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Do you know what really grinds my gears?

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Felicity Love
Doomheim
#21 - 2013-08-05 00:32:43 UTC
.... giggles, adjusts a few market orders, and goes for another long, relaxing swim in the pool full of OTHER PEOPLE'S ISK...

Oh, and "boo hoo". P

"EVE is dying." -- The Four Forum Trolls of the Apocalypse.   ( Pick four, any four. They all smell.  )
Freakdevil
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#22 - 2013-08-05 01:03:16 UTC
I hope it was me. The nerd rage puts a tingle in my toes.
shortattenionsp
Doomheim
#23 - 2013-08-05 01:25:25 UTC
Sometimes undercutting someone heavily is the right thing to do, especially if prices are too high/low and the market for an item is stagnating.

I do think there are a lot of noob traders that do this thinking they're somehow going to bankrupt the other traders by undercutting them though. I normally have 50-100 different items i'm trading in with stock/money evenly split across them and a max of roughly 1/5th of a days stock for the whole market for that item. )

If someone completely and totally crashes the market for one of those items it's not going to hurt me at all. Even several items. It's probably barely possible for someone to cost me even 1% of my capital - certainly not enough for me to ever be damaged so I can't invest in other things.

The thing that annoys me is someone who undercuts but leaves the margin still very profitable - your rival traders are not suddenly going to go bankrupt or leave a market if the margin has gone from 35% to 25%. Everybody likes 25% still. They're going to follow your price down and you've just cost yourself and everyone else 10% and you're no more likely to buy/sell anything. If you want to push people out, put the margin below 7-8% and some people will probably drop out that market.



Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#24 - 2013-08-05 04:14:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain6637
so these are the market tears i hear about

came in expecting a family guy joke, this is much better

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Mara Villoso
Long Jump.
#25 - 2013-08-05 05:35:19 UTC
An oldie but goodie. The classic, you undercutting idiots are killing profit for everyone, if only we could share the market threads.
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#26 - 2013-08-05 05:53:14 UTC
Gazzy Mendelions wrote:
So, I'm a successful station trader making about 2 bil a month.

I love station trading as it brings in the iskies, but there is one part about it that I can't stand,
The IDIOT station traders who try to strong-arm the market to sell/buy an item quicker who really are destroying the profits on the market.

Here's my message to you:

STRONG-ARMING THE MARKET DOESN'T WORK. SOMEONE IS JUST GOING TO BUY/SELL IT MORE MORE/LESS BY 0.01 ISK. AND IN THE END, YOU'RE JUST DESTORYING THE PROFIT FOR OTHER PEOPLE.



What amuses me about this is your lack of insight regarding other actors and their desire to be on the front of the market. The more you try station trade dominate the front of a market, the more likely other actors are to disrupt the market because you aren't letting them shift stock. Particularly with hulls i found letting other people have the front of the market for a while did more than anything else to regulate market prices favourably for builders.

Also, station traders often have the worst cost price for inventory, so those are the ones that will get most angry when you fully close *their* spread, but only half close *your* spread. You may need to cast your net wider.
arabella blood
Keyboard Jihad
#27 - 2013-08-05 05:55:18 UTC
Killing it for you? Who cares for you? I want my isk fast, and if i get to make tears on the way im even more happy.
The best tears are when i undercut and still see you are in your 5 minutes, with huge order, it brings me joy :)

Troll for hire. Cheap prices.

Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#28 - 2013-08-05 06:08:42 UTC
there's better ways to spend LP, but nesting buy orders and sell orders against each other, with 0% margin between them is by far the most satisfying.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Logical Chaos
Very Italian People
The Initiative.
#29 - 2013-08-05 17:36:13 UTC
Gazzy Mendelions wrote:
So, I'm a successful station trader making about 2 bil a month.

I love station trading as it brings in the iskies, but there is one part about it that I can't stand,
The IDIOT station traders who try to strong-arm the market to sell/buy an item quicker who really are destroying the profits on the market.

