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CCP Shills on the CSM

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Kate stark
#321 - 2013-10-08 10:16:19 UTC
Bi-Mi Lansatha wrote:
Malcanis- "...I said I thought the lack of transparency was not the best way..."


Kate stark wrote:
...
i'll illustrate the point, again.
nobody cares that blink got ships
nobody cares that scorpions were handed out.
people are upset because ccp giving anything they want, to any one they feel, without a word about it is a massively bad idea.

Isn't transparency the issue and didn't Malcanis disagree with how it was done?


partly.
it's also the lack of a defined criteria for handing things out.

let's face it; nobody has an issue with people being rewarded for going "above and beyond".
the way it was done is entirely the issue. there's no clear set of criteria for who should get the rewards, there's no clear set of rewards, and yes the whole "under the table" aspect of it just makes it worse.

the new TMC article basically hits the nail on the head;
"...CCP was starting a new third-party affiliate program and in the process of developing guidelines for who could participate. Had such guidelines existed (and perhaps been published, or at least referenced) for giving away tokens of thanks to other community members, it would shut up pretty much all of the outrage."

if we knew these handouts were limited to people within the guidelines and they would only be getting certain things, that would be fine. however the current situation leaves it down to ccp saying "hey guys, trust us to do the right thing" and i think that's why it's getting a lot of comparison to the t20 stuff.

literally, ccp just publishing a list of guidelines would solve this issue almost instantly. it would reassure the players that nothing untoward is going on.

Yay, this account hasn't had its signature banned. or its account, if you're reading this.
Kuni Oichi
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#322 - 2013-10-08 10:21:07 UTC
Kate stark wrote:


the new TMC article basically hits the nail on the head;
"...CCP was starting a new third-party affiliate program and in the process of developing guidelines for who could participate. Had such guidelines existed (and perhaps been published, or at least referenced) for giving away tokens of thanks to other community members, it would shut up pretty much all of the outrage."


It's going to be fascinating to see how they try and crowbar enriching a gambling site to the tune of hundreds of billions of isk into being eligible to receive 'tokens of thanks' secretly.
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#323 - 2013-10-08 10:21:54 UTC
Kate stark wrote:
...it's also the lack of a defined criteria for handing things out.
Is it possible CCP recognizes this and are trying to take steps?

First, we are developing a program to allow all 3rd parties the opportunity to apply to participate in these kinds of events and promotions with CCP support...

That said, we recognize it is imperative for CCP to remain impartial with respect to which 3rd parties receive CCP support for these kinds of activities. To that end, we will develop a clear policy on how...

David Reid (CCP Pokethulu, CCP's CMO)
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#324 - 2013-10-08 10:24:40 UTC
Kate stark wrote:
...the way it was done is entirely the issue...
I agree... and so does Malcanis.
Kate stark
#325 - 2013-10-08 10:24:40 UTC
Bi-Mi Lansatha wrote:
Kate stark wrote:
...it's also the lack of a defined criteria for handing things out.
Is it possible CCP recognizes this and are trying to take steps?

First, we are developing a program to allow all 3rd parties the opportunity to apply to participate in these kinds of events and promotions with CCP support...

That said, we recognize it is imperative for CCP to remain impartial with respect to which 3rd parties receive CCP support for these kinds of activities. To that end, we will develop a clear policy on how...

David Reid (CCP Pokethulu, CCP's CMO)


yeah, great, except they really should do that first then give things out otherwise... ta-dah!

Yay, this account hasn't had its signature banned. or its account, if you're reading this.
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#326 - 2013-10-08 10:26:44 UTC
Kate stark wrote:

yeah, great, except they really should do that first then give things out otherwise... ta-dah!
No disagreement there. CCP should have known better... and had they consulted the CSM first they would have told CCP.

Not every group at CCP works with the CSM.
Kate stark
#327 - 2013-10-08 10:28:12 UTC
Kuni Oichi wrote:
Kate stark wrote:


the new TMC article basically hits the nail on the head;
"...CCP was starting a new third-party affiliate program and in the process of developing guidelines for who could participate. Had such guidelines existed (and perhaps been published, or at least referenced) for giving away tokens of thanks to other community members, it would shut up pretty much all of the outrage."


