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Inflation in EVE
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Charles Edisson
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2011-11-17 22:39:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Charles Edisson
Dear CCP you need to get a grip on inflation in the game.

After you removed one of the largest processes of removing isk (Buying POS fuel from NPC corps) and massively increased the supply (quantitative easing) of isk with incursions the total amount of isk in the game is increasing at a stupidly unsustainable rate.

I know you are predominantly Icelandic and don’t have a brilliant handle on financial issues but you need to stabilise the trade deficit in the game. (Too much isk is being created and not a corresponding amount destroyed). Please fix it. I know you have a dedicated financial analyst to assist you. Is he advising ???? is he being listened to ????
Roger Soros
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#2 - 2011-11-17 22:52:20 UTC
Man the overflow of isk come from entire corps made of bots that are farming in null 24/7
Zircon Dasher
#3 - 2011-11-17 23:04:17 UTC
OP graduated top of his class from the University of Fox News school of Economics.

true story!

Nerfing High-sec is never the answer. It is the question. The answer is 'YES'.
mxzf
Shovel Bros
#4 - 2011-11-17 23:17:42 UTC
Please tell me where you're seeing inflation, so I can tell you that you're wrong.
Alx Warlord
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2011-11-17 23:36:43 UTC
PLEX prices?

Please read these!

New POS system New SOV system
Pelador Rova
No Luck Corp
#6 - 2011-11-17 23:39:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Pelador Rova
Alx Warlord wrote:
PLEX prices?


Easy misconception.

If inflation was in fact a serious problem it would influence prices accross the market.

I suspect the increase in Plex prices is due to the popularity of the winter expansion and more people plexing further or re-awakeining asleep Clones. Simply put a supply and demand issue from an increase in plexing.
mxzf
Shovel Bros
#7 - 2011-11-17 23:41:32 UTC
Alx Warlord wrote:
PLEX prices?


That's not inflation, that's one good on the market changing price due to changes in supply and demand and a bunch of speculators. Changes in one good isn't inflation, it's a fluctuating market. Inflation is when ALL goods increase in price due to a decrease in the purchasing power of a currency.
Elvis Preslie
NRDS Securities
Apocalypse Now.
#8 - 2011-11-18 01:10:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Elvis Preslie
Roger Soros wrote:
Man the overflow of isk come from entire corps made of bots that are farming in null 24/7


yes this is the huge problem AND ccp is inflating the game on purpose trying to generate more REAL income for theirselves, thinking it will solve the problem.

the real problem IS BOT MINING AND ccp knows of bot mining and THINKS its a good thing through having to have multiple accounts BUT they are too dumb financially, as the creator of this thread said, to realize these accounts are being paid for with ONLY plex. Meaning they make so much bot mining they pay for their play time and ccp gets 0 out of a bot miner with 10 accounts.

When ccp wants to get off their ass and make sure no exploits or hacks are possible, they will start making money. Until then, they will just ruin the game more with tactics like INTENTIONAL inflation We're already paying for a game we have to fix ourselves through bug repots and using ALPHA version; i even filed a bug report months ago, got a reply of "will be fixed in upcoming patch", and here, ten patches later and five months down the road, its still not fixed or touched.
Adunh Slavy
#9 - 2011-11-18 01:12:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Adunh Slavy
Just about everything in Eve takes time and effort to produce (labor) that includes ISK. ISK is just another commodity, unlike most of the money in the real world that takes little more than someone typing in some numbers on a keyboard.

Sooner or later producing wealth from ISK faucets will be worth less per unit of time than producing wealth from some other source. But with a caveat ...

There are few goofy things about eve that are different from the real world, one that is overlooked is that, although there are some inelastic supply items in Eve, there's not much in the way of inelastic demand items in Eve. In some ways, a player has to go out of their way to put them selves into a position that requires them to have an inelastic demand, and then if prices get too high, they can just pack it up and not worry about it.

The net effect of this is that, it will take longer than would be usual, in a commodity money based system, for the demand for wealth to move from ISK to some other commodity.

It will happen sooner or later. The trick is navigating the landscape. Inflation is an issue in Eve no doubt, but it is not the doomsday that it would be in the real world with a fiat debt money.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
mxzf
Shovel Bros
#10 - 2011-11-18 01:19:00 UTC
Elvis Preslie wrote:
Meaning they make so much bot mining they pay for their play time and ccp gets 0 out of a bot miner with 10 accounts.


You do realize that CCP actually makes MORE money from people paying via PLEX, right? For every month paid via PLEX, CCP gets $17.5, rather than $15, because two PLEX costs $35. CCP doesn't care what account uses the PLEX, all they care about is that someone paid them for the PLEX.
Pelador Rova
No Luck Corp
#11 - 2011-11-18 01:47:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Pelador Rova
If Mining bots were to blame you'd expect to see a inflation problem spread accross the market gradually for the time period that they have been around for. And if they are just Plex generators wouldnt it be a gradual increase again over this same period *breathe*.