Here's my message to you:

STRONG-ARMING THE MARKET DOESN'T WORK. SOMEONE IS JUST GOING TO BUY/SELL IT MORE MORE/LESS BY 0.01 ISK. AND IN THE END, YOU'RE JUST DESTORYING THE PROFIT FOR OTHER PEOPLE.



I will continue on your thought "YOU'RE JUST DESTORYING THE PROFIT FOR OTHER PEOPLE.".

TO DRIVE THEM OUT, MATE. If this happens constantly it will make ppl mad or stop 0.01 isking said item for some time because they know it's not worth it while prices are down.

I am currently selling a self-produced item that is required in big volumes every day. The TRADING profit is not so big, my production profit is much bigger. If some skunk-ass-trader that bought some for the current buy order price (which is already 90% of my profit made) I happily ruin his day by adjusting the price downwards in huge chunks even if it finally means that I am filling buy orders. I have a short timeframe before my next batch is ready to sell and that is the point when I start selling more aggressively.
LittleTerror
Stygian Systems
#30 - 2013-08-12 14:55:33 UTC  |  Edited by: LittleTerror
Gazzy Mendelions wrote:
So, I'm a successful station trader making about 2 bil a month.

I love station trading as it brings in the iskies, but there is one part about it that I can't stand,
The IDIOT station traders who try to strong-arm the market to sell/buy an item quicker who really are destroying the profits on the market.

Here's my message to you:

STRONG-ARMING THE MARKET DOESN'T WORK. SOMEONE IS JUST GOING TO BUY/SELL IT MORE MORE/LESS BY 0.01 ISK. AND IN THE END, YOU'RE JUST DESTORYING THE PROFIT FOR OTHER PEOPLE.



Yes they aren't real traders in my eyes, it baffles me why they think a 0.01 isker cares for their stupidly random 134994 isk increase when all I got to do is go and change one number to really **** on their cornflakes 174994 how you like my 40k increase *****...

I update my orders through which ever means is fastest, first being mouse scroll wheel by 0.01 isk and second if someone is a being a bellend I change one number randomly sometimes 10k sometimes 50k but it takes the same amount of time.
Rhivre
TarNec
Invisible Exchequer
#31 - 2013-08-12 14:57:28 UTC
40k on a 174k item? So a 25% increase?

Hope you increase the sell price by a similar amount, otherwise your margins could very easily....erm...decrease to approaching 0.

Fluffy Bunny Pic!

Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#32 - 2013-08-12 14:58:09 UTC
Market carebear detected...
LittleTerror
Stygian Systems
#33 - 2013-08-12 14:59:22 UTC  |  Edited by: LittleTerror
Rhivre wrote:
40k on a 174k item? So a 25% increase?

Hope you increase the sell price by a similar amount, otherwise your margins could very easily....erm...decrease to approaching 0.


I dropped the million, i really shouldn't have but I did, now deal with it.

and if the margins go below 4% I simply cancel the order and pick another item, I don't fuss around when trading, updating over 100 orders at a time for 1 hour or more at a time is enough to drive me insane without all the hassle of spreadsheets or caring how much it is exactly I'm making per item.
enterprisePSI
#34 - 2013-08-12 15:03:37 UTC
LittleTerror
Stygian Systems
#35 - 2013-08-12 15:13:30 UTC
HeXxploiT wrote:
I WILL destroy the profits on the market if it means I can drive other traders out.
I will run buy orders up so high that your wallet will be stretched to the brink and drive sell orders so low that you'll be mortified at the prospect of ever getting involved with that item in that region again.

I will do this again & again & again & again & again until I have trampled my competitors into the dirt.
If you're going to compete with me you'd better have stamina and determination and if you're going to use a bot you had damned well better know how to USE it because I WILL find the holes.

