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If offgrid boosting nerfed, give command ships (& BC) more roles in faction warfare: M/L pls
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BiggestT
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1 - 2013-10-06 08:02:54 UTC  |  Edited by: BiggestT
Off-grid boosting has been a problem since time immemorial in EVE.
Removing it is the right choice (as CCP intends to do once they iron the kinks out).

BUT

Command ships have a very limited role in faction warfare already, removing off-grid boosting makes them only useful for gate camps really (most roam fleets won't bother taking CS anymore with their cruiser fleets etc. as they will be dead weight).

While we're at it, the entire Battlecruiser line has a very limited role in FW (at least T3s make good cloaky scouts), being the weakest ship line restricted to large sites. They generally get brought out only for ihub bashes (yet stealth bombers are usually preferred and safer) or to counter another type of fleet at a gate etc.

What we need are M/L sites (I'm sure it's been talked about before?), to allow CS to have a bigger role in FW, along with all other BCs and even T3s. Make M/L sites spawn more often than large sites but less often than medium sites (obviously).

More site types = more diversity in possible fleet doctrines = a better FW experience.

Discuss?

Edit: To clarrify:

The new M/L sites should have the same restrictions as medium sites, though allows all types of BC and T3 as well.
Lair Osen
#2 - 2013-10-06 08:32:50 UTC
So you want off grid boosting removed, so your CS is only most useful when on grid with a fleet, then you want a M/L plex created so that they can be used solo?
You're sending somewhat mixed messages here.
You really shouldn't be having too much trouble doing large sites in a BC let alone a CS.
CSs are meant for fleets and fleets should not be used for plexing.
BiggestT
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#3 - 2013-10-06 09:04:03 UTC  |  Edited by: BiggestT
Lair Osen wrote:
So you want off grid boosting removed, so your CS is only most useful when on grid with a fleet, then you want a M/L plex created so that they can be used solo?
You're sending somewhat mixed messages here.
You really shouldn't be having too much trouble doing large sites in a BC let alone a CS.
CSs are meant for fleets and fleets should not be used for plexing.


That there is the current problem with FW. Why shouldn't a small gang of 3 or so BCs be used for plexing? A BC has no problem doing a large right now, nor does a condor Blink. Allowing more ship types into more types of plexes encourages more scenarios for pvp, and pvp is the real aim of FW...

The issue with FW right now is that solo is more lucrative and preferred to group work, which goes agaisnt CCP's general design philosophy of EVE being better as a group game (e.g. they introduced fleet benefits form leadership skills, the support for dual-boxing accounts etc).

Skrew doing plexes solo, it's so damn boring.
Lair Osen
#4 - 2013-10-06 09:20:18 UTC
So pretty much, you want incursion-esque sites in FW
BiggestT
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#5 - 2013-10-06 09:33:25 UTC  |  Edited by: BiggestT
Lair Osen wrote:
So pretty much, you want incursion-esque sites in FW


Well FW sites are not anything like Incursions so there wouldn't be that many simularities (timer vs. rats, lp reward vs. isk reward).

But yes, I would like more options for FW other than ≤frigate, ≤destroyer, ≤cruiser, EVERYTHING ELSE.

How many times in FW do we see a little frigate at a med or large and not bother engaging because we know they'll just run?
Yet if we ever see a BC at a large etc. we tell all our avaialble friends and try to pop it; thus a small gang is formed and even if we miss the kill, we can go and do something else with our formed gang (butterfly effect etc. etc.).

Providing an impetus for more of these situaitons will vastly improve FW.
Jerick Ludhowe
Internet Tuff Guys
#6 - 2013-10-06 11:34:26 UTC
Sounds good to me
Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
#7 - 2013-10-06 12:58:01 UTC
we need CS frigates with high speed if on grid boosting is to be a thing.

CS are fat and slow pieces of **** that can't work with skirmish.

EvE-Mail me if you need anything.
BiggestT
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#8 - 2013-10-07 05:02:33 UTC
Arya Regnar wrote:
we need CS frigates with high speed if on grid boosting is to be a thing.