Seeing as the plex "spike" coincides with the winter expansion PR announcements should offer another reinforcing clue?

I know which makes sense to me.
Alx Warlord
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2011-11-18 02:02:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Alx Warlord
mxzf wrote:
Elvis Preslie wrote:
Meaning they make so much bot mining they pay for their play time and ccp gets 0 out of a bot miner with 10 accounts.


You do realize that CCP actually makes MORE money from people paying via PLEX, right? For every month paid via PLEX, CCP gets $17.5, rather than $15, because two PLEX costs $35. CCP doesn't care what account uses the PLEX, all they care about is that someone paid them for the PLEX.


So the more "ISK woth" is the PLEX, more people will buy it with RL money?
Also less real players will PLAY to PLAY and BOT corps will need MORE BOTS to suply the ISK demand...
Then we will have more BOTS and less RL players...

Keep in mind... In USA the base income is about 15,080.00 USD/ year while in my country it is 3,674.00 USD/ year, so the "feeling" of these $15 here seams like $61, so i pay most of my gaming time using PLEX because $61/Month is allot of money for me now... Like it is for allot of people outside EUA and Europe that love and cant afford paying EVE...

So it is really not fair this huge amount of bots consuming all the PLEX of the market, leaving real players without playing; This decreases the EVE playerbase that would be more profitable for ccp in the future....

(Probably in a couple of years i will be graduated and working on a good job... so i will pay the game more often...)

Please read these!

New POS system New SOV system
Sigras
Conglomo
#13 - 2011-11-18 07:48:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Sigras
#1 the PLEX is basically the exchange rate between the USD (or whatever currency you use) and the ISK so this makes it the perfect indicator of inflation.
#2 their economist either isnt listened to, or isnt exactly top draw . . . IIRC he was employed at CCP when the decision was made to simultaneously increase the yield of Dysprosium by 100x and decrease its demand
#3 Everyone says "I saw this coming, but I have proof: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1305311&page=7#196 Posts 187 and 196
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#14 - 2011-11-18 08:03:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Tanya Powers
Charles Edisson wrote:
Dear CCP you need to get a grip on inflation in the game.

After you removed one of the largest processes of removing isk (Buying POS fuel from NPC corps) and massively increased the supply (quantitative easing) of isk with incursions the total amount of isk in the game is increasing at a stupidly unsustainable rate.

I know you are predominantly Icelandic and don’t have a brilliant handle on financial issues but you need to stabilise the trade deficit in the game. (Too much isk is being created and not a corresponding amount destroyed). Please fix it. I know you have a dedicated financial analyst to assist you. Is he advising ???? is he being listened to ????


What about you guys complaining there's too much isk in the game:

-stop market sell/buy orders

-stop grind missions/lp's

-stop thinking

-stop whining

-stop asking mom to adress the shït you made of that market: player driven economy

If there's someone that must do something and seriously is you, the market players.

Cry me a river
Sigras
Conglomo
#15 - 2011-11-18 10:54:08 UTC
normally im all about placing the blame on the players for stuff, but this is a fundamental game mechanic which cant and shouldnt be controlled by the players.

Its a huge deal because you risk trivializing game content, IE if everyone has trillions paying 20 million a day for a cyno jammer becomes a trivial thing, or spending billions on titan BPOs or skillbooks would cease to be expensive even if everything else scales with player prices. Also missioning or plexing would be useless because, who cares if you can make 20 million isk per hour running level fours when that wont even buy you a T2 fit frigate?

There is simply more isk flowing into the game than is leaving and that is eventually going to be a problem . . .

And as im so fond of saying . . . I told you so.
Azahni Vah'nos
Vah'nos Family
#16 - 2011-11-18 13:42:18 UTC
Sigras wrote:
normally im all about placing the blame on the players for stuff, but this is a fundamental game mechanic which cant and shouldnt be controlled by the players.

Its a huge deal because you risk trivializing game content, IE if everyone has trillions paying 20 million a day for a cyno jammer becomes a trivial thing, or spending billions on titan BPOs or skillbooks would cease to be expensive even if everything else scales with player prices. Also missioning or plexing would be useless because, who cares if you can make 20 million isk per hour running level fours when that wont even buy you a T2 fit frigate?

There is simply more isk flowing into the game than is leaving and that is eventually going to be a problem . . .

And as im so fond of saying . . . I told you so.

I find it interesting how many people don't understand this. The exact same thing has happened in other games where the in-game currency became so easy to come by that prices of even low level items skyrocketed. I have to wonder who is driving the bus at CCP ... and at this stage it's looking like the bus from the movie Speed.

The usual end result of this process is that well established players will deal with it because they usually already have their currency making schemes, but it becomes a major barrier for new players.

Nex (Cash Shop) / Aurum - removing sand from the sandbox since Incarna. Currently the only use for aurum is to buy virtual items in the in-game store, but Cockerill expects to expand its uses in the future.