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Time to stop the ability for corp members to shoot each other without a duel???

Author
Unezka Turigahl
Det Som Engang Var
#21 - 2013-09-26 03:27:18 UTC
+1. This is an absolutely stupid feature that does nothing but allow chumps to circumvent hisec rules and grief new players and more PvE and industry minded players. Its the reason all my characters are in 1 man corps with maybe an alt or two. Applications have been disabled to all of my corps. I play instead with a loose group of people that are in similar "solo corps", unified by a chat channel.

CCP should develop a more fine-grained replacement mechanic for mass killing/testing within corps, utilizing the existing safety or duel mechanic. As suggested, set safety to red to allow corp kills. Or have a new duel flag for corp-wide pvp with no timer or target, just set to on or off.
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#22 - 2013-09-26 03:40:04 UTC
When i first started playing this game i thought that being able to shoot corpies was stupid but the more i played EVE the more i realized that drama is one of the important parts of the game.

While i dont always side with drama i think that removing this mechanic takes too much interest factor out of the game.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.

Gigan Amilupar
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#23 - 2013-09-26 04:03:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Gigan Amilupar
Unezka Turigahl wrote:
+1. This is an absolutely stupid feature that does nothing but allow chumps to circumvent hisec rules and grief new players and more PvE and industry minded players. Its the reason all my characters are in 1 man corps with maybe an alt or two. Applications have been disabled to all of my corps. I play instead with a loose group of people that are in similar "solo corps", unified by a chat channel.

CCP should develop a more fine-grained replacement mechanic for mass killing/testing within corps, utilizing the existing safety or duel mechanic. As suggested, set safety to red to allow corp kills. Or have a new duel flag for corp-wide pvp with no timer or target, just set to on or off.


Look, the reality of the situation is this, while getting AWOXed most certainly sucks, it is a part of the game. Especially the shooting corp-mates part. The freedom to make that choice, to shoot at another player, anywhere, with CONCORD being the immediate consequence, and follow up being the responsibility of those affected is part of what makes EvE, well, EvE. It's supposed to be a "free" universe where players can act how they choose to. And as much as getting sand kicked in your face in the sandbox must suck, I don't think I would want to play a game that told me "No, the universe is not going to let you do that or deal with any consequences". And while that might make me sound like a jerk who supports AWOXing, I don't support it. But I do support the freedom to AWOX because the freedom itself gives meaning to the game. That is why this recommendation is never going to happen. The universe is dangerous. Make friends, fly safe, and take responsibility for the security of both yourself and those you'd fly with.
Joe Risalo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#24 - 2013-09-26 04:23:03 UTC
Gigan Amilupar wrote:
Unezka Turigahl wrote:
+1. This is an absolutely stupid feature that does nothing but allow chumps to circumvent hisec rules and grief new players and more PvE and industry minded players. Its the reason all my characters are in 1 man corps with maybe an alt or two. Applications have been disabled to all of my corps. I play instead with a loose group of people that are in similar "solo corps", unified by a chat channel.

CCP should develop a more fine-grained replacement mechanic for mass killing/testing within corps, utilizing the existing safety or duel mechanic. As suggested, set safety to red to allow corp kills. Or have a new duel flag for corp-wide pvp with no timer or target, just set to on or off.


Look, the reality of the situation is this, while getting AWOXed most certainly sucks, it is a part of the game. Especially the shooting corp-mates part. The freedom to make that choice, to shoot at another player, anywhere, with CONCORD being the immediate consequence, and follow up being the responsibility of those affected is part of what makes EvE, well, EvE. It's supposed to be a "free" universe where players can act how they choose to. And as much as getting sand kicked in your face in the sandbox must suck, I don't think I would want to play a game that told me "No, the universe is not going to let you do that or deal with any consequences". And while that might make me sound like a jerk who supports AWOXing, I don't support it. But I do support the freedom to AWOX because the freedom itself gives meaning to the game. That is why this recommendation is never going to happen. The universe is dangerous. Make friends, fly safe, and take responsibility for the security of both yourself and those you'd fly with.


This isn't the same as the other freedoms the game gives you.
You are free to blow people up in high sec but it typically comes at a cost of Concord and standing, war costs, possible loss, and many other possible costs.

Awoxing is nothing more than free kills at no cost and actually goes against what so many people b!tch about, which is risk vs reward.

Awoxing is a very bright example of where risk vs reward is not applying.
People always say that if you want more Isk, you gotta take risks.
Well, if you want pvp, the. You should definitely have to put yourself at risk.
Awoxing breaks this and actually does even worse by allowing player to pad the kill boards with kills that weren't earned in a manner that is respectable.

I have no problem with war decs and suicide ganks, but this is rediculous.

Look, you can get into a corp and get all the intel you need.
Hell, you can even get them to link their fits.
The. , you can give that Intel to your corp and gank their shiny ship at a gate.

