EVE General Discussion

eh. KM's are fine. They're useful intel, generally speaking and a modest trophy to wag about among friends.

Of course, there are always those that think that getting a shot in on a blob killmail makes them a pvp'er.

TBH, I think you shouldn't get the KM data if you're in anything bigger than a squadron. :) less whoring, more good fights, I say. the FC should get a datasheet summary of kills/losses after an hour.

Actually I think you are both right. It depends on the situation. Wardec battles tend to be judged on isk lost. Whoever loses the most is considered the loser in a dec - I beleive this is the general consensus when I speak to peeps about it. Battles in low/null I would think the winner is the one who has control over the battlefield and then maintains or gains control of the system of course.

So I see both being right.

*edit - but this is about km's - and I will side with Ranger on the specific KM"s - I could have an ibis left on the field of battle, does that mean my side won? I say it's isk lost is the determining factor in battles.

Very true, your objectives determine who won and who lost... usually based on one of two things.

1: Damage/cost inflicted.
2: Territory won or lost.

The first is obviously determine via kill notifications.

The seconds is revealed by the Sov map, however the decisions on whether it is worth your while to continue fighting for a particular system are often based on information revealed in kill notifications.

Not to mention that quite often, even in null, the objective is not to take and hold a system... but to simply raid into it and inflict as much damage/loss as possible for fun and/or profit with no intention of holding the system against reinforcements from the other side.

Even for a solo miner or hauler a kill board is often very helpful in determining what ships were necessary to take you down (and provides clues as to how it was done), and also provides useful metrics to determine if you are losing ISK over all in your occupation if you have a tendency to be targeted by suicide ganks or war decs.

Situations where the information contained in a kill notification (and made easily accessible via a kill board) is not useful on some level are the exception, not the rule.

Yet, in a 'real world' environment they would most likely exist. Newspapers report on incidents, at times reporting facts on the amount of damage in the amount of money lost/or amount of money needed to repair along with other information.

So I say that if EvE were real (which actually it is) there would be reports on battles, who lost what, isk lost, etc. etc.

So though you think they are cheesy, to many of us they do reflect what could be happening in a real world Environment.

I find that kill mails do the opposite - they actually discourage conflict in Eve. Too many people are concerned about kill / death ratios and isk efficiency. This leads to pilots being more risk averse, as they only want to engage if they know that they can win.

If killmails were removed from the game I bet you'd see people more interested in taking chances, since if they do die there wouldn't be some kind of automatic tally that haunts their egos until the end of time.

Pilots who are risk adverse would find some other excuse if kill notifications were removed.

Welcome to the "Everyone is a winner" generation.

That should be my new sig..."When everyone wins, everyone loses".....

"Killmails are not important -> EVE needs killmails." non-sequitur

The alternative is that killmails ARE an important factor in determining how and even IF people play. In that case, it is worth looking into HOW and WHY they are such an important factor.

What I am finding interesting in this thread is the notion that EVE has a winner. Would anyone care to elaborate on who is winning? Has anyone won yet? How do we determine who is winning and losing? Strictly by ISK efficiency based on kill reports?

It's funny you point that out, because your precious killboard gives out "participation awards" like there is no freaking tomorrow.

Hasn't seemed to stop the "mommy makes me wear a helmet to go on the computer" crowd from flashing their boards.

That's a nice thought but I disagree to an extent. Usually when you blow up a tank in the real world you don't get a notice that says specifically what was in the tank its make up and all around total loss. Usually the tank has taken such a pounding that really any analysis is pointless. And really who cares in the end you lost; I won or vice versa. If you want to hear a report there are bloggers that do write columns on battles.So I disagree. I don't think they'd exist.