CS are fat and slow pieces of **** that can't work with skirmish.


I agree that a new type of smaller CS ship is likely needed, preferably in a frigate hull.
Otherwise there will be no way to receive link bonuses in plexes, pushing FW even more into a solo-preferred activity (which is of course, a bad idea).

If such frigates were introduced, capping them at max 1 warfare link would be ideal. That way it wouldn't step on the toes of current CS too much (they'll still be better boosters, and better for larger fleets).

There could even be a mining link frigate, a T2 venture Bear (though I'm not sure if it would have much of a role seeing as belts are open to everything, but who knows I'm sure CCP could think of some use for it)...
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2013-10-07 08:34:30 UTC
Fast groups of cruisers that don't want to be slowed down by command ships can just bring tech 3 boosts along. Of course they won't have a full rack of boosts if they intend to fit the T3s to survive any hits.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
BiggestT
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#10 - 2013-10-07 08:36:21 UTC
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:
Fast groups of cruisers that don't want to be slowed down by command ships can just bring tech 3 boosts along. Of course they won't have a full rack of boosts if they intend to fit the T3s to survive any hits.


Tech 3 cruisers can only fit in large sites, so they are in the same boat as command ships (and all BC for that matter). Thus why a M/L site would be nice.
Liafcipe9000
Critically Preposterous
#11 - 2013-10-07 10:38:57 UTC
BiggestT wrote:
Off-grid boosting has been a problem since time immemorial in EVE.
Removing it is the right choice (as CCP intends to do once they iron the kinks out).


GET THE SMEG OUT MY EVE Evil
Sergeant Acht Scultz
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#12 - 2013-10-07 11:22:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Sergeant Acht Scultz
BiggestT wrote:
Off-grid boosting has been a problem since time immemorial in EVE.
Removing it is the right choice (as CCP intends to do once they iron the kinks out).


Can't wait to see this happen, true solo pvp suffers the most from this silly mechanic. T3s perception is way exaggerated because of this mechanic.

The day "uberdupersolopvpwithoffgridalts" will have to bring everything on grid or play with other/more players, many pvp issues and ships perception will completely disappear or change.
Command ships on grid in fleets or gangs already exists, works fine and must be tuned again to be a bit more rewarding for Command ship pilots (more speed or agility, maybe both)

Some minor changes like this one could also change how FW sites are done and local system pvp tactics.

removed inappropriate ASCII art signature - CCP Eterne
BiggestT
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#13 - 2013-10-07 14:26:53 UTC
Liafcipe9000 wrote:
BiggestT wrote:
Off-grid boosting has been a problem since time immemorial in EVE.
Removing it is the right choice (as CCP intends to do once they iron the kinks out).


GET THE SMEG OUT MY EVE Evil


There, there, CCP will make the bad men stop soon™ Big smile

Sergeant Acht Scultz wrote:
BiggestT wrote:
Off-grid boosting has been a problem since time immemorial in EVE.
Removing it is the right choice (as CCP intends to do once they iron the kinks out).


Can't wait to see this happen, true solo pvp suffers the most from this silly mechanic. T3s perception is way exaggerated because of this mechanic.

The day "uberdupersolopvpwithoffgridalts" will have to bring everything on grid or play with other/more players, many pvp issues and ships perception will completely disappear or change.
Command ships on grid in fleets or gangs already exists, works fine and must be tuned again to be a bit more rewarding for Command ship pilots (more speed or agility, maybe both)

Some minor changes like this one could also change how FW sites are done and local system pvp tactics.


Exactly, I'd like to see a dynamic role for CS so that they have times when they should be used and when they shouldn't. M/L sutes would give to CS with one hand, while the other hand takes away the nasty offgrid boosts.

I'd actually be happy for meds, smalls, and novies to stay boost free, but I think smaller warfare link carrying ships going on-grid for the smaller plexes would still provide a nice balance. That way people can't claim "uber solo" kills without anyone's knowledge of the boosts (plus you can kill them too!).