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NPC's Tracking Is Now Insane

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Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#41 - 2013-10-14 08:39:46 UTC
Katrina Oniseki wrote:
Katrina Oniseki wrote:
By the way, you should have said it was Sansha, because Amarr battleships don't even deal as much damage as Sansha battleships. 294 maximum damage per hit.

That makes your claim of 400 even more ridiculous.

Try again.



WrATH2Zero wrote:

I can do that assuming I get the same mission against against Amarr but until then I guess everyone will call me a troll and it can't happen......


Don't mistake me. I'm not calling you a troll.

I'm calling you a liar.


Haha Big smile

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
WrATH2Zero
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#42 - 2013-10-14 08:40:16 UTC  |  Edited by: WrATH2Zero
Katrina Oniseki wrote:
Katrina Oniseki wrote:
By the way, you should have said it was Sansha, because Amarr battleships don't even deal as much damage as Sansha battleships. 294 maximum damage per hit.

That makes your claim of 400 even more ridiculous.

Try again.



WrATH2Zero wrote:

I can do that assuming I get the same mission against against Amarr but until then I guess everyone will call me a troll and it can't happen......


Don't mistake me. I'm not calling you a troll.

I'm calling you a liar.


You're calling me a liar based on what? It could be a bug but you seem to want to call users liars for no reason because you can't properly explain it yourself.
Katrina Oniseki
Oniseki-Raata Internal Watch
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#43 - 2013-10-14 08:42:05 UTC
http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/inventory.php?group_id=667
http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/item.php?type_id=29678
http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/item.php?type_id=29677
http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/item.php?type_id=29676

Where are your numbers? Where's your evidence? Where's your links to some EVE data? Do you have anything other than your own word to back what you're saying? Anything at all? Even a friend?

So far the only thing you've managed to do is back yourself into a corner with some **** about wonky tracking mechanics.

Explain to me how a ship that can barely deal 300 damage in a perfect scenario hit you for 400 with your resistances, angular velocity, and signature radius. Please. Do some math and work that one out for me. Actually, no... don't even bother with the math. I want you to come up with a believable excuse for how the **** the game could do that and you're the only one whose noticed a 33% increase in damage dealt while simultaneously ignoring the fundamental game mechanics of tanking.

Just give me one convincing reason for how that could possibly happen. Please. I'm waiting.

All I see is tears and bullshitting.

Katrina Oniseki
WrATH2Zero
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#44 - 2013-10-14 08:47:53 UTC  |  Edited by: WrATH2Zero
Katrina Oniseki wrote:
http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/inventory.php?group_id=667
http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/item.php?type_id=29678
http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/item.php?type_id=29677
http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/item.php?type_id=29676

Where are your numbers? Where's your evidence? Where's your links to some EVE data? Do you have anything other than your own word to back what you're saying? Anything at all? Even a friend?

So far the only thing you've managed to do is back yourself into a corner with some **** about wonky tracking mechanics.

Explain to me how a ship that can barely deal 300 damage in a perfect scenario hit you for 400 with your resistances, angular velocity, and signature radius. Please. Do some math and work that one out for me. Actually, no... don't even bother with the math. I want you to come up with a believable excuse for how the **** the game could do that and you're the only one whose noticed a 33% increase in damage dealt while simultaneously ignoring the fundamental game mechanics of tanking.

Just give me one convincing reason for how that could possibly happen. Please. I'm waiting.

All I see is tears and bullshitting.


Oh right, so my words are worth nothing because you think so? If it's a game bug then you're going to look so stupid attacking me for no good reason, because oh, you don't believe me and I have nothing better to do than lie about the game I've been playing.

I don't come on this forum very often at all, I can see why I shouldn't bother again.
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#45 - 2013-10-14 08:50:00 UTC


Considering the massive spike in L4 mission running at the present time


it does stand to reason


that others would have noticed




And likewise been righteously indignant

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#46 - 2013-10-14 08:50:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Ramona McCandless
WrATH2Zero wrote:


Oh right, so my words are worth nothing because you think so? If it's a game bug then you're going to look so stupid attacking me for no good reason, because oh, you don't believe me and I have nothing better to do than lie about the game I've been playing.

