Ships & Modules

Look im not here to get flamed, but i feel like a lot fo changes are being made that are having a negative impact on my game experiance and it only feels right for me to complain about it in a setting where people will hopefully lisn and discuss it. I

quit even for a short bit (family issues) and i just recently came back. I fly strictly minmatar, always have. All of my skills are in gunnery, and my collection of ships are fitted to reflect my skills. I have spent lots of time and money training my skills and purchasing ships and fitting them out. Why has ccp decided to nerf minmatar so much. For example, my sleipnir, not a chap ship, and to properly fit is is not cheap either. Why was it deemed neccessary to drop 1 high slot, 2 turret hardpoints, and add a second launcher hardpoint?!? First off, minmatar is not a large missle faction, WE USE GUNS! This ship now does half the dps for me because i have very little missle skills. Same with the Cane, and they've completely ruined the claymore. CCP, you guys cant create a faction designed and geared twords one thing then completely flip a 180 after so many years. i dont know the right words to use, but it's just not cool. if i wanted to use missles i would gop fly caldari, thats how it's always been, why should that change? And if you are going to add missles to minmatar, dont do it to every ship. you can have the claymore, but leave my sleipnir alone. i can understand having a missle variant and a gun variant. but you made a missle boat and a hybrid. there is no pure gun boat in the command class now. i feel like im being punished for busting my rear to get where i am....I'm sure im not the only one that feels like this.....

Every faction has had ship re dues. The fact is the game needs to change to keep people rolling. I think it's great that they changed hard points on a few ships makes people re think fittings so there is no the one universal fit makes people have to adapt. You don't have middle skills train them. I fly Amarr only at the moment but I have middle and rocket skills for other ships that they have. One of my faction interceptors is rockets but if it's smart why rockets they use lasers. That doesn't bother me because it's variation. Think of the added launcher slot as a bonus. Now people have to think harder to find a good counter cit to your ship.

While I don't agree with the Op that ship changes are bad, I highly agree that minmatar are getting shafted big time.
It started with the rifter being relegated to junk frig status, then the abomination that is now the cane... and hasnt gotten any better from there.
Minmatar now have the worst T2 combat lineup by a pretty wide margin, along with zero viable armour ships outside of the phoon and loki.

That's the sad things about balance, whoever was previously king of the hill often gets shafted massively because while everything gets buffed around it, they usually stay the same or take a light nerf which often ends in said race being the worst for the next couple years. During the balance changes if someone suggested to buff a Minmatar ship (like the rifter during frig balancing), they would likely get laughed out of the thread, however now that the dust has settled it's clear that the Rifter needs a buff (something more than the +50 armor and 1pg that was given during the second round).

Stop whining, Minmatar ships are more balanced now than ever. Sure, there are a couple of hulls (in each race, not only in Minmatar) that need another pass, and it will happen.



Because all CSs got the same treatment. All now (with the only exception being the Eos drone boat) have 5 primary weapon hardpoints, and a couple free slots for links/cap warfare or secondary weapons. Sleip is actually better now than it was before, you got more place for neuts and waste less ammo...C:

1) all races now have two weapon systems
2) sleip is one of the strongest ships in game

waaaah sleipner waaah. Review the "illustrious" history of the loleos.

waaaah missiles waaah. Consider the pirate droneboats (and why I never and still don't fly them as a drone boat pilot).

Sleipnir a bad ship?? really?

Arty fit you get a nice bang for your buck, ACs fit as said above have now a tiny less effective turrets but (the but that hurts) +launchers on top AND can fit drones also, so yes does a bit more dps in the end.
Sleipnir has a very good tank, I simply regret it's so dam slow (imho) but you better watch your back to see you have friends behind if you see one Sleip around well flown.

Fit it with 11.25effective turrets 2 med neuts lows full of dmg mods, mwd point tank and tell us more Sleipnir is a bad ship!!
It's at least 5 times tougher than previous Canopownmobile and also has more dps...

