at current.
Korg Leaf
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2013-11-05 08:31:57 UTC
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:
Ponder Stuff wrote:
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:
trying to engage warp to a location off grid whilst in the bubble creates an aggro timer, you just need to be quick to do it to a ship thats trying to complete its job and get back into safety. if you do i believe the ship/pilot gets an aggro timer and cant dock/jump.

if dictors never got aggro from bubbles you would never see dictors on killmails because of a warp interdiction probe, and i can tell you ive been on killmails since the last patch for precisely that.




You do not appear to have read or understood the first post...


i have and the only issue i see is that trying to warp whilst either in siege or in triage meant the checksum hit the siege/triage brick wall before the bubble stopping warp brick wall.

the only other possible issue is if technically the dictors can bubble up after they've sent the jump request (ie the server processes the deployment of a warp interdiction probe after/during its processed the jump command)


Trying to warp in siege/triage wouldn't cause aggression on the mechanics anyway due to the fact that you cannot warp anyway. Interdictors and interceptors are going to travel even faster come rubicon. Combine that with an invulnerability of just being able to dock/jump due to no aggression is stupid.
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#17 - 2013-11-05 08:59:51 UTC
I would agree that dictors need to keep up with the fleet, so no to launching bubbles as a source of aggression timer.

If you launch a bubble and someone tries to warp while inside of it, though.. yes to making that start an aggression timer.
GeeShizzle MacCloud
#18 - 2013-11-05 12:29:50 UTC  |  Edited by: GeeShizzle MacCloud
maybe make the action of launching said bubble and activating a gate / docking having to occur on separate server ticks (rather than the same that i believe it is currently) meaning there will be a 1 second difference between the bubble being dropped and a docking request/jump request.

generally peoples reaction times are <~250ms so would seem enough of a difference to do something with it.
seth Hendar
I love you miners
#19 - 2013-11-05 13:10:32 UTC
GeeShizzle MacCloud wrote:
maybe make the action of launching said bubble and activating a gate / docking having to occur on separate server ticks (rather than the same that i believe it is currently) meaning there will be a 1 second difference between the bubble being dropped and a docking request/jump request.

generally peoples reaction times are <~250ms so would seem enough of a difference to do something with it.

still doesn't solve the issue where an agressive module use doesn't induce gun timer


drop a bubble => 60 sec. gun timer. deal with it.

too easy to bubble and dock in loop with actually no way to be caught

and a check on the undock lenght (both time, and actual physical lenght)

also, a "stop ship" order shall drop the invulnerability, this is non sense, invuln is made for ppl with a bad connection to actually catch up (preventing them to be killed before actually seeing the outside), if they issued a "stop" order, they are in control, why shall they remain invuln?
Benny Ohu
Chaotic Tranquility
#20 - 2013-11-05 14:42:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Benny Ohu
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
I would agree that dictors need to keep up with the fleet, so no to launching bubbles as a source of aggression timer.

If you launch a bubble and someone tries to warp while inside of it, though.. yes to making that start an aggression timer.

no, the other way around!

having people try to warp near the end of the bubble's life is what really extends the aggro timer to stupid long levels and prevents the dictor (and fleet) getting around

also you could still land at gate > launch > jump before anyone tries to warp
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