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CCP, please give us some answers about hybrids
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Fix Hybrids
Doomheim
#1 - 2011-11-15 17:28:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Fix Hybrids
Since the initial announcement of the changes to hybrid weapons, this thread has grown with more than 700 posts of constructive criticism, discussion and suggestions for what hybrids need. The concensus was that the changes did not go far enough.

Just over a week ago, CCP Tallest posted this 6-line update about some further changes. It remains the only response to the community's feedback. Since his update, 26 more pages of feedback have been posted in that thread. Still, the consensus is the same: not far enough.

But despite all this feedback, there has been no indication from CCP Tallest whether the adjustments are still being worked on, or if the last update was final. Nobody outside of CCP knows if the feedback is being considered, or being completely ignored. The deafening silence doesn't look good for CCP's new commitment to communication with the player base.

Now that the date is set for Crucible's release, and the build on Sisi is apparently all but finished, we need to know:

CCP, are the hybrid changes on Sisi final?
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#2 - 2011-11-15 17:39:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Nova Fox
"< Insert My Favorite Item > Isnt strong enough I want it to be the best thing possible thats how you balance things!"

Seriously though I think this is one of those things you tweak per patch instead of going 'far enough' becuase the opinion of 'far enoug' to some is 'too far' with others. The idea is to get hybrids niche'd enough without copy catting the other guns and give them thier own feel. Yet there arent enough measuring sticks to overall see how things are all going to turn out in the expansion specially with the ship changes that are expected to be using these blasters.

I rather get small buffs leading up to a comfortable state then to be given awsome out the door only to be nerfed later last the last time they tried to balance everything which got the hybrids in the current mess to begin with!

There are issues with the ships as well but thats a tricky thing to deal with make these ships too light and youll wind up wtih nanomess again. Make these guns hit too hard and how'd want to play caldari then? The whole idea for balancing is not to make it more than viable but to be approachably useful. So that all skill levels can use the weapons accordingly. I do seriously think that railguns may get this this patching but blasters may need an additonal once or two overs before it get there.

As one person said it, you shouldnt have it all. Hit and run ships are not supposed to tank the world as they blast though somthing, you have to sacrifice something to get returns.

Overall I say let the expansion metrics speak for themselves before we conclude what to do next. Yeah it does leave room for I told you so, but at least I am expecting its possibility instead of being me saying wtf you nerfing blasters into the ground for?

BTW CCP is very committed to communicating, they have been communicating on levels rarely seen in the past but I do know they share some of the feeligns stated above, They dont want to take our shineier new toys away after they polished them. I mean this isnt like the carrier nerf of 07, and ultimately they could have ignored buffing hybrids AT ALL this expansion and pushed it back like the assault frigates. I rather they try something than nothing.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Fix Hybrids
Doomheim
#3 - 2011-11-15 17:44:17 UTC
There is no point in going over the arguments about the hybrid changes again if CCP aren't listening.

This thread is a request for answers. Nothing more.
Montevius Williams
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2011-11-15 17:46:09 UTC
This should probably go in the test server thread since thats what they are doing with hybrids right now - testing.

"The American Government indoctrination system known as public education has been relentlessly churning out socialists for over 20 years". - TravisWB
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#5 - 2011-11-15 17:47:11 UTC
Yeah wrong place for answers. The most you'd usually get form GD is trolling or burning. I feel a bit fire foxy today.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2011-11-15 17:50:49 UTC
Personally I'm starting to think they got it backward.

Blasters get a damage boost maintaining the niche (station games, and ganking) Rails get the tracking bonus....and a big one.

You pay for the range with damage, but as it stands the tracking is so terrible that they are useless at common small gang ranges (point range) ......larges have a hard time hitting battlecruisers at 35km if they aren't burning parallel to to it, and then its hit or miss.

This why they have a gun that they can use for medium range like that area between blaster effective and rail tracking that EVERYONE likes to fight in.

....and its not stepping on anyones' toes.
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#7 - 2011-11-15 17:52:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Tanya Powers
Montevius Williams wrote:
This should probably go in the test server thread since thats what they are doing with hybrids right now - testing.



Flash news after testing at each SISI update: hybrids still suck, naga can make them work little better thx to range bonus, nothing uber thou, projectiles and lasers are still 2 steps ahead.

