Player Features and Ideas Discussion

So, by your own admission, your beef with these ships is about a frame of reference you have no interest or experience in? And, curiously, the frame of reference you DO have is running Level 4 missions? And, judging by your eveboard at http://eveboard.com/pilot/Tyberius_Franklin/standings , you seem to have an awfully high standings with the Servant Sisters of Eve.

Ladies and gentlemen, I give you a textbook Ulterior Motive.

with those recent changes to the statios you hit the exploration aspect on it sooo much harder and missed the actual pvp bound issue almost entirely

the main reason I see why it would be OP is that it can be fit as shieldgank with blasters and lows full of damage doing 1085dps
THAT is what should be nerfed without nerfing the pve capabilities
for pve you could hardly run lasers on it anyway so the changing of the bonus did litle


here is what you should be doing:

Option 1
remove all hardpoints I thought about leaving 2 and giving it 100% to laser damage but as I said laser can hardly be run due to cap consumption with no hardpoints it would still be able to do 845dps just like the gila

Option 2
another path that would actually be even better (I think) is to move two meds to lows all you need for pve is an ab a OdTL and a hacker/analizer (with the mobile hangar thing coming up you can refit in space) you can use cap relays in the lows for cap stability
yes, this would allow it to fit a better armor tank but it would not make it too powerful since a certain other ship called the vigilant has about the same dps/tank ratio is faster and its dps can not be destroyed

Actually, I'm finishing Amarr cruiser 5 today . But you're right, I'm a bit angry, and maybe not justifiably so. But I would like to point out that its not about changing ships at all, its about getting your combat ship to the actual site. This is the sticking point. What we wanted was a good plex runner that had the ability to travel safely. This is important because in the plex-running world, expensive ships and mods are absolutely worth the investment, so plex running ships are expensive. What we have now is a plex runner that is strictly inferior to a plex ishtar, gila, or tengu. And not just a little inferior, very inferior. Its great that it can probe and do hacking sites, but as a primary combat ship it'll be relegated to lowsec plexes only. Maybe I'll use it as supplemental probing dps and hacking while I run a different ship as the primary.

The other issue is how and why it was nerfed. Everyone could see that the ship was crazy OP being a high dps cloaky warper. But removing 25mbit of bandwidth doesn't change this one bit, while being a significant nerf to its PVE ability. Again, I was really hoping it would just get a sensor recalibration penalty. Particularly considering the lasers can be used for PVP, but will hardly ever be used in its PVE role.

well if they were to strip some highs to allow for 5th drone it ends up with lots of utility highs which would make it be even more OP than it already is being +1 slot up on other drone boats

It can still use those as utility highs now. 4 neuts + 4 sentries/heavies with full tackle and double web is still doable with this iteration. On the other hand we'd be looking at 2 neuts and 0.875 more effective drones. Conversely the 4 blaster(or whatever other turret) + drones fit is pretty well neutered compared to the current iteration, albeit admittedly probably forcing a neut into the fit.

Now consider 2 Statios vs Ishtar&Helios.
Then consider Ishtar+Stratios.

In both of those situations you are probably running a 6/10 faster than just a solo Ishtar with a prober helping it find the sites fast.

My complaints with the ships are still.
The Astero does need that third high. Cloak, Probes, Salvager/Remote Reps/Cyno.
Simply fitting Cloak & Probes leaves you no utility highs & no turret DPS, meaning your drones have to be DPS drones.

The Stratios needs a better laser bonus. Or CCP need to scrap the whole laser bonus idea. It is not fulfilling it's role as a combined laser/drone ship with current bonuses. & as such is a largely wasted bonus. 3 Turret slots (Since 90% of actually used fits will have at least 2 utility) with a 37.5% bonus to Optimal & Damage come out with similar laser DPS, lower cap use, and slightly less range than we have currently, which avoids stepping on any other optimal bonused laser ships toes, while providing a clear reason to use lasers over other turrets (But not negating the advantages of other turrets in certain side cases).
The Expanded Probe launcher should be given a CPU buff on the Stratios. It's silly that you have to train to a single ship class that is meant to be a 'generalist' class while no ship in the T1 or T2 range (Especially the specialist T2 range) gets any bonus to fitting a combat probe launcher. & as such fitting one uses over 1/3rd of your CPU up instantly. Horribly gimping the fit for any other uses.

Peopel that think this thing now suddenly cannto kill things.. need to

A) learn to play

B) train a bit more than 2 M skillpoints...

Third high isn't necessary. Salvage, and armor rep maintenance drones are all you need in this little guy. Necessary is the keyword.

Right now, SOE ships will gain a T2 ship only bonus (covert op cloaking devices). I think it is a bad idea, It would be better if they had a speed bonus when cloaked (like black ops ?). There is no T1 cov ops modules, there should be no T1 ships able to fit them.
Note that I don't want the guristas line to be able to fit a bastion module either.

Looks like Guristas ships will loose the drone focused bonuses they have right now. As a result there will be no more shield tanked drone boats in the game. I also think it's a bad idea to loose this versatility.

I would give role bonuses to drones for SOE ships and only role bonuses (fixed hit point bonus, orbital speed and MWD speed so ogres can become way scarier maybe sensor strength of electronic warfare drones...). This way the ships and its drones are both mobile. The +10 virus strength and the bonus to scanning fits perfectly SOE so I think it should stay this way.
For skill-dependent bonuses (amarr/gallente frigate/cruiser) I would focus on tracking + damage bonuses for lasers (no one wants to use them for lasers so far) and tanking.

It's not that it matters so much, it's that what was affected was not the concern, and there were much better ways to fix it. If you have a problem, resolve it. Our bike had three wheels and we just had our seat cut in half to minimize mass weight. My question to you would be the same, "Why gaining 20% of a fifth drone matter so much?" So, then the divide between us is the application of the necessary nerf: Was it applied to the best possible spot on the ship? Could there have been a better spot? My position is a very emphatic yes, and that point has been detailed thoroughly with numerous options in this thread.

Furthermore, I think CCP is missing an opportunity to really hit a grand slam with this ship for the Rubicon update. It's a signficant update, and opening up the discussion once more would be the right thing to do since many good points are being made. Properly nerfing the ship and bringing it to the middle would be the best.