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So how bad did the economy just get screwed by Amazon?

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lollerwaffle
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#141 - 2013-10-28 14:02:15 UTC
Aiden Terona wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Cristl wrote:
Malcanis wrote:

OK. So what harm does that do? Except for transaction fees, no ISK is created or destroyed, no new ships, modules or items are created, and lots of players have some cheap game time subsidised by Amazon.

What's the damage?


You genuinely can't see the problem with a small group of players (Americans who saw the deal) being offered 3 plex for $5, while the rest of us pay $17.50 for each one? In a competitive game? Offering one group of players super-cheap playtime / ISK over others is pretty bad mate.

The only saving grace in this situation is that the error was spotted quite quickly. I.e., while the harm is self-evident in my opinion, at least it wasn't too extensive.


I'm sorry, I should have phrased the question more clearly: what harm does this do to the game economy?

As for the harm you discuss, you're still talking as if this was some planned, deliberate anti-EU move on CCP's part when it was a straight up administrative error by Amazon that they fixed as quickly as possible. Regardless, what harm has been sufferred? If I get 3 PLEX for $5, how has that harmed you in any way?

Won't be voting for you next year, lost your common sense?

Wow, the irony in this sentence alone is magnificent. Lost YOUR common sense? Buy it on Amazon for a fiver mate.
handige harrie
Vereenigde Handels Compagnie
#142 - 2013-10-28 14:06:28 UTC
CCP partnering with another Quality partner.

Baddest poster ever
Lipbite
Express Hauler
#143 - 2013-10-28 14:14:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Lipbite
mynnna wrote:
Lipbite wrote:
I wonder - what will be the next lucky "accident" which will help CCP to lower raising PLEX prices during next weekend?


Except for the part where PLEX are already back to their previous price?

Stop being dumb please.


Please, stop lying - price was 630-637mil, now it's 620 and dropping. 3% makes a difference, if it was the other way around price could be 650mil or more - without those two Amazon sales.
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#144 - 2013-10-28 14:21:38 UTC
Erotica 1 wrote:
Solstice Project wrote:
It's part of the conspiracy !! (oh my, i never run out of **** to post with this xD)

Because of the stop of FoodStamps coming November,
the US gov told Amazon to sell PLEX cheaply so people will play EvE
instead of rioting on the streets, because they are hungry !!


Can't you people see it ????


All you need is 51% of the vote. Pay 51% and you can tax the other 49% into the ground.



Thats French method, let me give you some most common numbers and tell me if those mean something for you:

5.5%
7%
19.6%
26%
46.1%
75%
1.5 active for 4 inactive

Just some fumy ones.

Lol

removed inappropriate ASCII art signature - CCP Eterne
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#145 - 2013-10-28 14:29:07 UTC
Lipbite wrote:
mynnna wrote:
Lipbite wrote:
I wonder - what will be the next lucky "accident" which will help CCP to lower raising PLEX prices during next weekend?


Except for the part where PLEX are already back to their previous price?

Stop being dumb please.


Please, stop lying - price was 630-637mil, now it's 620 and dropping. 3% makes a difference, if it was the other way around price could be 650mil or more - without those two Amazon sales.


Price was down to 600 briefly it is on it way back UP

so, from 637 to 620, so they dropped 3% in 24 hours and are on their way back up


Boo Hoo Hoo
IDGAD
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#146 - 2013-10-28 14:35:06 UTC
Cry some more! I just wish I could have gotten 8 sets of 3 plex since I have two amazon accounts lol. No one tells me these things D:
Lipbite
Express Hauler
#147 - 2013-10-28 14:37:07 UTC
Kenneth Feld wrote:
Price was down to 600 briefly it is on it way back UP

It's seems you've missed 580mil PLEX train yesterday: all buying orders above 580mil were fulfilled.
Antihrist Pripravnik
Cultural Enrichment and Synergy of Diversity
Stain Neurodiverse Democracy
#148 - 2013-10-28 14:39:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Antihrist Pripravnik
Malcanis wrote:

I feel that I can easily endure a substantial amount of anguish from PLEX speculators.

But surely Amazon are taking the hit for this, not CCP? CCP sold Amazon a bunch of PLEX. Amazon can resell them for whatever price they think best. If they want to drop a few thousand PLEX at 10% of the usual market rate, then how is that CCP's problem? Or ours, come to that?

OK, I haven't really went into details of who lost the money (had a quick look at the attached screenshot from Amazon and read a couple of posts in this thread). You might be correct on that one.

Anyway, if someone dumps an amount of PLEX at a significantly lower rate and CCP gets paid the full price for them, then it's not CCP's problem. It's actually a benefit, since those PLEXes are sold much faster, CCP gets the money and we have more players to shoot at in the game, more players shooting other players and more players shooting NPCs. It's actually good for the economy - more action, more fun, more player made content = healthier economy. So, it's not even our problem, really (except for mentioned market speculators). Smile

The only economy that is hurt is personal economy (wallet) of the one who made a really nasty typo on Amazon and lost a fair amount of cash.