Edit: because I can

Some guns seem broken (group reload, stats etc) so yeah, nice stars and textures, warp effect etc...that's all for me, I'll just replace canes and some tempest/maelstrom for Tornados now Lol
Fix Hybrids
Doomheim
#8 - 2011-11-15 17:53:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Fix Hybrids
No. There have been countless threads about the hybrid changes on the Test Server Feedback board (including that 38-page threadnought I linked to, which CCP Tallest himself started), all of which have only resulted in that one measly response from Tallest.

I am posting here because this needs attention. I won't let this be swept under the carpet.
Dunmur
Tempered Logic
#9 - 2011-11-15 17:59:23 UTC
I would love some answers but what is ccp going to say,

(Sorry we buffed hybrids all we are going/willing to do because we are scared of pissing off winmatar pilots especially since we got all that bad press this summer.)
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#10 - 2011-11-15 18:07:46 UTC
You call 38 pages a threadnaught?

Threadnaughts get to 200 pages by end of the day.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Fix Hybrids
Doomheim
#11 - 2011-11-15 18:09:17 UTC
Context, troll. It's a threadnought by TSF standards.
Drifterin Thedark
#12 - 2011-11-15 18:16:36 UTC
I think this cause is hampered mainly by its supporters.
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#13 - 2011-11-15 18:27:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Nova Fox
Fix Hybrids wrote:
Context, troll. It's a threadnought by TSF standards.


TSF?

Go look up the carrier nerf of what was it 2007?

Those where threadnaughts. Hundred page posts every few days.

This here. these complaints... they almost match normal complaints every development cycle.

Stop over dramatizing something, stop being immature by trying to disengage, stop being so asinine and try to discuss things instead.

Seriously those with the acid and vitrol are very unplesant and should be ignorned.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Benilopax
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2011-11-15 18:29:11 UTC
Didn't CCP always say this was a first step and more would be done in the coming months?

Have you guys got no patience? You've been waiting long enough already, take the first step and look forward to progress.

...
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#15 - 2011-11-15 18:30:51 UTC
There are more people complaining about the NeX, Faction warfare update?, Incarna than hybrids ill leave it at that.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#16 - 2011-11-15 18:31:55 UTC
Benilopax wrote:
Didn't CCP always say this was a first step and more would be done in the coming months?

Have you guys got no patience? You've been waiting long enough already, take the first step and look forward to progress.


This practice is what they did with black ops however I think they where missing the 'uber' blueprint of the idea and only started off with something underpowered.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Hungry Eyes
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#17 - 2011-11-15 18:46:35 UTC
Nova Fox wrote:


Overall I say let the expansion metrics speak for themselves before we conclude what to do next.

.


tired of this half-assed, passive attittude toward something that is so badly broken on so many levels.
Dunmur
Tempered Logic
#18 - 2011-11-15 18:47:46 UTC
Benilopax wrote:
Didn't CCP always say this was a first step and more would be done in the coming months?

Have you guys got no patience? You've been waiting long enough already, take the first step and look forward to progress.


no patients LOLLLL

if gallente pilots had no patients gallente wouldn't even exist anymore. Since when is 3 years no patients?
Fix Hybrids
Doomheim
#19 - 2011-11-15 18:50:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Fix Hybrids
Nova Fox wrote:
Fix Hybrids wrote:
Context, troll. It's a threadnought by TSF standards.


TSF?

Go look up the carrier nerf of what was it 2007?

Those where threadnaughts. Hundred page posts every few days.

This here. these complaints... they almost match normal complaints every development cycle.

Stop over dramatizing something, stop being immature by trying to disengage, stop being so asinine and try to discuss things instead.

Seriously those with the acid and vitrol are very unplesant and should be ignorned.


Oh, the irony!

You can white knight for CCP as much as you like. It doesn't change the fact that their lack of communication about their work on hybrids has been utterly woeful.

And since you mention Black Ops, that's hardly a good example of the 'wait and see' approach to balancing, is it?
Kietay Ayari
Caldari State
#20 - 2011-11-15 18:51:21 UTC
I am a super Caldari fan so I am very biased, but considering that Hybrids use ammunition and capacitor I believe they should have the same low alpha they have right now but better DPS than any other weapon system. Not by miles but definitely a noticeable damage advantage over other weapon systems :O

Ferox #1
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