It's going to be fascinating to see how they try and crowbar enriching a gambling site to the tune of hundreds of billions of isk into being eligible to receive 'tokens of thanks' secretly.


interesting initiative
provides entertainment for many players
very generous and sponsor many events
well known in the community
loved and adored by many

i'm sure there are more buzz words and phrases that they can throw at blink to make it work.

Yay, this account hasn't had its signature banned. or its account, if you're reading this.
Snow Axe
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#328 - 2013-10-08 10:28:17 UTC
Kuni Oichi wrote:
It's going to be fascinating to see how they try and crowbar enriching a gambling site to the tune of hundreds of billions of isk into being eligible to receive 'tokens of thanks' secretly.


It's pretty easy. "Due to player feedback, we will be terminating the tokens reward program mistakes were made blah blah blah". The best part? It'll be exactly like they planned it to be, right down to the "nobody but Somer Blink gets any rewards" part!

"Look any reason why you need to talk like that? I have now reported you. I dont need to listen to your bad tone. If you cant have a grown up conversation then leave the thread["
Kate stark
#329 - 2013-10-08 10:29:49 UTC
Bi-Mi Lansatha wrote:
Kate stark wrote:

yeah, great, except they really should do that first then give things out otherwise... ta-dah!
No disagreement there. CCP should have known better... and had they consulted the CSM first they would have told CCP.

Not every group at CCP works with the CSM.


it's not even a lack of CSM consultation. surely it's common sense that secretly handing out billions of isk worth of ships with no governing guidelines was a bad idea and was going to bite them in the arse when people inevitably found out?

was it really that important to hand out a few scorpions that it couldn't have waited until there was a proper system in place?

Yay, this account hasn't had its signature banned. or its account, if you're reading this.
Snow Axe
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#330 - 2013-10-08 10:31:22 UTC
Kate stark wrote:
it's not even a lack of CSM consultation. surely it's common sense that secretly handing out billions of isk worth of ships with no governing guidelines was a bad idea and was going to bite them in the arse when people inevitably found out?

was it really that important to hand out a few scorpions that it couldn't have waited until there was a proper system in place?


Why it's almost as if this wasn't actually aimed at rewarding the contributing community at large, isn't it?

"Look any reason why you need to talk like that? I have now reported you. I dont need to listen to your bad tone. If you cant have a grown up conversation then leave the thread["
Money Makin Mitch
Paid in Full
#331 - 2013-10-08 10:33:06 UTC
Kate stark wrote:
Bi-Mi Lansatha wrote:
Kate stark wrote:

yeah, great, except they really should do that first then give things out otherwise... ta-dah!
No disagreement there. CCP should have known better... and had they consulted the CSM first they would have told CCP.

Not every group at CCP works with the CSM.


it's not even a lack of CSM consultation. surely it's common sense that secretly handing out billions of isk worth of ships with no governing guidelines was a bad idea and was going to bite them in the arse when people inevitably found out?

was it really that important to hand out a few scorpions that it couldn't have waited until there was a proper system in place?

can't engage in insider trading if the market is flooded and everybody knows it. somer figured it out, read the email. Roll
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#332 - 2013-10-08 10:33:18 UTC
Kate stark wrote:
...

it's not even a lack of CSM consultation. surely it's common sense that secretly handing out billions of isk worth of ships with no governing guidelines was a bad idea and was going to bite them in the arse when people inevitably found out?

was it really that important to hand out a few scorpions that it couldn't have waited until there was a proper system in place?
Again, no disagreement. The level of stupid on this action is fairly high.
Kate stark
#333 - 2013-10-08 10:33:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Kate stark
Snow Axe wrote:
Why it's almost as if this wasn't actually aimed at rewarding the contributing community at large, isn't it?

*shrug*

blink wouldn't have been my first choice, personally.
then again maybe i'm biased because i don't use blink's "services".

Yay, this account hasn't had its signature banned. or its account, if you're reading this.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#334 - 2013-10-08 10:34:09 UTC
Kate stark wrote:


it's not even a lack of CSM consultation. surely it's common sense that secretly handing out billions of isk worth of ships with no governing guidelines was a bad idea and was going to bite them in the arse when people inevitably found out?

was it really that important to hand out a few scorpions that it couldn't have waited until there was a proper system in place?


