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CCP Any changes to Mining for Winter 2012?

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Apollo Gabriel
Kill'em all. Let Bob sort'em out.
Ushra'Khan
#241 - 2011-11-02 17:46:09 UTC
March rabbit wrote:
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:
And in lowsec, properly using your D-scan reduces the risk of gankage entirely.

you have never heard about recon ships haven't you? Shocked


Local first
Always ... Never ... Forget to check your references.   Peace out Zulu! Hope you land well!
Severian Carnifex
#242 - 2011-11-02 20:35:55 UTC
booooooooooooost mining!
Ambassadeur Ur-Shulgi
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#243 - 2011-11-02 21:03:10 UTC
Why not make it like PI? static income? much less profit?

Less Profit less ISK = ships cost much more to build = less captial Blobs

Less profit = not worth doing = less botting

Set it up like A POS in low and null sec, A POS In the belt that can be attacked and with far less Hit points and shield, make it easy to POP. You have to defend it

make mining profits in highsec so low that there are only there for training and learning the mechanic.

Less **** being built = higher prices and will force people to go back to using BS and other sub capitals in fights.

If you do it in low or null you need to defend the operation or someone will just POP it = and bye bye too your profits....No warping to safty for your structure, defend it or lose it...
sYnc Vir
Wolfsbrigade
Ghost Legion.
#244 - 2011-11-02 21:28:31 UTC
Ambassadeur Ur-Shulgi wrote:
Why not make it like PI? static income? much less profit?

Less Profit less ISK = ships cost much more to build = less captial Blobs

Less profit = not worth doing = less botting

Set it up like A POS in low and null sec, A POS In the belt that can be attacked and with far less Hit points and shield, make it easy to POP. You have to defend it

make mining profits in highsec so low that there are only there for training and learning the mechanic.

Less **** being built = higher prices and will force people to go back to using BS and other sub capitals in fights.

If you do it in low or null you need to defend the operation or someone will just POP it = and bye bye too your profits....No warping to safty for your structure, defend it or lose it...



two reason thats out there as the dumbest thing ever post.

1 Mining is an eve career that people choose to do. Because you find it dull, time consuming and worthless doesn't mean everyone does.

2 If its passive and alot lower, the level of mins in the game would be too low and people would ***** a drake cost them 80m.

Mining is already the lowest paying eve career. It needs making more profitable, not taken away from the countless 1000s that have spent time training for it, and enjoy it.

The mass belief that all miners are either bots are afk is becoming somewhat annoying.

Don't ask about Italics, just tilt your head.
Ersahi Kir
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#245 - 2011-11-02 22:41:44 UTC
Ambassadeur Ur-Shulgi wrote:
Why not make it like PI? static income? much less profit?

Less Profit less ISK = ships cost much more to build = less captial Blobs

Less profit = not worth doing = less botting

Set it up like A POS in low and null sec, A POS In the belt that can be attacked and with far less Hit points and shield, make it easy to POP. You have to defend it

make mining profits in highsec so low that there are only there for training and learning the mechanic.

Less **** being built = higher prices and will force people to go back to using BS and other sub capitals in fights.

If you do it in low or null you need to defend the operation or someone will just POP it = and bye bye too your profits....No warping to safty for your structure, defend it or lose it...



Ideas like this is why no one with a PvP agenda should have input on how to make mining better. The risk/reward of low sec mining would be even worse then it already is, and that's an accomplishment. Not to mention this is pretty much akin to saying moar blobs plz.
Paragon Renegade
Sebiestor Tribe
#246 - 2011-11-02 22:52:16 UTC
DIsposible Hero wrote:
Yeah, no minigames. There needs to be more work in finding the good roids, and less in the actual mining; I agree largely with Mr Kidd on that point.

There needs to be more of a risk / reward thing going on with mining. Right now there is absolutely no point in mining in low or non-sov null. Huge risk, crappy reward. It needs to be economically feasible to bring a mining fleet to lowsec, complete with armed guards. Right now you'd make way more isk mining in highsec, and having the "guards" go missioning.

My proposal?

- Introduce two more densities of asteroid; we have 5% and 10% varients, so I guess these would be 15% and 20% varients. Have them only spawn in low and null

- Have lowsec belt roids spawn ONLY the dense / compressed ore types - all 5% or greater

- Have lowsec belts / gravs have a small chance of spawning clusters of ABC ores.

- Make mining ships not suck; more HP ffs!

- (Tangent) T3 "Battle-miners". Make this happen.

Basically, for it to be worth mining in low / null, there needs to be a MASSIVE reward out there for those man enough to seek it, and I just don't see even a big grav full of ABC in lowsec as enough of a carrot to overcome the stick.


I read this old post.

