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Two ship setup for level 4s?
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Jaynen
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1 - 2013-09-13 18:02:59 UTC
So I was flying a sentry MJD dimi with my main and a Noctis for salvaging with my alt.

Now I am flying a passive tanked rattlesnake with my main and still using the Noctis with my alt.

I recently switched to running salvage drones 5 on the main and 5 on the noctis for wreck cleanup.

My question is what would be a good setup that I could put my alt in to still maybe do the looting since the rattlesnake is so slow even with MWD while bringing some extra DPS/utility and not having to worry about it getting popped too quick?

Something with a descent tank? Maybe another passive tank? Could always fit shield reppers to each of them to cross boost? Use an autotargeter? But enough room to fit a tractor or enough speed for picking up loot or both?
Ginger Barbarella
#2 - 2013-09-13 18:10:51 UTC
inb4 Golem. P

I always do cleanup after turning in the mission with a Noctis, but for two-ship L4's I run Tengu and SNI. Not what you asked, but hey, it's Friday, and I'm avoiding doing work here--- at work. P

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
Jaynen
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#3 - 2013-09-13 18:19:04 UTC
Yeah I just figured maybe I could speed it up rather than having the Noctis cleaning up one room behind the main.

It took me about an hour to clear/cleanup Angel Extravaganza last night
Zaxix
State War Academy
Caldari State
#4 - 2013-09-13 18:25:15 UTC
Jaynen wrote:
Yeah I just figured maybe I could speed it up rather than having the Noctis cleaning up one room behind the main.

It took me about an hour to clear/cleanup Angel Extravaganza last night

That seems like an excessively long time, but I admit I've never actually timed myself. I run my noctis with 4 t2 salvagers, 4 t2 tractors, a mwd, a sensor booster, 3 nanos, and salvage rigs. I've never filled up the hold for a single mission, so I don't think expanders are necessary.

for actual missioning I run a raven and a typhoon, both cruise/range fit with MWD, so travel time within a mission usually isn't an issue. I have a third character in a noctis, but i don't think it would make much difference if you ran two and spent a few extra minutes getting into the noctis and returning. When I ran two characters, I used to run 3 or 4 missions before trading out to the salvager.

Bokononist

 
Mathias Orsen
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2013-09-13 18:27:12 UTC
First and foremost, I don't loot. What I would do is put my main in a turret ship and my alt in a long range Sentry Domi with Micro Jump Drive. While the main is killing off ship, have the alt Micro jump out of the hot zone and have sentry drones assist your main.

Doing this means you really don't even have to worry about close range frigs. If your main is shooting at it, your alt will be shooting at it and if your large turrets cant hit the close frigs, the sentry drones will be. The power of two and the convenience of one.

Leave the loot for some poor sap that can't kill things quick enough. Unless you want to manage a ship that has utility highs for tractor beams (nightmare, Vargur, Kronos, Paladin).

Anouther thing to consider is dual sentry Domi and put a turret on your main to tell your alt's drones what to shoot at. Have a hotkey for your drones to attack.
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#6 - 2013-09-13 19:29:19 UTC
Use two ships the same, then you can use IS Boxer to control them.

Two RNIs would get my vote.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Mathias Orsen
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2013-09-13 19:40:15 UTC
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Use two ships the same, then you can use IS Boxer to control them.

Two RNIs would get my vote.


That would only result in a major waste of missiles. In my extensive experience with missiles vs turrets dealing equal DPS on paper, turrets have a far stronger damage application as well as not having to relaod near as often which is anouther loss to DPS. Missiles really loose it to smaller targets.
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#8 - 2013-09-13 19:41:53 UTC
Mathias Orsen wrote:
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Use two ships the same, then you can use IS Boxer to control them.

Two RNIs would get my vote.


That would only result in a major waste of missiles. In my extensive experience with missiles vs turrets dealing equal DPS on paper, turrets have a far stronger damage application as well as not having to relaod near as often which is anouther loss to DPS. Missiles really loose it to smaller targets.


That depends. On Cruisers and down, sure. On BS and up, then no.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Jaynen
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-09-13 19:48:18 UTC
If the alt isn't the one with the mission how are you getting the noctis back into the missions to clean up? Especially if you turned them in. Or am I missing a piece of that flow with doing 3-4 missions first.

You might be right that iskperhour you would be better off faster running not looting and just going for lp, its hard to leave salvage and loot sitting there tho :)

A second sentry drone boat assisting the first would probably work fairly well
Mathias Orsen
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2013-09-13 22:15:18 UTC
Jaynen wrote:
If the alt isn't the one with the mission how are you getting the noctis back into the missions to clean up? Especially if you turned them in. Or am I missing a piece of that flow with doing 3-4 missions first.

You might be right that iskperhour you would be better off faster running not looting and just going for lp, its hard to leave salvage and loot sitting there tho :)

A second sentry drone boat assisting the first would probably work fairly well


You should be able to bookmark each area and come back after the mission.

It's not hard to leave salvage and loot if it is taking you time to salvage. Time is money so look at how much isk you make in bounties over a given time vs the amount of isk you are making from loot in that same time.

