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FW plex rules
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sex addict
Cherry Defense Systems
#1 - 2013-08-09 23:08:53 UTC
I'm sure people on here have brought this up before....but screw it. I am only 2 days into this faction warfare thing after being in 0.0 for a while, and I got to say....what is up with the sec status hits I get when a neutral or pirate show up in my plex? Isn't that really, really ridiculous? First off, it's a warzone, second...no one has any other reason to go into one of those things other than to gank...the minute they activate the gate, they should be fair game. I always tried to keep my sec status high, but it's starting to slip in FW because I had a quicker draw than so bone head trying to gank me.

Fix this please.
Katia Echerie
The Tuskers
The Tuskers Co.
#2 - 2013-08-09 23:47:44 UTC
Theres nothing to fix there. You aren't obliged to shoot them when they come in. You can just wait for them to shoot first, its not like its that big of an advantage. Besides, low-sec combat is bound to have sec status hits so the solution to your problem is to get used to it.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#3 - 2013-08-09 23:57:02 UTC
Welcome brother! Soon you will be just like ussssssss... mmmyeeesssssssssss...

How did you Veterans start?
Hesod Adee
Perkone
Caldari State
#4 - 2013-08-10 00:03:06 UTC
Katia Echerie wrote:
Theres nothing to fix there. You aren't obliged to shoot them when they come in. You can just wait for them to shoot first, its not like its that big of an advantage. Besides, low-sec combat is bound to have sec status hits so the solution to your problem is to get used to it.

If they show up in a kiting ship, and you're in a brawler, if you wait for them to attack before scramming their MWD, then you're going to lose. Best to attack first so the fight happens at your preferred distance, not theirs.

If your defense against the other ship is EWAR, then you need to start the fight so that they can't lock you. If you wait for them to attack, then you'll be eating their full alpha strike.

Then there is a bug where members new to the enemy militia still trigger sec hits if you start the fight.

The change doesn't need to be much. Just give the suspect flag to any non-militia member who enters a FW plex.
Katia Echerie
The Tuskers
The Tuskers Co.
#5 - 2013-08-10 00:20:57 UTC
Hesod Adee wrote:

If they show up in a kiting ship, and you're in a brawler, if you wait for them to attack before scramming their MWD, then you're going to lose. Best to attack first so the fight happens at your preferred distance, not theirs.

If your defense against the other ship is EWAR, then you need to start the fight so that they can't lock you. If you wait for them to attack, then you'll be eating their full alpha strike.

Then there is a bug where members new to the enemy militia still trigger sec hits if you start the fight.

The change doesn't need to be much. Just give the suspect flag to any non-militia member who enters a FW plex.


That is a good point. That said, most people that are going to hunt you already have low sec status. Hence its free game to shoot them.
Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2013-08-10 00:34:51 UTC
welcome to lowsec, compadre, where the rules still apply but nobody enforces them (unless you count gate/station guns).
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#7 - 2013-08-10 03:29:43 UTC
Well if I am on an innocent sight seeing tour and happen to stop by a plex and an evil faction warfare pilot aggresses me then they DESERVE a sec hit.

Anyway, it's LOWsec so suck it up.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
sex addict
Cherry Defense Systems
#8 - 2013-08-10 04:46:59 UTC
Katia Echerie wrote:
Theres nothing to fix there. You aren't obliged to shoot them when they come in. You can just wait for them to shoot first, its not like its that big of an advantage. Besides, low-sec combat is bound to have sec status hits so the solution to your problem is to get used to it.



I'm not advocating nerfing sec status hits for agressing neuts out side the WZ plexes.....but the plexes are their for one purpose, faction fighting. I have no problem with pirates coming in for a quick gank, but no one, unelss they are just purposely trying to sound ********, can come up with a reason for any non-FW pilot to come into a plex other than to attack the FW pilot in their. Their are no resources for non WZs to get in there, so it's obvious they are going to attack. The notion that I should have to run or let them fire first puts WZ pilots who are trying to be law abiding soldiers in the bad postion of losing sec status for having a faster quick draw than a bandit.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#9 - 2013-08-10 05:52:57 UTC
sex addict wrote:
[I'm not advocating nerfing sec status hits for agressing neuts out side the WZ plexes.....but the plexes are their for one purpose, faction fighting. I have no problem with pirates coming in for a quick gank, but no one, unelss they are just purposely trying to sound ********, can come up with a reason for any non-FW pilot to come into a plex other than to attack the FW pilot in their. Their are no resources for non WZs to get in there, so it's obvious they are going to attack. The notion that I should have to run or let them fire first puts WZ pilots who are trying to be law abiding soldiers in the bad postion of losing sec status for having a faster quick draw than a bandit.