He wins the game

The pie is a tautology
bornaa
GRiD.
#247 - 2011-11-03 09:00:16 UTC
bump
[Yes, I'm an Amateur](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRa-69uBmIw&feature=relmfu)
DetKhord Saisio
Seniors Clan
#248 - 2011-11-10 15:23:13 UTC
So, I was wondering about the NPC side.... where do they actually refine the ore they mine? Let me just say drones flying through space would have RAW ORE, not minerals. Where do they go to refine the raw ore and then die with those minerals in their cargohold? I mean, I ALWAYS fly around with expensive minerals in my cargohold when I PVP, DON'T YOU?

Same goes for NPC faction hauler spawns. Those ships that are carrying 25 million tritanium, 4 million mexallon, 4 million pyerite, 4 million etc... The minerals loot never made sense to me and still does not make sense. The raw ore is what should be hauled around. Make the loot drops heavy as all get out and difficult to haul / refine. This can be a logisical nightmare in WH space storing ore in the pos and removing to empire to sell/refine.

Removing the refined ore (i.e. minerals loot) in NPC cargohold could be one simple change that can help. They still have the same loot table but are required to use refining skills to convert it to minerals.

NPC missions, anoms, and sites have refineries. You loot ore and haul to mission/anom/site refinery and refine it. Problem solved.
Eternus8lux8lucis
Guardians of the Gate
RAZOR Alliance
#249 - 2011-11-10 19:53:35 UTC
Some of the better ideas and thoughts....



grav site and scannable belts only for higher ores than veld
make the easier belts scannable with on board scanner the harder with probes
easiers are all within 4aus of planets and celestials harder are random

large asteroids of varying ore types
laser positioning determines ore extraction
pocket depletion similar to PI

overheating of laser and destruction of laser possible due to slow heat buildup liek weapons

NPC corporations available for security rentals.
prices based on sec status

escalation of rats at belts over time

fake asteroids devoid of reprocessable mins but still "mineable"

Mining of one type reduces the amounts of other ore types in the asteroid due to waste process

Move all Ice to scannable moving comets

remove asteroid naming clientside

scanning is only way to show ore composition, visual composition to show ore types same as PI

unscanned grav sites despawn and respawn again in the same system within 30mins to 1 hour
number of belts in system remains static
only activated belts stay
activated belt is one with a ship having warped to it and on grid to it
if activated and unused for 30mins-1 hour site despawns and respawns in system

Im real life finding a worthwhile resource to mine is the hardest, most timeconsuming and resource draining part of resource extraction. There are far more misses than hits to find a profitable source. There are tons of minerals all over the earth but most are not profitable by a long shot.


Megaroids and colonies only in WH space but low EHPs so definitely gankable.

Low sec ores with a huge yield boost to make mining in low sec worth it. Null needs no boost except maybe to veld but even then its too easy to secure there.

Have you heard anything I've said?

You said it's all circling the drain, the whole universe. Right?

That's right.

Had to end sometime.
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#250 - 2011-11-10 20:17:49 UTC
Weaselior wrote:
ccp literally believes the tedium of mining is a positive and something that should be in the game, a task you do semi-afk



They probably like it less since you've started to gank their hulks mining afk Lol

I really hope so Twisted
Kymatica
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#251 - 2011-11-10 21:06:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Kymatica
A big NO THANKS to crappy mini games involved in mining, for using multiple acounts to mine i find this idea pretty horrible, i don't want to be playing join the dots or some such crap while mining with however many accounts, and im sure others with fleets of personal mining toons may feel the same.
Lairne Tekitsu
DadTZ
#252 - 2011-11-10 22:08:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Lairne Tekitsu
Okay, here's a crazy idea: Enormous, semi-hollow asteroids full of tunnels and rooms. You could navigate your ships in (this would actually make smaller mining ships, like the racial mining frigates or procurer, more useful; perhaps even add very small tunnels with very dense, vauable ore that only friagtes can fit into) and mine out veins in the walls and things. There could be things like immense geodes with huge crystals of minerals lining the walls, or hidden bases with turrets and rare items.

When flying inside, normal ships would scrape against walls and take damage without skill, and also alert everyone else inside. However, mining vessels would have special systems that will push them away from walls with reverse-tractor beams or something. This would discourage ganking and give miners opportunities to escape when they hear or detect other vessels coming into the asteroid. You could even be invisible to sensors when inside an asteroid.

This would also discourage AFK mining and botting an whatnot, since the ores in veins and things would be too small to mine for long, so your can'thide inside a roid, set your miners on something, and then go wander off to make a sandwich or something.


Oh, and make it dark inside, so you have to light everything up with spotlights and those decorative lights all over the mining barges and the Cormorant and things.


Edit: Oh, and have rocks fly around in belts and cause damage that can only be deflected by the aforementioned reverse-gravity thing that mining barges get, or maybe lots of point-defense cannon. So gankers and the like will have trouble , but not be utterly doomed.

