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destroyers - gankers and high sec

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Plastic Psycho
Necro-Economics
#221 - 2013-09-18 20:13:59 UTC
Do people actually believe the 2M ISK number, or am I being wooshed here?
Dave Stark
#222 - 2013-09-18 20:16:14 UTC
Plastic Psycho wrote:
Do people actually believe the 2M ISK number, or am I being wooshed here?


you can fit a catalyst for 2m.

you can also fit a catalyst for somewhere shy of 700 dps.

you cannot do these things at the same time though, despite the mewling of the masses.
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#223 - 2013-09-18 20:23:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Mallak Azaria
Dave Stark wrote:
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Sure, if you slap on a DCII, and reinforced bulkheads, crippling your yield below that of cheaper ships, you will be killed by 2 of them.


And what exactly is wrong with this? If the Hulk pilot pays attention they won't get blown up in the first place.


the fact that he's full of ****, is what's wrong with this.

the only thing that outmines a 0 mlu hulk is a 3 mlu mackinaw.

1339m3/min - 3mlu mack
1302m3/min - 0mlu hulk
1275m3/min - 3mlu retriever
1228m3/min - 2mlu skiff
numbers from eft.

tank your hulk, or quit bitching about it. the yield is already the second highest possible yield BEFORE you put mlus on it.

edit: totally forgot the covetor that gets 1m3/min more than the hulk if you put 2 mlus on it. 1m3, hilarious. due to truncation the likelihood of this 1m3 ever making a difference is basically nil. so they are in essence, the same yield.


The real crime here is that SMA have not kicked this guy out yet.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Dave Stark
#224 - 2013-09-18 20:27:19 UTC
Mallak Azaria wrote:
The real crime here is that SMA have not kicked this guy out yet.


it wouldn't be so bad if he wasn't outright lying about things that are so easy to fact check....
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#225 - 2013-09-18 20:28:38 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:

:D
Still, 4m for 2 Catas is doable.

…and also incapable of killing a Hulk.
Plastic Psycho
Necro-Economics
#226 - 2013-09-18 20:33:26 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Plastic Psycho wrote:
Do people actually believe the 2M ISK number, or am I being wooshed here?


you can fit a catalyst for 2m.

you can also fit a catalyst for somewhere shy of 700 dps.

you cannot do these things at the same time though, despite the mewling of the masses.

'Zactly.
My standard gank-lite fit Cat runs just under 8.5M ISK; Suitable for popping all T1 Barges, Ventures, and some Haulers.

I've never tried fitting a 2M Cat, maybe I should just to see what you can get on it for that number. Hint: The hull is close to 1M all by itself, dependnig on where you buy...
Dave Stark
#227 - 2013-09-18 20:36:30 UTC
Plastic Psycho wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Plastic Psycho wrote:
Do people actually believe the 2M ISK number, or am I being wooshed here?


you can fit a catalyst for 2m.

you can also fit a catalyst for somewhere shy of 700 dps.

you cannot do these things at the same time though, despite the mewling of the masses.

'Zactly.
My standard gank-lite fit Cat runs just under 8.5M ISK; Suitable for popping all T1 Barges, Ventures, and some Haulers.

I've never tried fitting a 2M Cat, maybe I should just to see what you can get on it for that number. Hint: The hull is close to 1M all by itself, dependnig on where you buy...


This is what ~2m will get you.
Plastic Psycho
Necro-Economics
#228 - 2013-09-18 20:40:23 UTC
Dave Stark wrote:
Plastic Psycho wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Plastic Psycho wrote:
Do people actually believe the 2M ISK number, or am I being wooshed here?


you can fit a catalyst for 2m.

you can also fit a catalyst for somewhere shy of 700 dps.

you cannot do these things at the same time though, despite the mewling of the masses.

'Zactly.
My standard gank-lite fit Cat runs just under 8.5M ISK; Suitable for popping all T1 Barges, Ventures, and some Haulers.

I've never tried fitting a 2M Cat, maybe I should just to see what you can get on it for that number. Hint: The hull is close to 1M all by itself, dependnig on where you buy...


This is what ~2m will get you.

