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a small big change - bounty and killrights
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Rey Ajaichi
Legio Nova Invicta
#1 - 2013-08-31 17:51:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Rey Ajaichi
hi all.

let's assume that:

you get suicided by someone; you get a killright, check it and notice that the 'killer' has a huge bounty on him so you decide to get revenge, but only to find that he is using a crap alt, with crap ships and crap fit.
the alt has -10 standing, but he is still able to freely fly all over the empire space becouse police is too slow; even if you manage to kill him there's no way to get a decent bounty even if you kill him several times, becouse of the value of the ship and only the 20% of that being payed; the pod is 'empty' of course, so you get nothing from that.

so... why not the following:

when you get a killright, you are also allowed to get a bigger bounty, based on the value of your loss that generated the killright

let's say that you loose a 1b ship, then the killright will get you being payed up to 1b on your next kill (or multiple kills?) on that pilot

this should only be available to the killright owner of course

could this work?
any way this could be exploited?

thanks for reading
have a good one

tl;dr
some people suicide using noob alts with crap ships and fittings and empty pods, so there's no way of getting a decent bounty from them
i propose to get a special bounty when you gain a killright, up to the value of the ship you lost.

edit: (thanks to Hopelesshobo)
to avoid this mechanic to be exploited the bounty would not only have to be based off the loss, but also divided by everyone on the killmail.
Dr0000 Maulerant
Union Nanide and Tooling
#2 - 2013-08-31 18:41:04 UTC
I like it. I don't see a glaringly obvious way to exploit it, though that doesn't mean there isn't one.

Tell me again about how every playstyle you dont engage in "doesn't require any effort" and everyone who does it needs to die in a fire. Be sure to mention about how you tried it once but it was too easy/boring/ethnic-homophobic slur. 
Hopelesshobo
Hoboland
#3 - 2013-08-31 18:51:00 UTC
Dr0000 Maulerant wrote:
I like it. I don't see a glaringly obvious way to exploit it, though that doesn't mean there isn't one.


The exploit as the OP currently lists is as follows...you get suicide ganked by 5 people, resulting your 1 bil ship being popped. So you go around and pop all 5 of them, generating 5 billion isk. So to balance it, it would not only have to be based off your loss, but also divided by everyone on the killmail.

Once the OP addresses this exploit issue, then I can give it a +1 because I can't see any other way to exploit the bounty system.

Lowering the average to make you look better since 2012.
Rey Ajaichi
Legio Nova Invicta
#4 - 2013-08-31 18:56:05 UTC
Hopelesshobo wrote:
Dr0000 Maulerant wrote:
I like it. I don't see a glaringly obvious way to exploit it, though that doesn't mean there isn't one.


The exploit as the OP currently lists is as follows...you get suicide ganked by 5 people, resulting your 1 bil ship being popped. So you go around and pop all 5 of them, generating 5 billion isk. So to balance it, it would not only have to be based off your loss, but also divided by everyone on the killmail.

Once the OP addresses this exploit issue, then I can give it a +1 because I can't see any other way to exploit the bounty system.


good point there, i'll add it to my post
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#5 - 2013-08-31 19:12:18 UTC
So really all I need to do to exploit this is to take a bunch of ******* alts around, get them good and bountied up into the tens of millions talking trash and being a general nuisance in trade hub local, and then go gank my main in an unfit battleship or something. I collect the insurance, basically putting me back near neutral, and then go activate the alts' kill rights, pop them all in their noob ships, and collect that bounty money, too. A little harder than it used to be when you could scam your own bounties, but still a great way to make sure that you collect most or all of the money on your own head.
Rey Ajaichi
Legio Nova Invicta
#6 - 2013-08-31 19:56:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Rey Ajaichi
Domanique Altares wrote:
So really all I need to do to exploit this is to take a bunch of ******* alts around, get them good and bountied up into the tens of millions talking trash and being a general nuisance in trade hub local, and then go gank my main in an unfit battleship or something. I collect the insurance, basically putting me back near neutral, and then go activate the alts' kill rights, pop them all in their noob ships, and collect that bounty money, too. A little harder than it used to be when you could scam your own bounties, but still a great way to make sure that you collect most or all of the money on your own head.