Possibly whoever handed them out didn't consider them worth billions of isk ignoring the collectors who have trillions of isk in their calculations.
Given the ships are crap scorpions after all.
And the CCP involved valued them based on their actual combat worth, not some fictional collector figure. Since why would a collector spend trillions on a ship it's known CCP is going to reissue repeatedly......

You know. Lets use logic here.
Kate stark
#335 - 2013-10-08 10:36:08 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Kate stark wrote:


it's not even a lack of CSM consultation. surely it's common sense that secretly handing out billions of isk worth of ships with no governing guidelines was a bad idea and was going to bite them in the arse when people inevitably found out?

was it really that important to hand out a few scorpions that it couldn't have waited until there was a proper system in place?


Possibly whoever handed them out didn't consider them worth billions of isk ignoring the collectors who have trillions of isk in their calculations.
Given the ships are crap scorpions after all.
And the CCP involved valued them based on their actual combat worth, not some fictional collector figure. Since why would a collector spend trillions on a ship it's known CCP is going to reissue repeatedly......

You know. Lets use logic here.


you say follow logic, then start off by saying "let's ignore things like market value, and the meta game, and you know all the important stuff".
i see a potential conflict there.

Yay, this account hasn't had its signature banned. or its account, if you're reading this.
Snow Axe
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#336 - 2013-10-08 10:38:09 UTC
Kate stark wrote:
Snow Axe wrote:
Why it's almost as if this wasn't actually aimed at rewarding the contributing community at large, isn't it?

*shrug*

blink wouldn't have been my first choice, personally.


Blink would be the dead last choice, really. If you were ever going to reward these outside sources that promote Eve with in-game rewards, surely you wouldn't choose the one whose entire purpose for existing is generating massive amounts of in-game currency, right? Surely a blogger or video maker or podcast host would be a better choice, since all of their material doesn't require payment to consume.

That's how stupid this all is. Whoever came up with this idea didn't set out to reward the contributing community as a whole and accidentally landed on Somer Blink, they set out to reward Somer Blink and Somer Blink alone. This whole "it's for the ~community~ you guys!" thing is a horrible post-getting-caught retcon.

"Look any reason why you need to talk like that? I have now reported you. I dont need to listen to your bad tone. If you cant have a grown up conversation then leave the thread["
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#337 - 2013-10-08 10:40:20 UTC
Market value on a new release item that they have said they will be dropping more of isn't exactly going to be an accurate figure, so entirely logical for them to have disregarded the first few trades on it believing once people get used to the idea that it will be given out regularly it's value will be far far lower.
Possibly wrong, but logical.
Money Makin Mitch
Paid in Full
#338 - 2013-10-08 10:42:35 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Market value on a new release item that they have said they will be dropping more of isn't exactly going to be an accurate figure, so entirely logical for them to have disregarded the first few trades on it believing once people get used to the idea that it will be given out regularly it's value will be far far lower.
Possibly wrong, but logical.

yep, that's why somer told employees to slowly sell them with alts, because 30 appearing at once would be weird Roll
Snow Axe
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#339 - 2013-10-08 10:42:35 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Market value on a new release item that they have said they will be dropping more of isn't exactly going to be an accurate figure, so entirely logical for them to have disregarded the first few trades on it believing once people get used to the idea that it will be given out regularly it's value will be far far lower.
Possibly wrong, but logical.


If Somer got a small, limited amount of an item that will get wider distribution, that actually makes this even worse, since the Somer giftees will be able to offload at far higher prices than your average player will once the distribution gets wide.

"Look any reason why you need to talk like that? I have now reported you. I dont need to listen to your bad tone. If you cant have a grown up conversation then leave the thread["
Money Makin Mitch
Paid in Full
#340 - 2013-10-08 10:43:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Money Makin Mitch
Snow Axe wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Market value on a new release item that they have said they will be dropping more of isn't exactly going to be an accurate figure, so entirely logical for them to have disregarded the first few trades on it believing once people get used to the idea that it will be given out regularly it's value will be far far lower.
Possibly wrong, but logical.


If Somer got a small, limited amount of an item that will get wider distribution, that actually makes this even worse, since the Somer giftees will be able to offload at far higher prices than your average player will once the distribution gets wide.


oh, they did. they had ~6 weeks to sell to a market that believed only x amount were released. i don't see how anyone could possibly defend that. a lot of people also missed the tid-bit about the limited monocles somer also received.