Thats... Not actually bad. Smile
Not 700 DPS, sure, but some of the right implants might boost it up nicely.
Dave Stark
#229 - 2013-09-18 20:43:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Dave Stark
Plastic Psycho wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Plastic Psycho wrote:
Dave Stark wrote:
Plastic Psycho wrote:
Do people actually believe the 2M ISK number, or am I being wooshed here?


you can fit a catalyst for 2m.

you can also fit a catalyst for somewhere shy of 700 dps.

you cannot do these things at the same time though, despite the mewling of the masses.

'Zactly.
My standard gank-lite fit Cat runs just under 8.5M ISK; Suitable for popping all T1 Barges, Ventures, and some Haulers.

I've never tried fitting a 2M Cat, maybe I should just to see what you can get on it for that number. Hint: The hull is close to 1M all by itself, dependnig on where you buy...


This is what ~2m will get you.

Thats... Not actually bad. Smile
Not 700 DPS, sure, but some of the right implants might boost it up nicely.

470 if you plug in 6% small hybrid turret damage, and 6% surgical strike implants in to that fitting.

here
Doris Dents
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#230 - 2013-09-18 20:49:38 UTC
This thread just proves highsec 'bears won't be satisfied until suicide ganking in empire is literally impossible, as in everyone is safety on with no way to change it. They demanded we were forced into frigate sized ships by the insurance nerf but still that's not enough. Never mind they have mining ships that are all but impossible to gank with a reasonable tank unless you have a gank fleet that'd be better off looking for freighters. They won't cease complaining until their max yield AFK isk printing machine is perfectly safe.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#231 - 2013-09-18 21:03:10 UTC
Doris Dents wrote:
This thread just proves highsec 'bears won't be satisfied until suicide ganking in empire is literally impossible, as in everyone is safety on with no way to change it. They demanded we were forced into frigate sized ships by the insurance nerf but still that's not enough. Never mind they have mining ships that are all but impossible to gank with a reasonable tank unless you have a gank fleet that'd be better off looking for freighters. They won't cease complaining until their max yield AFK isk printing machine is perfectly safe.

You forgot that the max yield AFK isk printer should be able to do its job without ever undocking.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Crimson Gauntlet
Six Gun Sound
#232 - 2013-09-18 21:14:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Crimson Gauntlet
Doris Dents wrote:
This thread just proves highsec 'bears won't be satisfied until suicide ganking in empire is literally impossible, as in everyone is safety on with no way to change it. They demanded we were forced into frigate sized ships by the insurance nerf but still that's not enough. Never mind they have mining ships that are all but impossible to gank with a reasonable tank unless you have a gank fleet that'd be better off looking for freighters. They won't cease complaining until their max yield AFK isk printing machine is perfectly safe.


I also find it funny that most of the cute little "suggestions" they make have a tendency to also make it much, much easier to mine AFK or to outright bot.

Honestly, at this point, ganking needs a buff, or exhumers need a nerf, they went too far. I say we take a page from the crybabies playbook, since it clearly works so well. Let's constantly campaign to have exhumers and concord nerfed.

Let's start with taking 5% off the base resists of exhumers. That's not really very much, right? All it would do is make their ships balanced.

Oh, I also think we should have the ability to "tag" players for salvage rights (we can this the "Yaaar" feature), so if that player dies within 5 minutes, we have a chance for salvaging their wreck to drop a BPC for their ship.
Number of times my posts have come in after the dev/mod locked the thread:  1
Solstice Project's Alt
Doomheim
#233 - 2013-09-18 21:16:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Solstice Project's Alt
I've calculated that a 470 dps catalyst would put out 11.750 EFT oompf.

I've fitted a thrasher for oompf, including the 6% implants and get 375 dps.
That number, of course, is ridiculous.



So, using 280mm t2, two gyros and the implants i do 2k raw damage per shot.
I could push it to 2114, but that would lower the RoF more than half a second.


In a 25 second timeframe, my ship does 10k of EFT damage.

That's still around 1.750 less than the catalyst,
(unless i get one more volley, which could happen)
but the thrasher is *much* *much* more versatile.


In the way people use "dps" they are seriously overrating it.


Oh and don't forget the ******* link !
http://imgur.com/FOIkojp



(edit: the name of the fitting is not related to it's use)

Buy Solstice Project for PLEX4GOOD ! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=301266 (this alt-character will get deleted once the sale is done, on 6th of december)
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#234 - 2013-09-18 21:20:30 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
You forgot that the max yield AFK isk printer should be able to do its job without ever undocking.

