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Moving goods in high sec

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erg cz
Federal Jegerouns
#21 - 2013-11-01 10:11:58 UTC
What about Gnosis? 6 * Expanded Cargohold II will give you over 3000 m3 and you can fit solid shield with 6 mid slots... Align time is very small, comparing to transports. Plus no one expects it to cary something really valuable.

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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#22 - 2013-11-02 06:49:59 UTC
erg cz wrote:
What about Gnosis? 6 * Expanded Cargohold II will give you over 3000 m3 and you can fit solid shield with 6 mid slots... Align time is very small, comparing to transports. Plus no one expects it to cary something really valuable.

It doesn't particularly matter what a Gnosis carries — it's a valuable target in and of itself because it's a special-issue ship and looks good on killboards.
Bethan Le Troix
Krusual Investigation Agency
#23 - 2013-11-03 12:56:35 UTC
Nikki VanSaar wrote:
Hello,

So, i start to have some valuables that i would like to sell in Jita.

How much do you think is safe to transport in a badger in high sec?


T1 industrials. 30 to 40 million maximum. But personally I wouldn't use a T1 industrial for any long distance or even medium distance hauling. Emptying local-ish customs offices and lvl 4 distribution missions is all they are good for. Paper thin - BOOM!

For hauling you should be using Blockade runner / Orca / Freighter depending on size or type of cargo. Failing that you should ask a trusted corpie to haul for you or use the services of Red Frog, PUSH, or a similar service. Personally I recommend Red Frog. Always remember to set a high collateral and there will be no problems then.

T1 industrials are very limited in their uses.
Fighter Maurset
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#24 - 2013-11-03 15:09:43 UTC
This would be the time to say something like: We should have a cargo "scanner jammer". Give them different jamming strenght such as the principle of warp scrambling. But then they could not be used in high sec space due to customs needing to scan our ships for illegal cargo and so on... bla bla bla...

If my pilot is certain to face death... I want full ramming speed towards the enemy ship...
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#25 - 2013-11-03 15:12:16 UTC
Fighter Maurset wrote:
This would be the time to say something like: We should have a cargo "scanner jammer". Give them different jamming strenght such as the principle of warp scrambling. But then they could not be used in high sec space due to customs needing to scan our ships for illegal cargo and so on... bla bla bla...




it would need to be more complex than that. Because the simple fact of running one would suggest that you have something to hide.

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Fuzzwork Enterprises

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J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#26 - 2013-11-03 15:23:23 UTC
Fighter Maurset wrote:
This would be the time to say something like: We should have a cargo "scanner jammer". Give them different jamming strenght such as the principle of warp scrambling. But then they could not be used in high sec space due to customs needing to scan our ships for illegal cargo and so on... bla bla bla...



That would be a useless modules.

You can't use it in high-sec, only in low and null...where people will shoot you even if they didn't scan you.

Ergo, no point on the module itself other then wasting fitting abilities.

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Fighter Maurset
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2013-11-03 16:32:57 UTC
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Fighter Maurset wrote:
This would be the time to say something like: We should have a cargo "scanner jammer". Give them different jamming strenght such as the principle of warp scrambling. But then they could not be used in high sec space due to customs needing to scan our ships for illegal cargo and so on... bla bla bla...




it would need to be more complex than that. Because the simple fact of running one would suggest that you have something to hide.


Exactly! So what should the gankers/pirates do? Gamble and blow up every ship they come across? Or what happens if they meet a convoy with multiple ships? Do they have intel on what ship to target, or do they gank everything? This might go for the better or the worse. I dont know what way...

If my pilot is certain to face death... I want full ramming speed towards the enemy ship...
Fighter Maurset
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2013-11-03 16:35:37 UTC
J'Poll wrote:
Fighter Maurset wrote:
This would be the time to say something like: We should have a cargo "scanner jammer". Give them different jamming strenght such as the principle of warp scrambling. But then they could not be used in high sec space due to customs needing to scan our ships for illegal cargo and so on... bla bla bla...



That would be a useless modules.

You can't use it in high-sec, only in low and null...where people will shoot you even if they didn't scan you.