The question is, how the hell will CONCORD get into these places?
Commander A9
This Was The Way
#253 - 2011-11-11 01:16:40 UTC
Being a hardcore miner, I can't agree with the idea of "minigames" while mining either. When we run big fleet ops, it's difficult enough trying to keep track of all the squads and ore amounts inside Orca hangars, haulers, and whatnot, let alone protecting the fleet from attack. Minigames are just one more distraction.

What I'd like to see fixed about mining are the strip miner sounds. I loved the original orange beams that constantly emitted "drilling" audio (for lack of a better term). Same went for the ice beams, and the intermittent pulses of the miner turrets. They were unique, and much more awesome than the "new" mining equipment.

Now...these "new" blue beams released as of the latest Captain's Quarters/new turrets edition don't seem to make mining as interesting.

It's too quiet, the beams seem weaker (even though cycle time, range, and yield haven't been affected), and I feel like I'm not doing any kind of damage. Crazily enough, I don't feel "powerful" in my Hulk with these blue beams. The orange beams made me feel like I was really blasting away at the belts and really getting stuff done.

I know-old "orange drillers" vs "quiet blues" are aesthetics more than anything else, but I loved the old strip miner and miner turret audio and visuals, and I'd love to see them come back.

Recommendations:

-enable ships wobbling in hangar view (pre-Captains Quarters)

-add more missions (NPC fleet vs. NPC fleets that actually shoot)

-STOP NERFING EVERYTHING!

Join Live Events!
Dunkler Imperator
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#254 - 2011-11-11 03:53:10 UTC
Just had an awsome idea for a mining change

Allow dreads to fit Strip miners and Have siege mode give a crazy amount of mining buffs.

Problem solved.
Revolution Rising
Last-Light Holdings
#255 - 2011-11-11 04:14:41 UTC
CCP Phantom wrote:
Off topic posts removed, please stay on topic.

We aim to release information about new plans, features and gameplay changes as fast as possible and as soon as they are available. Please check our news items, forums and other social media to stay well informed about EVE. Thank you.



Can you put more inconsequential off-topic **** in this post please?

Thanks.

.
Krios Ahzek
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#256 - 2011-11-11 04:17:13 UTC
Dunkler Imperator wrote:
Just had an awsome idea for a mining change

Allow dreads to fit Strip miners and Have siege mode give a crazy amount of mining buffs.

Problem solved.


A siege module for hulks that greatly increases HP but removes movement. Now that's an idea. You won't like him when he's angry.

Perhaps even a reinforced mode module that needs strontium in order to work. Yeah it'll save your ship from a DPS-based gank, but it'll cost you.

 Though All Men Do Despise Us
Revolution Rising
Last-Light Holdings
#257 - 2011-11-11 04:21:53 UTC
Alistair Cononach wrote:
Proposal for Revision of Mining in EVE Online:

Step 1. Revision of Asteroid Distribution:

--All Low-Tier (Veldspar, Scordite, ec.) Asteroids are distributed Universally (all space, high-sec, low-sec, 0.0) and in Static, Permanent Asteroid Belts.

These permanent re-spawning belts have a small chance to spawn a rare higher-tier Asteroid or two at each Belt Re-Spawn.

--All Mid-to-Higher-Tier Asteroids are distributed in Exploration Site Locations Only. These must be scanned down as with other exploration sites, and each location will contain only a few asteroids (1-10), and (usually) no Faction rats.

These Exploration Asteroid Clusters only appear in certain locations of space, as determined by CCP. Some Ores in some 0.0, Some Ices in some 0.0, some Ores only in Low-Sec and some Ices only in Low-Sec. This uneven distribution is designed to create trade, scarcity and opportunity. Not all minerals or ices should be in abundance everywhere.

Step 2: The Mining Process (Scan, Mine, Scan, Mine...) :

--Currently, Mining is as simple as “look at overview, get in range, fire zee Miners, rinse and repeat”.

--Under the Revision, All Asteroids on the overview lose their type descriptions. All asteroids must be scanned to determine what ores they contain and in what quantities, and their location on the asteroid. Some asteroids will contain nothing of value. Most will contain a single ore-type. Some will contain multiple ore types.

--Miner will scan the road till they find one they wish to work on. Once that is done, (and the results pop up), they can activate their mining modules/drones on the results.

--Every 10-15 cycles, the asteroid must be re-scanned and the miners re-targeted and re-activated. Failure to re-scan will result in a lower yield, or worthless space rock (random chance of either).

Step 3: The Rare Events Table (Pop-Ups/Action Events):

--Implement a “Rare Events Table” of events that can occur while mining, that require or promote human reaction. For example:

Pressure Pocket Rupture – You’ve ruptured a volatile and unstable gas pocket. You have 60 seconds to withdraw to a safe distance. After 60 second, an AOE Damage Explosion occurs (destroying the asteroid that was being mined) that damages all ships within 20km. In place of the destroyed asteroid is a very small amount of ultra-rare-elements (to be implemented) that serve some industrial/manufacturing purpose.