I don't come on this forum very often at all, I can see why I shouldn't bother again.




Someone doth protest too much


and gets angry


I for one am now convinced he must be telling the truth

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Katrina Oniseki
Oniseki-Raata Internal Watch
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#47 - 2013-10-14 08:51:33 UTC
WrATH2Zero wrote:

I don't come on this forum very often at all, I can see why I shouldn't bother again.


Great idea!

Don't let the door hit you on the way out, pumpkin.

Katrina Oniseki
Azeroth Uluntil
Last Chance for Redemption
FFEW Associates
#48 - 2013-10-14 08:55:34 UTC
Wrong section of the forum, genius.

Ps, your fit likely sucks.

The person calling you out has provided you with the damage tables of the npcs in question, so I gather you are grossly mistaken.
Alduin666 Shikkoken
Doomheim
#49 - 2013-10-14 08:56:02 UTC
So let me get this straight. you come to the forums looking for an answer (which could have been found much easier and earlier in the Missions and Complexes subforum) and when we all give you answers as to why we think your problem is happening, you call us wrong and belittle us? If you are calling someone wrong then you know what the problem is and shouldn't have asked in the first place. Don't back into a corner and assume that we are mocking you when we are trying to give suggestions. The only reason people have started getting hostile towards you is because you are trying to give answers as to why we are wrong when you don't even know what the hell is going on in the first place.

Carebear logic™

Honor is a fools prize. [I]Glory is of no use to the dead.[/I]

Be a man! Post with your main! ~Vas'Avi Community Manager
WrATH2Zero
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#50 - 2013-10-14 09:02:32 UTC
Katrina Oniseki wrote:
WrATH2Zero wrote:

I don't come on this forum very often at all, I can see why I shouldn't bother again.


Great idea!

Don't let the door hit you on the way out, pumpkin.


I guess there are so many stupid people on these forums, that's why you have so many likes to your name which you live up to by that comment.
Sointu Luonnotar
Doomheim
#51 - 2013-10-14 09:03:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Sointu Luonnotar
WrATH2Zero wrote:


I did a minmatar L4 mission against Amarr, one of their battleships hit me for over 400 with 81% EM resistence on my Tengu while moving full speed. I've also noticed hits getting bigger in general missions, it's like a bug where the hits ignore the some of the shield resistence, that's what I'm saying.


Okay, this is probably Smash The Supplier and yes they do insane amounts of damage, I have maximum tanking skills and with great pains managed to do it in a supertanked Dominix. And this was before they made NPC's switch fire on drones. After that I never did it again, better ways to spend my time than hours on a single mission. Sure the tags are worth a pretty penny but not enough.

I know you're supposed to do it in a fast ship with great firepower, even still the NPC's spawn way too fast, couldn't kill the enemies nearly fast enough and eventually had to warp out due to the increasing damage. The ship I had had the theoretical DPS of 1200, and probably applied 800 of it. Still not enough.

The second to last mission in the Gallente Epic Arc also has insane damage profile.




But, I have not noticed any change in enemy damage potential. Normal missions do not do any more damage than usual. If you think so, you're just paranoid. Or just stoned.
WrATH2Zero
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#52 - 2013-10-14 09:08:25 UTC  |  Edited by: WrATH2Zero
Sointu Luonnotar wrote:
WrATH2Zero wrote:


I did a minmatar L4 mission against Amarr, one of their battleships hit me for over 400 with 81% EM resistence on my Tengu while moving full speed. I've also noticed hits getting bigger in general missions, it's like a bug where the hits ignore the some of the shield resistence, that's what I'm saying.


Okay, this is probably Smash The Supplier and yes they do insane amounts of damage, I have maximum tanking skills and with great pains managed to do it in a supertanked Dominix. And this was before they made NPC's switch fire on drones. After that I never did it again, better ways to spend my time than hours on a single mission. Sure the tags are worth a pretty penny but not enough.