Just keep in mind that the assisting drones are assisting the ship not the drones of that ship so you will need a turret or other offensive module
Ireland VonVicious
Vicious Trading Company
#11 - 2013-09-13 22:19:08 UTC
Jaynen wrote:
Yeah I just figured maybe I could speed it up rather than having the Noctis cleaning up one room behind the main.

It took me about an hour to clear/cleanup Angel Extravaganza last night



I can pull this off in far under an hour with just this character.

Time to rethink the plan as a whole.
Rengerel en Distel
#12 - 2013-09-13 22:59:36 UTC
Mathias Orsen wrote:
Jaynen wrote:
If the alt isn't the one with the mission how are you getting the noctis back into the missions to clean up? Especially if you turned them in. Or am I missing a piece of that flow with doing 3-4 missions first.

You might be right that iskperhour you would be better off faster running not looting and just going for lp, its hard to leave salvage and loot sitting there tho :)

A second sentry drone boat assisting the first would probably work fairly well


You should be able to bookmark each area and come back after the mission.

It's not hard to leave salvage and loot if it is taking you time to salvage. Time is money so look at how much isk you make in bounties over a given time vs the amount of isk you are making from loot in that same time.

Just keep in mind that the assisting drones are assisting the ship not the drones of that ship so you will need a turret or other offensive module


Target painter works, and with Winter will be 5s cycle times.

With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.
Jaynen
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#13 - 2013-09-13 23:13:23 UTC
So using F won't tell drones assisting you to attack along with your own drones?

I could have gone faster but at first the noctis was not ready and I had some other stuff going on :P

But now we are kind of off topic as to what ship would make a good duo
Zaxix
State War Academy
Caldari State
#14 - 2013-09-14 00:24:47 UTC
Jaynen wrote:
If the alt isn't the one with the mission how are you getting the noctis back into the missions to clean up? Especially if you turned them in. Or am I missing a piece of that flow with doing 3-4 missions first.

You might be right that iskperhour you would be better off faster running not looting and just going for lp, its hard to leave salvage and loot sitting there tho :)

A second sentry drone boat assisting the first would probably work fairly well

put all the characters in the same alt corp and then use corporate bookmarks to simplify things. I also frequently have the salvager as a third character who warps into the pocket to clean up while the two mission runners make for the gate. I'm pretty quick at salvaging so depending on the specifics of the mission I sometimes slowboat the BS to the warpgate to cap up while I clean the field. I do a variation of this when sending the mission runners back to turn in a mission or the next mission.

I don't loot every mission. I've recently done a bunch of epic arcs for several characters and the looting there pays off pretty well.

Bokononist

 
Mathias Orsen
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2013-09-14 06:02:00 UTC
Jaynen wrote:
So using F won't tell drones assisting you to attack along with your own drones?


Unfortunately, No. the assisting drones will just sit there like idiots.
Twylla
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2013-09-14 09:11:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Twylla
For a two man? I'd suggest a BS for tanking and focusing on things like BS's and towers, and either a good drone boat (Domi or Myrm) or an offensively minded battlecruiser. Anvil + Hammer style. You want a buddy to quickly mop up smaller targets yet still be able to bloody up battleships once that's done.

If accompanied by ship with extra drone capacity, having a pack of logistics drones (especially shield drones) are really helpful if things go south, or just brushing up between rooms.

~Weapons R&D technician, arms manufacturer, weapons dealer, wormhole project manager, nulsec fleet pilot, armored warfare command/mindlink specialist, thanatos pilot, alliance executor, now retired~

I've done everything. NOW GET OFF MY LAWN!
Jaynen
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#17 - 2013-09-15 02:32:00 UTC
Something that will add DPS, and not require a lot of baby sitting. The rattler passive tanks and has sentry's. Something with some range that can sit next to it and maybe receive a remote rep and just blast away
Mer88
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#18 - 2013-09-15 06:47:34 UTC
cnr auto targeting cruise does about 700 dps with faction launchers

IMO this is way better than a drone dominix alt which does 550-750dps

1) no need to assist your main, just press missle and its done

2) no drone aggro , just turn ur perma shield on .

3) better damage overall because when ever drones switch targets, it loses 1-2 seconds before it shoots auso missiles just keeps firing and swiching targets at an instant

4) big plus is it is mobile , you can have it follow you or just head to the next gate, drone boat need to be stationary


only negative is ammo usage which is very cheap .

i would imagine SNI or any other missile BS would work too but wont do as much applied damage on small targets.

A rattlesnake could be the best with auto targeting missles plus drones.
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#19 - 2013-09-15 08:25:01 UTC
Mer88 wrote:
cnr auto targeting cruise does about 700 dps with faction launchers


If you are using an RNI then there you should be using T2 CM Launchers and T2 ammo. There's no excuse not to.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Mer88
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#20 - 2013-09-15 14:18:55 UTC
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Mer88 wrote:
cnr auto targeting cruise does about 700 dps with faction launchers


If you are using an RNI then there you should be using T2 CM Launchers and T2 ammo. There's no excuse not to.


This fit is for afk 2nd account so only going to fire auto targeting missiles, i think you get the best dps from faction launchers.
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