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duels: Newb bait and pod kills yay!
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kseniya Dragonfell
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2013-07-23 15:46:21 UTC
It seemed on the surface that duels were a fun way to risk and inexpensive ship at the old Pator Academy. Nope! it is instead a way for board T4 pilots to pod kill newbs, myself included. I understand that CCP clearly states that pod kills are possible.

http://www.eveonline.com/retribution/dueling/

However putting this post up (and the fact that they have edited it on several occasions for clarity) pretty much only admits to a problem, while doing nothing to address it. "Did you get the memo?"

Now I guess it is CCP choice to pretend that eve is the only mmo that exists and no one else matters, but in starting areas in pretty much every other game ever, dueling is a way to test your mettle and then take some things back to the drawing board early on.

Ok I get that eve is different, and I understand that dueling was a response to the old school can robbing mechanic, but griefing newbs will NEVER be good for a game and in my week of play I have never seen dueling used for anything but.

You want to let them one shot me? Cool lesson learned. You want to let them pod kill me as their victory dance? Fine whatever. At least don't pay them to do it in high sec.

If all the previous statements occur please for the love of all don't let them loot my can or salvage my ship without concord intervention in high sec. Because doing so promotes nasty behavior, doing so weakens the growth of the game, and there are a lot of positive possible work arounds to a limited engagement system that don't involve griefing.
Oraac Ensor
#2 - 2013-07-23 16:01:58 UTC
If you see anyone doing that in a rookie system, report them.

There's a whole thread about this: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=230994&find=unread

GM The Doctor wrote:
Greetings,

First I would like to note that this is not open for discussion with us at CCP customer support, the rules are quite clear regarding this behavior.

Quote:
Tricking, or attempting to trick new players into situations where you can fire on them freely in rookie systems is strictly prohibited.

This information is publicly available and is displayed on the Evelopedia article for rookie systems which is managed by CCP Customer Support. The article can be found here:

http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Rookie_Systems

To quote SGM Homonoia from 2012.10.15 10:48

"In all seriousness, do NOT try and game the system to go after rookies. We do not care how well you argue or how well your internet lawyering skills are. We do NOT allow this and the spirit of this principle trumps any and all other rules about game play we have. If you do this and your argument is "but this rule or this mechanic states..." then stop right there and do not bother; we WILL hammer down on that. No exceptions."

We can fully understand that you wish to use the various PVP options available to you, however such activity may draw unwanted attention of new players towards you, so we strongly suggest you move such activity out of the 25 solar systems currently listed and move it to any of the 7,674 other solar systems available to you.

With regards,
GM The Doctor
Leafar Nightfall
Silent Owls
#3 - 2013-07-23 16:05:30 UTC
There's an option to automatically decline any duel, you can find it pretty easily on the options on the left

Enjoy your Eve
Oraac Ensor
#4 - 2013-07-23 16:10:29 UTC
Leafar Nightfall wrote:
There's an option to automatically decline any duel, you can find it pretty easily on the options on the left

Enjoy your Eve

The OP obviously knows that.
Jayor Robb
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#5 - 2013-07-23 17:08:29 UTC
BRAND new player here. I feel for the OP, but isnt this an extremely easy problem to avoid?

I'm still in the rookie zones and get duel requests and see floating pods all the time.

Just avoid them like the plague. I always assumed that they were bait for trolls, glad I never got tempted! XD

You've been playing EvE for 6 years and gate camping is the best idea you can come up with? XD
Oraac Ensor
#6 - 2013-07-23 17:45:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Oraac Ensor
Jayor Robb wrote:
BRAND new player here. I feel for the OP, but isnt this an extremely easy problem to avoid?

I'm still in the rookie zones and get duel requests and see floating pods all the time.

Just avoid them like the plague. I always assumed that they were bait for trolls, glad I never got tempted! XD

That's the problem.

Newbies have a right to duel amongst themselves. If older players come in and mess things up newbies could get paranoid about accepting challenges and be deprived of a useful learning experience.
Jayor Robb
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#7 - 2013-07-23 17:50:09 UTC
Oraac Ensor wrote:

That's the problem.

Newbies have a right to duel amongst themselves. If older players come in and mess things up newbies could get paranoid about accepting challenges and be deprived of a useful learning experience.