I know you're supposed to do it in a fast ship with great firepower, even still the NPC's spawn way too fast, couldn't kill the enemies nearly fast enough and eventually had to warp out due to the increasing damage. The ship I had had the theoretical DPS of 1200, and probably applied 800 of it. Still not enough.

The second to last mission in the Gallente Epic Arc also has insane damage profile.




But, I have not noticed any change in enemy damage potential. Normal missions do not do any more damage than usual. If you think so, you're just paranoid. Or just stoned.


You're correct, it was that mission, finally someone with some sense who knows what I'm talking about. SO is it this specific mission then?

I just didn't quite understand how I was taking so much damage because I've never seen those damage numbers show before.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#53 - 2013-10-14 09:11:13 UTC
WrATH2Zero wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
WrATH2Zero wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
For the record, how a ship is positioned or positions itself has no bearing on its ability to hit you. Only its relative speed and its paralax in conjunction to you matters. 400 is nothing damage from a BS, whether you're taking that damage on a Tengu OR a Raven, it's still nothing. If you want to see some REAL battleship damage, I've got a Navy Megathron that pumps out 1000dps and tanks for over 250K ehp. If that's too much for you, I will fight your Tengu with my Myrmidon instead. That MIGHT be a challenge for me, but given that your Tengu is probably mission fit, maybe not, and I understand if you want to keep doing easy stuff like missions instead.

Also, your EM and thermal resists might be high, but that doesn't mean the NPCs you're fighting aren't doing kinetic and/or explosive in this one case that you decided to check combat logs, but 400-600 a hit is still **** all damage for a battleship.


HELLO, anyone home? PVE. 400 hit by an NPC is actually high........


No it's not.


Show me your combat log then, yopu keep saying it not, I guess you don't even do PvE L4 high sec missions.


You're right. I'm too busy with PVP. I guess that means you know more about EVE than me.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#54 - 2013-10-14 09:16:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
WrATH2Zero wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
WrATH2Zero wrote:
Mra Rednu wrote:
A lot of people in the mission community think CCP stealth coded NPC bs's to hit T3's harder by negating the Sig radius in the dice roll, basically making them hit you as hard as they would a BS.

It's hopefully only a quick fix until the nerf highsec missions and/or the T3's, apart from the legion which everyone agree's needs a buff.

Some guy's done a comparision on a few missions in a Tengu and frappsed the changes to show the diference from a few months ago and now on the same couple of missions.

link here

As you can see eyebrow raising results, ofc this is just a theory of a few people but could be the reason.


Fair enough but the video failed like a troll.


Then it's an even match for your entire thread failing like a troll.


Or the simple fact is you lack any kind of understanding of what I'm talking about, so please **** off if you can't contribute in a meaningful way.


For the record, kiddo, I've flown level 4s in T1 battlecruisers, DED 4/10s in Atrons, and I've soloed with some of the best PVPers around. I don't always win, I don't pretend I'm the best, but I do know a little something about EVE. 400 damage is NEVER high for a battleship. Never ever ever ever ever. Not for level 4s, not for level 5s, not for PVP, not for DEDs, not for nul/low/high, just not ever. I do more damage in a Brutix. If you can't hack 400 damage from a battleship, you're playing the wrong game.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104
Ruskarn Andedare
Lion Investments
#55 - 2013-10-14 09:20:09 UTC
WrATH2Zero wrote:
Sointu Luonnotar wrote:
WrATH2Zero wrote:


I did a minmatar L4 mission against Amarr, one of their battleships hit me for over 400 with 81% EM resistence on my Tengu while moving full speed. I've also noticed hits getting bigger in general missions, it's like a bug where the hits ignore the some of the shield resistence, that's what I'm saying.


Okay, this is probably Smash The Supplier and yes they do insane amounts of damage, I have maximum tanking skills and with great pains managed to do it in a supertanked Dominix. And this was before they made NPC's switch fire on drones. After that I never did it again, better ways to spend my time than hours on a single mission. Sure the tags are worth a pretty penny but not enough.