Ergo, no point on the module itself other then wasting fitting abilities.


Perhaps. Unless, customs have unlimited scanning strenght on their cargo scanner. Then it could be allowed in high sec...

If my pilot is certain to face death... I want full ramming speed towards the enemy ship...
Skeln Thargensen
Doomheim
#29 - 2013-11-03 16:48:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Skeln Thargensen
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Elena Thiesant wrote:
Paul Otichoda wrote:
if so what should we use to move very high value items around (deadspace/officer/faction items etc).

Either an heavily tanked industrial or a covert ops ship using the cloak to keep safe?


Covert ops, blockade runner (with cloak), Freighter (if under a billion and you have lots of patience), courier contract. Cloaky T3 works also.

I used to use a brick battlecruiser (max buffer tanked) to move up to about 400 million before I got covert ops.


Orca's also an option.

You can get a fairly decent tank on one.



yep, crucially the damage control and bulkheads. anything else in the lows is a fail.

I'm quite comfortable shifting 100s of millions in it, even getting scanned in 0.5 space.

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Cameron Zero
Sebiestor Tribe
#30 - 2013-11-03 20:05:21 UTC
Fighter Maurset wrote:
This would be the time to say something like: We should have a cargo "scanner jammer". Give them different jamming strenght such as the principle of warp scrambling. But then they could not be used in high sec space due to customs needing to scan our ships for illegal cargo and so on... bla bla bla...


Easy workaround:

Create an alt. Create courier contract for alt. Have alt create a courier contract out of the wrapped package from the first courier contract to your character. Fly it to destination. The double-wrapped package will only show a courier contract to a scanner.

While this won't stop some people from trying to gank you (because usually, the "only people" who do this are moving high-value items), it does stop some who won't make a gank without at least some assurance of a payoff.

Of course, you could also do the same trick with some useless items, and just run the route a few times. Either you get blown up, and the gankers feel stupid for losing a bunch of ISK for nothing, and then stop targeting you, or you don't because they don't think you're worth ganking.

(NOTE: I use this "trick" whenever I move ANYTHING, whether it's a million ISK worth of ammo, or 200m ISK worth of PI products. Having said that, I don't think I'd put anything more than 200m ISK into a T1 hauler, and I use instaundocks/instadock bookmarks wherever I go. Anything more than that goes into a freighter.)

"I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. …"
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#31 - 2013-11-04 03:19:33 UTC
Skeln Thargensen wrote:
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Elena Thiesant wrote:
Paul Otichoda wrote:
if so what should we use to move very high value items around (deadspace/officer/faction items etc).

Either an heavily tanked industrial or a covert ops ship using the cloak to keep safe?


Covert ops, blockade runner (with cloak), Freighter (if under a billion and you have lots of patience), courier contract. Cloaky T3 works also.

I used to use a brick battlecruiser (max buffer tanked) to move up to about 400 million before I got covert ops.


Orca's also an option.

You can get a fairly decent tank on one.



yep, crucially the damage control and bulkheads. anything else in the lows is a fail.

I'm quite comfortable shifting 100s of millions in it, even getting scanned in 0.5 space.



There are ways to pop Orcas with extreme buffer tanks in highsec. I have seen fleets where a bump Machariel pushes the Orca out of alignment while waves of gank ships shoot it, then the gankers reship while the Orca is bumped to 15 minutes non-stop, until the gankers can come back out to finish the job well off the gate (and off grid from Concord's earlier spawning). To prevent the Orca logging off, someone shoots it in a rookie ship to extend its capsuleer combat timer.


Noone will go to that effort over an Orca with a half billion in the hold, but if you start using it to carry 15 billion, expect to be playing Machariel pinball until you lose your ship.

The only effective defense is flying with an escort that can remote repair (a logisitics cruiser with a MWD, or the much less often seen, but in this situation more effective, logistics subsystem strategic cruiser).

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Maethilar
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#32 - 2013-11-05 00:41:17 UTC
Depending on how much m3 you are moving you can use a very well tanked BC, especially if you are moving small but valuable items. Trust me it works and people are a lot more occupied scanning and ganking haulers to bother with a BC.
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