Hidden Ore Uncovered – While Mining, you’ve uncovered a hidden pocket of improved Ore/Ice your scanner could not detect. Gives the option o re-target the better Ore-type or Ice if acted upon within 60 seconds. Failure to act results in the ore being lost to cave in, crushing or mining unit damage.

Valuable Gas Pocket – You’ve uncovered a pocket of rare and valuable gas (i.e. Wormhole gasses). If you have a Gas Harvester on your Ship, you can Harvest these gasses by re-targeting them. Failure to do so within 60 seconds means the gas escapes and the opportunity is missed.

Asteroid Depletion -- Apparently your scanner was wrong, and the amount of Ore less than thought. The Asteroid is depleted early.

Hidden Cache – You’ve uncovered a hidden cache of supplies buried within the Asteroid. Gives the opportunity to loot the cache for 60 seconds. Failure to do so and the asteroid collapses on the cache, destroying it. Cache can contain any kind of module, salvage or other loot as determined by that systems Security-Level. Lower value in high-sec, higher in 0.0.

Hidden Database – You’ve uncovered a hidden Faction Database. This remote database storage link unit contains the location of an Expedition, or Faction Rat Location (security level appropriate) and provides you a bookmark for its location nearby (1-5 systems away). Failure to react within 60 seconds causes the database unit to be damaged beyond repair by your mining units.

Both the Hidden Cache and the Hidden Database would be the “ultra-rare” rare events, and could contain some special miner-specific stuff. Specifically, Faction Mining Gear (to be implemented, the miners equivalent to Faction Rat Belt Spawns) all the way up to ultra-rare Faction Mining Vessel BPC’s (Frigates, Cruisers, Battleships-equivalent Mining Hulls for Each Faction, lots of opportunity for rareity and cool new hull designs).



I like this kind of thinking.

Turning mining into a PI style interface for a particular rock and mining it could indeed screw the bots over. (I know you didn't quite go to a PI interface but you were getting close to it).

Why not scan? mine the red areas, scan again etc.. ?


.
theteck
#258 - 2011-11-11 04:37:02 UTC
give us the rorqual in highsec and stop bother me with ... its go only in low sec .... sorry its a programmed game and can be changed

--------------------------------------------------------------------------- | I'm from Québec and english its my secondary language... | 
Assegai Developments
Perkone
Caldari State
#259 - 2011-11-12 04:55:54 UTC
theteck wrote:
give us the rorqual in highsec and stop bother me with ... its go only in low sec .... sorry its a programmed game and can be changed



If you actually got this response from CCP, they obviously were just trying to do the next best thing to ignoring your request by feeding you pseudo technical bullshit.

In reality the only thing stopping rorquals from going to highsec is that they can't jump through normal gates, and you can't light cynos in highsec. The whole reason the orca was created was to be a miniature rorqual. Use a orca instead of a rorqual for mining bonuses.

If you gave the orca the same or a similar ore compression mod, it would take too much away from the usefulness of a rorqual and would turn it into little more than a POS refueler and transporter.
Imrik86
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#260 - 2011-11-17 20:47:29 UTC
Cross-posting from another thread, since some cool ideas spawned there:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=33928&p=40

I think it's more about turning mining into something that takes more effort and risk, but proportionately more rewarding if you do it right, instead of just being a brainless, boring time-sink like it is today.

What about any (or all) of the below:


  • Get rid of the belts on overview and menu, don't give information for free. Have those belts be scanned just like today's grav sites. This makes low-sec mining less absurdly risky since people will have to scan you down, not just look at local and jump at you. Also makes hi-sec mining less vulnerable to bots since it's harder to script.
  • Give more variation to the size of each belt (smaller and bigger than current belts) to force people to hunt for the best belts, and be rewarded for that.
  • Give more variation to asteroid size and composition. Have some dummy ones, too. Give a reason for scanner modules to exist.
  • Make prospecting be the task that takes more effort, instead of being bored to death watching lasers hitting rocks. If people take 2, 3 days prospecting for the best spot, but take a couple of hours to strip a belt for a big reward, it's less predictable and more fun. The market will also fluctuate more and speculating on commodities will be worth it.
  • Spawn more, more difficult rats, even in hi-sec. Have them escalate according to the belt size. Force miners to require escort from combat ships, instead of the current state where mining is boring, and if you want PvE missions are the only choice. Force people to play together, it's supposed to be a multiplayer game, dammit.


This would make mining something that you actually want to do. Also, because someone will have to prospect before and during any mining to chose the best belts and asteroids, players who use bots will be simply less effective shooting at no-value rocks in no-value belts.

Not mention that if mining = more fun, more fun = more players.