This is a good tactic and is something that can be used multiple times, as they won't know you gave intel.
However, it still comes with a cost.
This is Eve and this is how the rest of the game works.
Why is it so many people support awoxing which is a blatant slap in the face to this?
Posn Akiga
Perkone
Caldari State
#25 - 2013-09-26 07:39:52 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Posn Akiga wrote:
i support this message

I am sure you do....
Pro tip hide your corporation and alliance information when trying to support a corporates thread.

On topic, no.


Just saying i support my corpmate, it was my way of bumping the post.
Mr Barbeque
Mayhem and Ruin
#26 - 2013-09-26 08:53:40 UTC
Joe Risalo wrote:
[clip]Awoxing is nothing more than free kills at no cost and actually goes against what so many people b!tch about, which is risk vs reward.

There is a cost. Said awoxer has to put in an application, and get accepted into your corporation. That takes effort and some skill, hopefully. That is a cost.

Whats really being complained about is that some have been tricked, don't like it, and are projecting blame upon the game for the result. This is the definition of a HTFU situation. You aren't helpless, there are steps you can take. Ultimately you have to accept them for them to get that green star. So really they just successfully managed to get you off your guard. Compare this to faction warfare. People can, and do join an allied or the same faction in an attempt to catch others off guard. The only defense a militia pilot has is to be on their guard They cant deny access, only trust.

I'm not a fan of awoxing or awoxers, its skeezy and dishonorable. But this is EVE, everyone has a right to be skeezy and dishonorable.
Maximus Aerelius
PROPHET OF ENIGMA
#27 - 2013-09-26 09:09:21 UTC
Posn Akiga wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Posn Akiga wrote:
i support this message

I am sure you do....
Pro tip hide your corporation and alliance information when trying to support a corporates thread.

On topic, no.


Just saying i support my corpmate, it was my way of bumping the post.


Bumping 5 minutes after creation...yeah alright Roll
APOC UK
APOC Technologies
#28 - 2013-09-26 09:51:01 UTC
Maximus Aerelius wrote:
Posn Akiga wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Posn Akiga wrote:
i support this message

I am sure you do....
Pro tip hide your corporation and alliance information when trying to support a corporates thread.

On topic, no.


Just saying i support my corpmate, it was my way of bumping the post.


Bumping 5 minutes after creation...yeah alright Roll


Look he's just voicing his support so lets not flame grill him for it ok?
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#29 - 2013-09-26 10:05:34 UTC
Absolutely not. If I couldn't awox, then I couldn't blow up my corpies' carebear exploration boats and get that fat payout and totally blingy medal from my CEO.

Remember kids, awoxing is fun.
APOC UK
APOC Technologies
#30 - 2013-09-26 15:24:53 UTC
Domanique Altares wrote:
Absolutely not. If I couldn't awox, then I couldn't blow up my corpies' carebear exploration boats and get that fat payout and totally blingy medal from my CEO.

Remember kids, awoxing is fun.


very grown up
Bastion Arzi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#31 - 2013-09-26 15:35:03 UTC
+1 from me

I mean in eve u are encouraged to get out there and join a corp.

but what if your new and you take this advice and your corp mates blow you up for giggles. I find this ridiculous and also i imagine that some new players sadly have probably left the game because of something liek this happening.

On second thought u dont even have to be new for som ething like this to happen. Just unlucky.

Personally im afraid to join many corps becuase of this and it is really limiting my experiences in eve.

On the other hand it does help when u want to practice some pvp with ur corpmates but then couldnt you just duel each other for that?

....I suppose that limits the fights to 1v1's though im not really sure.
Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
#32 - 2013-09-26 15:42:14 UTC
Bastion Arzi wrote:
+1 from me

I mean in eve u are encouraged to get out there and join a corp.

but what if your new and you take this advice and your corp mates blow you up for giggles. I find this ridiculous and also i imagine that some new players sadly have probably left the game because of something liek this happening.

On second thought u dont even have to be new for som ething like this to happen. Just unlucky.

Personally im afraid to join many corps becuase of this and it is really limiting my experiences in eve.

On the other hand it does help when u want to practice some pvp with ur corpmates but then couldnt you just duel each other for that?

....I suppose that limits the fights to 1v1's though im not really sure.

Scared? Everything in EVE comes at a risk, it's what makes it thrilling.

EvE-Mail me if you need anything.

Maximus Aerelius
PROPHET OF ENIGMA
#33 - 2013-09-26 15:45:49 UTC
APOC UK wrote:
Maximus Aerelius wrote:
Posn Akiga wrote:
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Posn Akiga wrote:
i support this message

I am sure you do....
Pro tip hide your corporation and alliance information when trying to support a corporates thread.

On topic, no.


Just saying i support my corpmate, it was my way of bumping the post.


Bumping 5 minutes after creation...yeah alright Roll


Look he's just voicing his support so lets not flame grill him for it ok?