...but you already can print money without ever leaving the stations, it's called "station trading". Roll

Seriously guys: Evil miner carebears ruining my game boo hu? Doesn't that get old at some point? No wonder nothing ever changes in this game...

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)
Solstice Project's Alt
Doomheim
#235 - 2013-09-18 21:25:14 UTC
Shalua Rui wrote:
...but you already can print money without ever leaving the stations, it's called "station trading". Roll

Seriously guys: Evil miner carebears ruining my game boo hu? Doesn't that get old at some point? No wonder nothing ever changes in this game...
Altough i believe that afk people should get shot,
i believe that this ever increasing coursing of miners,
combined with the way most people play as gankers,
will lead to the gankers' demise.


TL;DR: You're pretty much right.

Buy Solstice Project for PLEX4GOOD ! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=301266 (this alt-character will get deleted once the sale is done, on 6th of december)
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#236 - 2013-09-18 21:25:57 UTC
Shalua Rui wrote:
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
You forgot that the max yield AFK isk printer should be able to do its job without ever undocking.

...but you already can print money without ever leaving the stations, it's called "station trading". Roll

Seriously guys: Evil miner carebears ruining my game boo hu? Doesn't that get old at some point? No wonder nothing ever changes in this game...

Station trading is a totally different kettle of fish, it's an unforgiving and brutal form of "clean" PvP, and can be hilariously expensive when you get it wrong

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#237 - 2013-09-18 21:26:31 UTC
Crimson Gauntlet wrote:
Doris Dents wrote:
This thread just proves highsec 'bears won't be satisfied until suicide ganking in empire is literally impossible, as in everyone is safety on with no way to change it. They demanded we were forced into frigate sized ships by the insurance nerf but still that's not enough. Never mind they have mining ships that are all but impossible to gank with a reasonable tank unless you have a gank fleet that'd be better off looking for freighters. They won't cease complaining until their max yield AFK isk printing machine is perfectly safe.

I also find it funny that most of the cute little "suggestions" they make have a tendency to also make it much, much easier to mine AFK or to outright bot.

Yeah, now that you mention it...

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Hammer Crendraven
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#238 - 2013-09-18 21:28:19 UTC
Careful on that term printing isk.

Mining does not print isk and neither does station trading.
You can earn isk for your character doing these things but you are not printing isk. Just moving it around.

For an example of isk printing; Missions do print isk .
Crimson Gauntlet
Six Gun Sound
#239 - 2013-09-18 21:30:09 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Shalua Rui wrote:
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
You forgot that the max yield AFK isk printer should be able to do its job without ever undocking.

...but you already can print money without ever leaving the stations, it's called "station trading". Roll

Seriously guys: Evil miner carebears ruining my game boo hu? Doesn't that get old at some point? No wonder nothing ever changes in this game...

Station trading is a totally different kettle of fish, it's an unforgiving and brutal form of "clean" PvP, and can be hilariously expensive when you get it wrong


This. There is actually risk of loss in station trading.

Without us, there is no risk of loss whatsoever in mining. It's nothing but inflation. And as a firm, zealous believer in both the Code and in Capitalism, I will continue to fight both inflation and afk mining (which again, tantamount to botting/cheating) where ever I see it. 
Number of times my posts have come in after the dev/mod locked the thread:  1
Solstice Project's Alt
Doomheim
#240 - 2013-09-18 21:32:31 UTC
Doris Dents wrote:
This thread just proves highsec 'bears won't be satisfied until suicide ganking in empire is literally impossible, as in everyone is safety on with no way to change it. They demanded we were forced into frigate sized ships by the insurance nerf but still that's not enough. Never mind they have mining ships that are all but impossible to gank with a reasonable tank unless you have a gank fleet that'd be better off looking for freighters. They won't cease complaining until their max yield AFK isk printing machine is perfectly safe.

This perspective is hilarious.

It's perfectly normal they want that, because they get shot at.

And they keep getting shot at.

And thanks to the bumping, which pushed it into the sports domain,
over time, even *more* people will shoot them !


The only ones who gankers have to blame is themselves.

Buy Solstice Project for PLEX4GOOD ! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=301266 (this alt-character will get deleted once the sale is done, on 6th of december)