Thats a good point, but its like 3 clicks from the overview when someone challenges you to a duel to get their ship/character info and see whats up.

I'd be down to duel another noob of course, but when a player in a battlecruiser challenges my barely-fitted Venture to a duel the second I leave the noob station, the writing is pretty much on the wall. Lol

You've been playing EvE for 6 years and gate camping is the best idea you can come up with? XD
kseniya Dragonfell
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2013-07-23 17:55:26 UTC  |  Edited by: kseniya Dragonfell
Oraac Ensor wrote:
Jayor Robb wrote:
BRAND new player here. I feel for the OP, but isnt this an extremely easy problem to avoid?

I'm still in the rookie zones and get duel requests and see floating pods all the time.

Just avoid them like the plague. I always assumed that they were bait for trolls, glad I never got tempted! XD

That's the problem.

Newbies have a right to duel amongst themselves. If older players come in and mess things up newbies could get paranoid about accepting challenges and be deprived of a useful learning experience.


That's my point exactly, and to the side I could even laugh heartily about the whole thing if I didn't do the "walk of shame" back to my can to find the damn thing had been scavenged already! I know damn well it was not some newb that scavenged it we don't even have the skill yet out at pator tech school it's 1 mil and you get it from a quest for free anyway!

Thanks a lot for all the responses, I guess I should have marked that guy, it's just with a decade of mmo's under my belt I didn't really feel like qq'ing in chat when I willingly accepted the duel.

Edit: Just as a side note, in the spirit of EVE this is a hardcore and ruthless pvp game for sure, hell that's what brought me here, but dueling "SHOULD" be a great way to get your feet wet but instead it seems like it is more often used as an exploit for greifing. I am just thankful that we have a community willing to police themselves and look forward to being an enforcer of conduct myself.
kseniya Dragonfell
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2013-07-23 18:03:14 UTC
Jayor Robb wrote:
Oraac Ensor wrote:

That's the problem.

Newbies have a right to duel amongst themselves. If older players come in and mess things up newbies could get paranoid about accepting challenges and be deprived of a useful learning experience.


Thats a good point, but its like 3 clicks from the overview when someone challenges you to a duel to get their ship/character info and see whats up.

I'd be down to duel another noob of course, but when a player in a battlecruiser challenges my barely-fitted Venture to a duel the second I leave the noob station, the writing is pretty much on the wall. Lol


I don't yet know how to check a players fit from overview, I tried and in the end he just didn't look all that flashy turns out the ship he was in was called the Machariel and is about the nastiest least flashy ship there is :( my rifter might as have been naked took me my whole trial account to get the damn thing the way I wanted it.

Ah well I will find that dude someday :P
Oraac Ensor
#10 - 2013-07-23 18:04:13 UTC
Jayor Robb wrote:
Oraac Ensor wrote:

That's the problem.

Newbies have a right to duel amongst themselves. If older players come in and mess things up newbies could get paranoid about accepting challenges and be deprived of a useful learning experience.


Thats a good point, but its like 3 clicks from the overview when someone challenges you to a duel to get their ship/character info and see whats up.

I'd be down to duel another noob of course, but when a player in a battlecruiser challenges my barely-fitted Venture to a duel the second I leave the noob station, the writing is pretty much on the wall. Lol

The argument was done to death in the thread I linked.

The fact remains that older players challenging newbies in rookie systems is regarded as griefing.

End of.
Trudeaux Margaret
University of Caille
#11 - 2013-07-23 18:31:43 UTC
kseniya Dragonfell wrote:
Jayor Robb wrote:
Oraac Ensor wrote:

That's the problem.

Newbies have a right to duel amongst themselves. If older players come in and mess things up newbies could get paranoid about accepting challenges and be deprived of a useful learning experience.


Thats a good point, but its like 3 clicks from the overview when someone challenges you to a duel to get their ship/character info and see whats up.

I'd be down to duel another noob of course, but when a player in a battlecruiser challenges my barely-fitted Venture to a duel the second I leave the noob station, the writing is pretty much on the wall. Lol


I don't yet know how to check a players fit from overview, I tried and in the end he just didn't look all that flashy turns out the ship he was in was called the Machariel and is about the nastiest least flashy ship there is :( my rifter might as have been naked took me my whole trial account to get the damn thing the way I wanted it.