But I like to flame grill them supporters, I mean how dare they support their own corp members posts...just disgusts me Shocked /sarcasm.

Fair one, wrist slapped, apologies. Lol
Maximus Aerelius
PROPHET OF ENIGMA
#34 - 2013-09-26 15:49:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Maximus Aerelius
Bastion Arzi wrote:
+1 from me

I mean in eve u are encouraged to get out there and join a corp.

but what if your new and you take this advice and your corp mates blow you up for giggles. I find this ridiculous and also i imagine that some new players sadly have probably left the game because of something liek this happening.

On second thought u dont even have to be new for som ething like this to happen. Just unlucky.

Personally im afraid to join many corps becuase of this and it is really limiting my experiences in eve.

On the other hand it does help when u want to practice some pvp with ur corpmates but then couldnt you just duel each other for that?

....I suppose that limits the fights to 1v1's though im not really sure.


If you don't trust the Corp you are looking to join or your Corp Mates then don't join one\leave. Simple really. There are plenty of characters who spend their whole lives in NPC Corps and it has it's advantages like War Immunity but the Tax is harsh. You could create your own and invite people you trust or RL friends to play.

Trust is a rare thing in EVE but then it's a harsh universe and not for the feint of heart...now HTFU, get out there and do your thing Smile
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#35 - 2013-09-26 19:48:48 UTC
APOC UK wrote:
Domanique Altares wrote:
Absolutely not. If I couldn't awox, then I couldn't blow up my corpies' carebear exploration boats and get that fat payout and totally blingy medal from my CEO.

Remember kids, awoxing is fun.


very grown up


It is indeed very grown up; quite the antithesis of crying about stopping things that do not matter, like awoxing.
Joe Risalo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#36 - 2013-09-26 20:03:10 UTC
Domanique Altares wrote:
APOC UK wrote:
Domanique Altares wrote:
Absolutely not. If I couldn't awox, then I couldn't blow up my corpies' carebear exploration boats and get that fat payout and totally blingy medal from my CEO.

Remember kids, awoxing is fun.


very grown up


It is indeed very grown up; quite the antithesis of crying about stopping things that do not matter, like awoxing.



If it doesn't matter, than why allow it?
Cage Man
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#37 - 2013-09-26 20:06:27 UTC
While I am not a supporter of griefers and thieves, been a victim before, I think it does make eve interesting and keeps recruiters on their toes and makes players take some responsibility in vetting new corpies.

I would prefer they make it that if your safety is on "green" you can't accidentally shoot corpies, mostly cause I shoot my alt all the time when I have cap chaining setup's.
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#38 - 2013-09-26 20:07:07 UTC
APOC UK wrote:
Domanique Altares wrote:
Absolutely not. If I couldn't awox, then I couldn't blow up my corpies' carebear exploration boats and get that fat payout and totally blingy medal from my CEO.

Remember kids, awoxing is fun.


very grown up

I am said CEO and I'm confirming I am super duper very grown up.

Remember that aggression rules are only enforced by CONCORD to prevent strife and shooting of innocents. However, once you step into a corp, you're inside a self contained group that acts as one entity to the outside, and whose affairs cannot be interfered in by 3rd parties. With the convenience of this lack of interference comes the cost of having to actually manage internal affairs yourself.

Yes, "internal affairs". Once someone is in a corp, it is presumed that he or she is trusted enough to be "one of you". That means access to your jetcans, POSes, corp hangars, and free rein to do whatever you want to or with each other. Getting rid of legal in-corp shooting is like getting rid of sharing jetcan access, or adding the ability to "opt out" of a war dec. It's simply integral to what a corp is.

If you would like to hang out with someone but don't trust them with the various aspects of being in your corp, try a chat channel and a fleet. You get the full protection of non-corpmateship, while still being able to do stuff together.

---

Now, I've held this back long enough: LOLOO NUB U MAD AT AWOXERS LOL can i have, your STUFF! whatacarebear #yolo

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)

Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#39 - 2013-09-26 20:31:30 UTC
Gigan Amilupar wrote:
Show us on the doll where the AWOXer touched you.


Pretty much every where I'm thinking.

As for the suggestion: No.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#40 - 2013-09-26 20:33:36 UTC
Orakkus wrote:
APOC UK wrote:
So hears my idea.

I think this game has come a long way over the years but one thing that i think has stayed behind the times is the ability for corp members to shoot at each other without putting an official duel in place in advance.

Why is this a problem i hear you all ask?

Well as you know there are many griefers in this game who take advantage of corps who are recruiting,

They get through the security checks somehow and then Bam!!! there goes an expensive ship up in smoke.

I know this has been a feature of the game since its birth to allow corp members to shoot at each other and was meant for the purpose of testing load-outs or corp tournaments which are all good fun.


Maybe initially that was the case, but it has long developed into both a griefer mechanics as well as a major type of sabotage and spying for in game corporations and alliances.


It isn't griefing, by definition.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online