Edit: I know those could be rhetorical questions, but I've answered them anyway Oops
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#149 - 2013-10-28 15:00:45 UTC
Lipbite wrote:
Kenneth Feld wrote:
Price was down to 600 briefly it is on it way back UP

It's seems you've missed 580mil PLEX train yesterday: all buying orders above 580mil were fulfilled.


I was quoting sell orders sorry, yes, buy orders were down to 578mil or so briefly and no I did NOT miss that train ;)
Cristl
#150 - 2013-10-28 15:19:32 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Cristl wrote:
Malcanis wrote:

OK. So what harm does that do? Except for transaction fees, no ISK is created or destroyed, no new ships, modules or items are created, and lots of players have some cheap game time subsidised by Amazon.

What's the damage?


You genuinely can't see the problem with a small group of players (Americans who saw the deal) being offered 3 plex for $5, while the rest of us pay $17.50 for each one? In a competitive game? Offering one group of players super-cheap playtime / ISK over others is pretty bad mate.

The only saving grace in this situation is that the error was spotted quite quickly. I.e., while the harm is self-evident in my opinion, at least it wasn't too extensive.


I'm sorry, I should have phrased the question more clearly: what harm does this do to the game economy?

As for the harm you discuss, you're still talking as if this was some planned, deliberate anti-EU move on CCP's part when it was a straight up administrative error by Amazon that they fixed as quickly as possible. Regardless, what harm has been sufferred? If I get 3 PLEX for $5, how has that harmed you in any way?


Malcanis, you've been around here quite a while, and are much smarter than you're coming across in this thread. As I pointed out in my first thread, the only reason this isn't a much bigger stink is that the error was spotted and quashed quickly. That means that the effect on the economy was small (plex dropped in price for a day or so), but the principle is the same:

There is no way that CCP could charge only $5 for three months subscription: they simply couldn't break even after paying for staff, server maintenance, bandwidth etc. If that offer existed for any length of time the effect on the EVE economy would be very simple: we'd not be playing EVE any longer.

As to Euro-bias: I live in Asia, so I'm not sure what you are referring to here. I presume you are confusing me with someone else. As to my overall feelings on this matter, I am not simply being covetous: this is a competitive game, and crediting black with an extra couple of rooks does indeed impact white.

Fly safe.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#151 - 2013-10-28 15:48:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Malcanis
Cristl wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Cristl wrote:
Malcanis wrote:

OK. So what harm does that do? Except for transaction fees, no ISK is created or destroyed, no new ships, modules or items are created, and lots of players have some cheap game time subsidised by Amazon.

What's the damage?


You genuinely can't see the problem with a small group of players (Americans who saw the deal) being offered 3 plex for $5, while the rest of us pay $17.50 for each one? In a competitive game? Offering one group of players super-cheap playtime / ISK over others is pretty bad mate.

The only saving grace in this situation is that the error was spotted quite quickly. I.e., while the harm is self-evident in my opinion, at least it wasn't too extensive.


I'm sorry, I should have phrased the question more clearly: what harm does this do to the game economy?

As for the harm you discuss, you're still talking as if this was some planned, deliberate anti-EU move on CCP's part when it was a straight up administrative error by Amazon that they fixed as quickly as possible. Regardless, what harm has been sufferred? If I get 3 PLEX for $5, how has that harmed you in any way?


Malcanis, you've been around here quite a while, and are much smarter than you're coming across in this thread. As I pointed out in my first thread, the only reason this isn't a much bigger stink is that the error was spotted and quashed quickly. That means that the effect on the economy was small (plex dropped in price for a day or so), but the principle is the same:

There is no way that CCP could charge only $5 for three months subscription: they simply couldn't break even after paying for staff, server maintenance, bandwidth etc. If that offer existed for any length of time the effect on the EVE economy would be very simple: we'd not be playing EVE any longer.

As to Euro-bias: I live in Asia, so I'm not sure what you are referring to here. I presume you are confusing me with someone else. As to my overall feelings on this matter, I am not simply being covetous: this is a competitive game, and crediting black with an extra couple of rooks does indeed impact white.

Fly safe.



CCP didn't charge $5. Amazon did. Amazon are the ones eating the loss here. Unless they have some particularly unusual deal with CCP, they'll be getting those 3000 (or however many) PLEX from CCP at a certain price, and the price they choose to sell the 3000 PLEX at doesn't change that price. Let's say it's $42.00 for the 3-pack. In that case, Amazon eats a $37 loss on every PLEX 3-pack they sold at $5, because CCP sold those PLEX at $14.00 a pop to Amazon. Generally resellers don't get to turn around to the supplier and make puppy eyes and say "We dun goofed, please can we have $37,000 back?".

CCP: Benefit from this in the short term, because Amazon have just moved a truckload of PLEX with what is effectively an unfunded promotion. Possibly there might be a reduction in demand afterwards, but at worst, no net damage, and any commercial manager will tell you that two sales today is better than 1 today and maybe 1 in a month.

