Warfare & Tactics

A brawler Condor with rocket/neut/ab/scram/web/MSE would have worked. It has enough dps to force the two reps to be on and the neut will make them eat through their navy 400's.

It's also a fun ship to troll people who see a Condor in a plex, grab their mwd/scram frig of choice and proceed to die horribly when they're the ones that end up scrammed and webbed.

Just make sure to sit 30km from the timer and pretend you're afk/clueless.

There's an assumption that all dual rep Incursii are using blasters. What happens if the dual repper is using 125mm rails?

There is definitely enough powergrid to fit 3 x 125mm IIs on a dual-rep incursus, even with modest skills. I'll post the fit if you want. You can fit 2 x 125s and a 150 if your fitting skills are good enough.

So scram range kiting against a rail / dual rep incursus at 7km is great for the incursus - that's just the optimal for 125mm IIs with CNA. Even with dual tracking disruption, the rail-repper can switch to much longer range ammo and still hit. Plus you're scrammed if you're inside 9k, slowing down to where the tracking on the 125 IIs is sufficient to score decent hits even if you're orbitting with an AB.

Although the dual repper is burning through cap booster charges to keep everything running, it lasts well over five minutes and with skills at V and proper rigs can restore more than 102 EHP a second. Enough to make a dent in all but the tankiest / dampiest of kites.

I agree that the blaster fit dual repper gets caned by some kites if they wriggle out of its grasp, but the rail fit dual repper is way more adaptable, however.

I'd have to test it, but the dual repper fit I use has a max cap of 407.5 GJ, carries 13 Navy Cap Booster 400s and can pump one in every 22 seconds or so. Without the cap boosters, and with everything running, cap lasts about 30 seconds. With skilful management (watching the cap and mod cycles carefully before lobbing in a 400) you can squeeze 7 minutes out of it in some fights. Cap booster 200s are a bit easier to run, but they're not as time efficient. 400s are the way to go.

By my reckoning, even with that Condor's neut running and sucking out 54GJ every six seconds, I think the incursus would be able to operate for 70-80 seconds without capping out - plus it can instantly 'recap' to maximum once reloaded and ready. This assumes the incursus does in fact need to run both reppers at max capacity continually from the outset, which you often don't. You don't need to switch them on for a bit until shields are well down, plus for shorter fights generally the combo of SAR + SAAR is better.

Plus - that neut is gobbling down 34GJ of the condor's cap every six seconds, not to mention the scram, web and AB cap requirements. How long is that going to last?

I don't want you to think that I'm particularly batting for the incursus, or on the cusp of getting "Incursus dual-rep FTW" tattooed on my face or something, but it's a dangerous game getting into a cocky neut battle against a ship that's carrying the equivalent of 13 normal frigate capacitors in its hold in one go.

This is a bit of a theorycrafting battle, but assume, as you suggest, the preferred optimal on both sides is 6km so the Condor can get the neut running nicely.

Here's the incursus fit so you can see what I'm talking about:

3 x 125mm Railgun IIs with CNA.

1MN Afterburner II
Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I
Small Capacitor Booster II with Navy Cap Booster 400s

Damage Control II
Tracking Enhancer II
Small Armor Repairer II
Small Ancilliary Armour Repairer with Nanite

Small Anti-Explosive Pump I
Small Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Small Nanobot Accelerator I

Hobgoblin II

The Incursus does 112 DPS including the drone with max skills, has EHP of 3440, reps 102.3 EHP per second before the Nanite runs out - and can cap boost 400GJ every 22-23 seconds for 13 rounds - almost precisely 300 seconds.


The Condor does 112 DPS with max skills (assuming faction Scourge rockets), has EHP of 3847.5 and is cap stable at 46.7% even with the neut running. Which is nice.

Condor's shield recharge 16.4 EHP per second, I believe.

Assuming no evasive moves - just standing and blapping at optimal - this gives the incursus about 70-80 seconds of play before the cap starts running out and the shield reppers stop working - although, again, it can quickly reboost once the reloading cycle is complete.

60-70 seconds is more than enough for the incursus to see off the Condor, IMHO. It certainly won't be a pushover for the Condor. But, as always, pilot skill comes into play.

You need AB/web to use rails.

Otherwise you will just have a lot of fights where you can't hit ****.

Rails without a web. Condor orbits at 500 meters. Dead Incursus.

They don't.

Stop being bad.

I'm basing that on over 150 kills with an Incursus.


And stalking,

1. Trimark? wtf? bad
2. Needs moar magstab
3. Use an AAR.

All joking aside, are you actually seriously suggesting that rails do no damage, at any range, unless your opponent is webbed?

Seriously?

I know they're not "F1 and win" like rockets, but it simply isn't correct that the tracking on rails is so awful that they don't hit against anything other than a static, webbed target. At 500m, agreed, they struggle, but we started this debate talking about 7km as the range at which the repping incursus was going to get owned by rockets. They hit fine at 7km.

and without a web how exactly are you going to keep an opponent from orbiting you close? do tell.

I know that rails hit fine at 7 km.. But you need the web to keep your enemies there.