mmh that could be a problem :\
but you would only get the bounty being worth as much as the ship you lost, so there is no profit
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#7 - 2013-08-31 20:00:54 UTC
Rey Ajaichi wrote:
Domanique Altares wrote:
So really all I need to do to exploit this is to take a bunch of ******* alts around, get them good and bountied up into the tens of millions talking trash and being a general nuisance in trade hub local, and then go gank my main in an unfit battleship or something. I collect the insurance, basically putting me back near neutral, and then go activate the alts' kill rights, pop them all in their noob ships, and collect that bounty money, too. A little harder than it used to be when you could scam your own bounties, but still a great way to make sure that you collect most or all of the money on your own head.



mmh that could be a problem :\
but you would only get the bounty being worth as much as the ship you lost, so there is no profit

Insurance.

How did you Veterans start?
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#8 - 2013-08-31 20:05:57 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Rey Ajaichi wrote:
Domanique Altares wrote:
So really all I need to do to exploit this is to take a bunch of ******* alts around, get them good and bountied up into the tens of millions talking trash and being a general nuisance in trade hub local, and then go gank my main in an unfit battleship or something. I collect the insurance, basically putting me back near neutral, and then go activate the alts' kill rights, pop them all in their noob ships, and collect that bounty money, too. A little harder than it used to be when you could scam your own bounties, but still a great way to make sure that you collect most or all of the money on your own head.



mmh that could be a problem :\
but you would only get the bounty being worth as much as the ship you lost, so there is no profit

Insurance.


Exactly this. There are several hulls on the market that will damn near zero out if you buy them, insure them, and pop them empty and unfit. Then you go reverse gank your alts, and the profit is your bounty collection.
Rey Ajaichi
Legio Nova Invicta
#9 - 2013-08-31 20:30:51 UTC
then it could be 80% of the ship lost or something
we really need a way to take on those noob alts imho
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#10 - 2013-08-31 20:49:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Domanique Altares
Rey Ajaichi wrote:
then it could be 80% of the ship lost or something
we really need a way to take on those noob alts imho


Fit a tank to your ship. That usually teaches them, since these 'noob alts' aren't going to be ganking jack **** in high sec that fits a tank without some level of skill training. If they are -10, shoot first. That's a great way to take people on.

ETA: It doesn't matter the percent. If I lose a bare hull that pays back 100% of the loss in insurance (and they do exist) then ANY bounty I collect from kill-righting my alt under your system is money in my pocket. This is why the current bounty is based on the KM estimate of the skip the person is in when you kill them, and not the amount of your own loss.
Rey Ajaichi
Legio Nova Invicta
#11 - 2013-08-31 21:14:08 UTC
well tank and shoot first do not always work
those ships istantly warp and when a gang find a target they simply one shot it
anyway, this is pretty much off topic, thanks for your useful comments, i'll think about the whole thing better again
Arya Regnar
Darwins Right Hand
#12 - 2013-08-31 23:40:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Arya Regnar
Here is how you exploit this, you have big bounty on 2 of your chars, you insure your battleship or whatever has good payout, then you suicide gank it with alt that also has big bounty and then you kill your suicide gankers ship after putting both into opposing militias in insured (battleship ?) and also get bounty, extra bounty, insurance and LP.

Tell me I am wrong and this wouldn't work.

Things like OP's idea always present new opportunities.

EvE-Mail me if you need anything.
Rey Ajaichi
Legio Nova Invicta
#13 - 2013-09-02 16:27:45 UTC
Arya Regnar wrote:
Here is how you exploit this, you have big bounty on 2 of your chars, you insure your battleship or whatever has good payout, then you suicide gank it with alt that also has big bounty and then you kill your suicide gankers ship after putting both into opposing militias in insured (battleship ?) and also get bounty, extra bounty, insurance and LP.

Tell me I am wrong and this wouldn't work.

Things like OP's idea always present new opportunities.


Yeah ok, but a new mechanic is needed, the current one still favor pirates over bounty hunters.