Underlined the error.

We're not really "soldiers" in a modern sense. We're more like privateers. We align ourselves with a greater faction for whatever reason (mostly personal) and blow stuff up in their name. But all the other "rules" of empire space still apply.

How did you Veterans start?
Mag's
Azn Empire
#10 - 2013-08-10 06:36:06 UTC
You are in FW Faction Warfare. This entitles you to shoot your opposing Faction without a game penalty mechanic.
What you are asking for, is FNW Faction Neutral Warfare.

You have options, either don't shoot or don't shoot first. But if you do engage, then you are bound by the aggression rules the same as everyone else. Being a member of FW, does not exclude you from this. Shooting neutrals or pirates with -4.9 and high sec status first, means you are not being a law abiding solder.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#11 - 2013-08-10 08:47:56 UTC
Summary: If you are shooting NEUTRALS in empire space, you are get a sec hit. Technically this has nothing to do with FW other than the fact that you are a FW (irrelevant in this case) and doing a FW complex. Other than that it's just your average Lowsec pirates doing their own thing.
sex addict
Cherry Defense Systems
#12 - 2013-08-10 16:20:37 UTC
Mag's wrote:
You are in FW Faction Warfare. This entitles you to shoot your opposing Faction without a game penalty mechanic.
What you are asking for, is FNW Faction Neutral Warfare.

You have options, either don't shoot or don't shoot first. But if you do engage, then you are bound by the aggression rules the same as everyone else. Being a member of FW, does not exclude you from this. Shooting neutrals or pirates with -4.9 and high sec status first, means you are not being a law abiding solder.


I can see much of what people are saying, but once again, I am only speaking of what happens IN the FW sites.

Think of it this way...

I have a military objective do to, to capture or defend this site. Any neut/pirate stops me from completing that objective which should aiutmoatically be a crime agaist that soldiers faction. Then they lock that soldier/privateer up...which is the equivalent of pointing a gun at someone....and if the soldier gets the first shot off...he is penalized....doesn't make sense to me.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#13 - 2013-08-10 19:49:46 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
sex addict wrote:
I can see much of what people are saying, but once again, I am only speaking of what happens IN the FW sites.

Think of it this way...

I have a military objective do to, to capture or defend this site. Any neut/pirate stops me from completing that objective which should aiutmoatically be a crime agaist that soldiers faction. Then they lock that soldier/privateer up...which is the equivalent of pointing a gun at someone....and if the soldier gets the first shot off...he is penalized....doesn't make sense to me.

No... it makes sense. They entered the complex... they are neutral (if they were "pirates" or "outlaws" then you can already shoot them without a problem)... then you shoot a neutral based on an assumption (however correct it is).

And again... you are no soldier. You are a privately enlisted third party that kills people in another's name are are paid based on however many kills you score and loot you can collect. You are closer to a mercenary or "legitimate" pirate than an actual solider.

How did you Veterans start?
Rowells
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2013-08-10 20:29:58 UTC
*warps iteron into site* "hey what's this guy doi-" BOOM dead.

FW sites are just like any other mission site. I can't shoot anyone who shows up in complex because they might be pirates. If they really scare you that much lock them up just in case and prepare for the worst.
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#15 - 2013-08-10 20:55:12 UTC
sex addict wrote:


I have a military objective do to, to capture or defend this site. Any neut/pirate stops me from completing that objective which should aiutmoatically be a crime agaist that soldiers faction. Then they lock that soldier/privateer up...which is the equivalent of pointing a gun at someone....and if the soldier gets the first shot off...he is penalized....doesn't make sense to me.


Wow.

If I come into your plex while you're plexing/farming, and I just orbit the button with you; I have done nothing to stop you from completing the plex. I'm neutral. I can't stop the button counting down, I can't run it backwards if you leave, and I can't whore on your LP if you cap the plex.

I've affected your objective in no way whatsoever.

Now, let's suppose that I come into your plex, and I stop you from completing your objective by shooting you up or killing you. Let's further suppose that you're a mostly law-abiding sort, who has sec status above a -5.

Guess what happens to my sec status? It goes down, for having performed an unlawful attack. Just like anyone else who attacks a neutral. I gain a suspect timer, and become fair game for anyone until it runs out. I have now been punished for interrupting your plexing.