Players: Some players benefitted with cheap PLEX; equally some speculators lost an equivalent amount of ISK. Most players were virtually unaffected. Overall, zero net effect.

Amazon: Lost something like $30-40 multiplied by however many 3-packs were successfully purchased.

Now Amazon might be able to swing some kind of promotional funding from CCP for another PLEX sale because of this, but I doubt it'll be all that much. It's not as if CCP really need Amazon to sell PLEX for them.

So my question repeats: What. Is. The. Harm?

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Cristl
#152 - 2013-10-28 16:10:16 UTC
Malcanis wrote:

So my question repeats: What. Is. The. Harm?


I'm not doing teenage-mode Malcanis.

It doesn't matter who foots the bill, since the incident was so short and the companies (CCP or Amazon) can easily take such a short-lived cock-up. What matters is that some people, in a competitive game where gametime can be converted to apparatus, have been offered a deal where $100 USD can be converted to five years' worth of gameplay and others must make do with six months.

That's not fair, and not in an 'EVE isn't fair' way. If you still can't see this, then let's just agree to disagree, because I'm off to bed.
Abdiel Kavash
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#153 - 2013-10-28 16:17:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Abdiel Kavash
Cristl wrote:
Malcanis wrote:

So my question repeats: What. Is. The. Harm?


I'm not doing teenage-mode Malcanis.

It doesn't matter who foots the bill, since the incident was so short and the companies (CCP or Amazon) can easily take such a short-lived cock-up. What matters is that some people, in a competitive game where gametime can be converted to apparatus, have been offered a deal where $100 USD can be converted to five years' worth of gameplay and others must make do with six months.

That's not fair, and not in an 'EVE isn't fair' way. If you still can't see this, then let's just agree to disagree, because I'm off to bed.

So what if I decide to sink $30k into PLEXes, and offer them for sale for 50M ISK, but only to members of Fidelas Constans? Exactly the same thing. Amazon bought the PLEXes from CCP at a fair price, they're free to do whatever they want with them.
Benny Ohu
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#154 - 2013-10-28 16:18:22 UTC
Cristl wrote:
Malcanis, you've been around here quite a while, and are much smarter than you're coming across in this thread.
He used to be, until he disagreed with me. X
Nathalie LaPorte
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#155 - 2013-10-28 16:32:26 UTC
Cristl wrote:
Malcanis wrote:

So my question repeats: What. Is. The. Harm?


I'm not doing teenage-mode.
....

That's not fair, and not in an 'EVE isn't fair' way. If you still can't see this, then let's just agree to disagree, because I'm off to (find new parents).


FTFY
z Flint
z Mining Corp
#156 - 2013-10-28 16:39:42 UTC
CCP Guard wrote:
dei'ro wrote:
CCP Guard wrote:
Hey everyone.

It appears that Amazon, who operate as a third party re-seller for some of our products, put the wrong price on a package of PLEX and then quickly pulled the offer once the error was discovered.

A few thousand extra PLEX are in circulation as a result which is not enough to cause any significant or lasting impact on the in-game markets.

There shouldn't be any fallout but we'll monitor the situation of course. If you or anyone you know has encountered any problems related to this incident, you are invited to file a support ticket.





Since this deal was not available outside of the US, are you going to release cheap plexes to the non-US masses?
Because at the moment the US got a massive advantage (lol 2billion for 5 bucks)


We didn't really release any cheap PLEX...this was a short-lived mistake by a re-seller that nobody is planning to repeat intentionally.


Hope there is a next time so those of us that due to RL could get the chance to buy. Big smile
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#157 - 2013-10-28 17:03:36 UTC
*tinfoil*

Clearly someone at Amazon is a member of a big alliance that needed some cheap plexs to rebuild their wallet.

"Oops!"

:)

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#158 - 2013-10-28 18:21:55 UTC
In my little town back when I was 16, I received my SCUBA certification for $11.00 due to a typo on the advertizement. A few of that class got in on it and the rest of the class paid the original price of $110.00.

You know what the people that didn't get the deal said to those of us that got it? They said 'gratz' (well, the early seventies equivalent, anyway). They didn't cry. They didn't demand. It was us united against the man and they were vicariously happy to see the man getting his due.

So, keeping that little anecdote in mind, I say gratz to my fellow players for sticking it to our corporate overlords.

Way to strike another blow for the underclass brothers!

Mr Epeen Cool
Dicnar
MAFIA
Coca Cola Cowboys
#159 - 2013-10-28 18:44:49 UTC
NEWS !
Reverse scammer Amazon use the old eve market trick and put the "." in the wrong place.
Bohawke
#160 - 2013-10-28 19:05:31 UTC
polly papercut wrote:
As long as prices of plex goes back down. They should not be anywhere near 600 Mil. Dual Training should never have made a ******* change in the market.
People are to ******* stupid to see that plex prices are way over what they should be..


I just have to say Polly's avatar has the most spanktastic "assets" on any avatar in EVE...

I'm just here for the laughs...