Why do you guys keep moaning just because those aren't the "I win" button anymore? -it's good other races got buff to be able to compete with them, now you either know how to fly minmatar and you're still looking like that old pilot all teeth out laughing like a fool, or you just get powned because you never won with your skills but with an "I win" button.

TBH the only thing about rebalance passes I haven't been a fan of is drone proliferation and I'll give you some examples of what I'm talking about as clearly that statement can't really be obvious about what I mean.

First off, I'm completely fine with ships that are designed as drone boats being drone boats (Arbitrator, Vexor, Dominix, Tristan, Dragoon, etc.) these ships are needed to fill the drone emphasis of these races and add flavor to the line ups, so having high bandwidth and a bay that supports multiple waves of drones is fine for these ships.

Where the addition of relatively large drone bays is an issue for me is on other ship types with things like a Cruicifier for example. Okay only two high slots doesn't make this ship a damage monster or anything and I even support giving it limited drones to allow it some measure of relevancy should a missile frigate or something warp in. Why does it need a 45m bay though? Even the Maulus doesn't get that much and it has too many replacements as well. Bandwidth and bay of 15/15 should have been fine for the Cruicifier as this is an e-war frigate, not a drone boat. How about a Heron, T1 probing frigate with 15/35, enough drone ability that you actually see them as unbonused e-war platforms on occasion due to their large number of mids and the fact that it carries enough drones that solo against some ships is not impossible. For me it really is less a bandwidth issue and more a bay issue that irks me, I'm fine with a lot of ships having some drones but if you're not a drone carrier I don't think you should be carrying multiple waves or potentially some big utility drone bay.

For the most part this applies to frigates like the ones I mentioned, cruisers and above I largely have no issues with only a handful of exceptions (Harb for example, Prophecy and Myrmidon are fine with the big bay as they are drone ships). I don't consider this to be a huge issue or anything but I would prefer that non-drone boats need to bring smaller ships or combat frigates if they are worried about being held down by a frigate that might pop their drones and leave them helpless. Aside from that I have been very happy to see a much wider array of things being flown and used effectively as it keeps the game a lot more interesting. I was getting very tired of seeing that Reddish-Orange background behind the ship on 90% of killmails for so long, I was starting to see it as the backdrop in my dreams.

Most of the ships that appear at first glance to have been nerfed are often just shifted a bit, saw this a lot with the Harb losing a turret but having the damage bonus ramped up meant that it was actually a dps increase with high skills for example but it took people a hundred pages or so to get that and you're seeing it again right now with the Ares with people crying over split bonuses which when you look at are split double bonuses so pick turrets or missiles fit a full rack and you get a doubled up bonus to that weapon similar to a Taranis' 10% hybrid damage bonus. Minmatar are not as bad as people make them out to be, there are some ships in every line that are still on the hurting side but this is hardly Minmatar exclusive. Additionally I see this in every game I've ever played that makes balance changes and seem to be the only one noticing the trend so I'm going to capitalize this bit. IF EVERYONE IN THE GAME IS TAKING THE SAME OPTIONS DESPITE A LARGE SELECTION DEVS WILL NERF ITEM(S) X ASSUMING IT IS BEING USED SO MUCH DUE TO IT BEING OVERPOWERED. If you want to prove that item(s) X is not overpowered make a habit of doing as well or better with some of the other options available and convince a chunk of the community there are other options before the devs have a long time to sit and ponder why item(s) X is so popular to the exclusion of all else. If you can not do this then chances are the devs have a point. The term Winmatar is not exactly a distant memory, but it was the fact that everyone had been using those ships that caused Minmatar to get the least love in the balance passes.

TWO 10% damage per level bonuses, 10% falloff bonus, no missile bonuses. Yep its a gun boat. I bet you think the marauders aren't true gun boats because they only get 4 turrets?