I know you're supposed to do it in a fast ship with great firepower, even still the NPC's spawn way too fast, couldn't kill the enemies nearly fast enough and eventually had to warp out due to the increasing damage. The ship I had had the theoretical DPS of 1200, and probably applied 800 of it. Still not enough.

The second to last mission in the Gallente Epic Arc also has insane damage profile.




But, I have not noticed any change in enemy damage potential. Normal missions do not do any more damage than usual. If you think so, you're just paranoid. Or just stoned.


You're correct, it was that mission, finally someone with some sense who knows what I'm talking about. SO is it this specific mission then?

I just didn't quite understand how I was taking so much damage because I've never seen those damage numbers show before.


Go to EVE Survival and read the comments, it looks like they weren't even trying compared to the numbers quoted there.

So nothing wrong, mission working as usual
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#56 - 2013-10-14 09:25:37 UTC
WrATH2Zero wrote:


You're correct, it was that mission, finally someone with some sense who knows what I'm talking about. SO is it this specific mission then?

I just didn't quite understand how I was taking so much damage because I've never seen those damage numbers show before.



OP is wrong, admits mistake but still its everyone else's fault



This is a reoccurring theme


Around people who claim


*Im* trolling *them*

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Mra Rednu
Vanishing Point.
#57 - 2013-10-14 09:33:17 UTC

You be a lot better off using a Nightmare.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#58 - 2013-10-14 09:39:06 UTC
WrATH2Zero wrote:
Katrina Oniseki wrote:
OP: Try recording your mission. I want to see what level 4 you're doing that is hitting you for 400 damage on 80%+ resists.

A maximum bounty Sansha's Tyrant belt battleship OR Centus Tyrant mission battleship does 216 EM and 180 Thermal damage every three seconds.

I'm not sure how good you are at math, but that adds up to 396 damage at 0% resistances.

So, with your naturally ridiculous 90% thermal resists, and your 81% thermal resists, it would (before sig radius or tracking) on a perfect hit, only strike you for 41.04 EM and 18 Thermal damage. That's 59.04 total damage per hit, if you're sitting perfectly still with your hardeners on.

This is very basic math. Unless CCP has completely ****** the resistance mechanics, that is the most damage you could take before tracking, ranges, or signature radius changes. In reality, you'll be taking even less than that.

So, unless you can show me a screenshot of you getting hit for 400 damage by a battleship with your hardeners on while moving, I'm going to have to call bullshit.

...

Either that or I suck at math, or don't understand how resistances work. Which is entirely possible.


WTF would I bullshit about that? I've been doing missions for about a year, I have 5.0 sec status L4 mission runner.

I did a minmatar L4 mission against Amarr, one of their battleships hit me for over 400 with 81% EM resistence on my Tengu while moving full speed. I've also noticed hits getting bigger in general missions, it's like a bug where the hits ignore the some of the shield resistence, that's what I'm saying.


Sounds like you don't understand tracking and transversal, which would not surprise since you are a missile pilot.

Hint: absolute speed means nothing by itself, angular speed is everything. You can go 7000 m/s and receive full damage from turrets.

.
Julius Priscus
#59 - 2013-10-14 09:45:57 UTC
OP

no where have you linked your ship fit & what mission you was doing.

and doing lvl 4 mission in high sec and having 5.0 sec is not a badge of honour in this game.
Daimon Kaiera
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#60 - 2013-10-14 09:48:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Daimon Kaiera
Mortifiers hit my VNI for crazy amounts of damage.

I'm scared.

By the way, I am curious. How do they track a cruiser travelling at 1,000 m/s?

.... . .-.. .--. / .. / .... .- ...- . / ..-. .- .-.. .-.. . -. / .- -. -.. / .. / -.-. .- -. -. --- - / --. . - / ..- .--. / ... - --- .--. - .... .. ... / ... .. --. -. .- - ..- .-. . / .. -.. . .- / .. ... / -. --- - / ... - --- .-.. . -. / ... - --- .--.