Taking losses in the short term is a long term investment.


yes but I will also just outbid and under cut you all the same, except I won't deliberately destroy profits, I'll let you do that to your self and when you return your orders back to making a profit I'll setup a new order and the cycle repeats because you're a stupid stubborn fool who can't see past their own stupid greed and nor can you see that I also actually don't care what you're doing I just make isk on all the other items while you ruin your self both financially and emotionally. You're distressing only your self, not people like me because only a fool would put all of their eggs in one basket, the moment the profit starts dying I'm already out of that item because my buy order has already been filled and I'm now selling it...
arabella blood
Keyboard Jihad
#36 - 2013-08-12 15:21:27 UTC
LittleTerror wrote:
[quote=HeXxploiT]

you're a stupid stubborn fool who can't see past their own stupid greed and nor can you see that I also actually don't care what you're doing I just make isk on all the other items while you ruin your self both financially and emotionally.


BEST - SUICIDE - SPEECH - EVER Twisted

Troll for hire. Cheap prices.

LittleTerror
Stygian Systems
#37 - 2013-08-12 15:25:55 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
there's better ways to spend LP, but nesting buy orders and sell orders against each other, with 0% margin between them is by far the most satisfying.


except that does not happen much, at least not when I look at all the items and spread my isk among only profitable ones, you see you nut cases just don't get it do you? What did you think you could some how control the entire market in a hub like jita? Don't make me laugh, like I said people will just cancel their orders and trade in something else while you destroy your own wallet numbnuts.
LittleTerror
Stygian Systems
#38 - 2013-08-12 15:31:45 UTC  |  Edited by: LittleTerror
arabella blood wrote:
LittleTerror wrote:
[quote=HeXxploiT]

you're a stupid stubborn fool who can't see past their own stupid greed and nor can you see that I also actually don't care what you're doing I just make isk on all the other items while you ruin your self both financially and emotionally.


BEST - SUICIDE - SPEECH - EVER Twisted


Look do I really care? I'm just explain to an idiot what that idiot is actually doing...

I needed a plex yesterday to pay for my account, I had only 400 mil isk, I went to jita and station traded for about 12 hours, I made 454 million isk profit in just that one day, that's over 100% of starting capital , I saw countless idiots along the way but did they stop me from making my isk?
arabella blood
Keyboard Jihad
#39 - 2013-08-12 15:40:11 UTC
LittleTerror wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
there's better ways to spend LP, but nesting buy orders and sell orders against each other, with 0% margin between them is by far the most satisfying.


except that does not happen much, at least not when I look at all the items and spread my isk among only profitable ones, you see you nut cases just don't get it do you? What did you think you could some how control the entire market in a hub like jita? Don't make me laugh, like I said people will just cancel their orders and trade in something else while you destroy your own wallet numbnuts.


READ THIS GENIUS:

1. http://cdn.meme.li/i/o42kj.jpg

2. http://cdn.meme.li/i/o42lh.jpg

3. http://cdn.meme.li/i/o42m4.jpg

I made it with pictures, so it would be easier to understand for you Big smile

Troll for hire. Cheap prices.

LittleTerror
Stygian Systems
#40 - 2013-08-12 15:44:43 UTC  |  Edited by: LittleTerror
arabella blood wrote:
LittleTerror wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
there's better ways to spend LP, but nesting buy orders and sell orders against each other, with 0% margin between them is by far the most satisfying.


except that does not happen much, at least not when I look at all the items and spread my isk among only profitable ones, you see you nut cases just don't get it do you? What did you think you could some how control the entire market in a hub like jita? Don't make me laugh, like I said people will just cancel their orders and trade in something else while you destroy your own wallet numbnuts.


READ THIS GENIUS:

1. http://cdn.meme.li/i/o42kj.jpg

2. http://cdn.meme.li/i/o42lh.jpg

3. http://cdn.meme.li/i/o42m4.jpg

I made it with pictures, so it would be easier to understand for you Big smile


95%?

How many alts? 300+ orders just won't cut it I'm sorry...

Besides there are multi multi trillions worth of stuff being bought and sold in jita, yes I can see you think a little to highly of your self dear.

could you please destroy the profit on all items then please, I'll have the extra stock shipped in within the next hour to fill your ridiculously high buy orders and i'll profit from your stupid scheme...