Ah well I will find that dude someday :P


http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Machariel

It's funny-looking, but it's one of the more overpowered (and expensive) battleships in the game currently. Sorry you got swatted so badly and I hope you do find that dude - and his Macharial - someday.


> anyone willing to give me like a 5 min politics crash course?

> grr goons, lowsec is full of elitist sh*s, all roads lead to the bittervet pl
Jayor Robb
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#12 - 2013-07-23 18:41:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Jayor Robb
Oraac Ensor wrote:

The argument was done to death in the thread I linked.

The fact remains that older players challenging newbies in rookie systems is regarded as griefing.

End of.


End of? Who are you arguing with? lol

Anyway, my only point was that whether its griefing or not, these issues are extremely easy to avoid even for new players like myself with the tiniest bit of common sense.

To each their own, but I'd rather fix the problem myself immediately than complain to someone else who will maybe fix it for me.

You've been playing EvE for 6 years and gate camping is the best idea you can come up with? XD
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2013-07-23 19:08:43 UTC
If you get podded in high sec when you're at your computer you have to be a special kind of bad.

Art of Explosions
Viktor Solvin Gaterau
Federation Navy 3rd Fleet
#14 - 2013-07-23 19:20:35 UTC
Oraac Ensor wrote:
If you see anyone doing that in a rookie system, report them.

There's a whole thread about this: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=230994&find=unread

GM The Doctor wrote:
Greetings,

First I would like to note that this is not open for discussion with us at CCP customer support, the rules are quite clear regarding this behavior.

Quote:
Tricking, or attempting to trick new players into situations where you can fire on them freely in rookie systems is strictly prohibited.

This information is publicly available and is displayed on the Evelopedia article for rookie systems which is managed by CCP Customer Support. The article can be found here:

http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Rookie_Systems

To quote SGM Homonoia from 2012.10.15 10:48

"In all seriousness, do NOT try and game the system to go after rookies. We do not care how well you argue or how well your internet lawyering skills are. We do NOT allow this and the spirit of this principle trumps any and all other rules about game play we have. If you do this and your argument is "but this rule or this mechanic states..." then stop right there and do not bother; we WILL hammer down on that. No exceptions."

We can fully understand that you wish to use the various PVP options available to you, however such activity may draw unwanted attention of new players towards you, so we strongly suggest you move such activity out of the 25 solar systems currently listed and move it to any of the 7,674 other solar systems available to you.

With regards,
GM The Doctor




Excellent post!
Ned Taggart
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2013-07-23 20:37:00 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
If you get podded in high sec when you're at your computer you have to be a special kind of bad.


Yeah or maybe, you know, new.
Silas Sedal
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2013-07-23 21:10:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Silas Sedal
kseniya Dragonfell wrote:
I don't yet know how to check a players fit from overview, I tried and in the end he just didn't look all that flashy turns out the ship he was in was called the Machariel and is about the nastiest least flashy ship there is :( my rifter might as have been naked took me my whole trial account to get the damn thing the way I wanted it.

Ah well I will find that dude someday :P


Unless I'm mistaken you'd just have to left-click on a player's name in the overview and hold it to bring up the radial menu. From there, select the info button (should be a small "i" on the left-hand side at 9 o'clock), and once the information window is up the furthermost right tab should be the fitting.

You can also do the same thing in open space. Just left-click and hold the press over your own ship or someone else's. You'll see the radial menu pop-up and from there you can look up whatever you'd like in regard to the pilot or his or her ship.

Simply the worst capsuleer there's ever been.

Alternate Poster
Zerious Fricken Biziness
#17 - 2013-07-24 02:04:13 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
If you get podded in high sec when you're at your computer you have to be a special kind of bad.


No, you just need a special kind of internet connection.
Until recently I had a highly variable 1-2 second latency to EVE for around about a year.
Lost a pod half the time I lost a ship even when spamming warp.
Cannibal Kane
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#18 - 2013-07-24 05:33:19 UTC
I recently destroyed a corporation for duel baiting in a newbie system. If you see these guys petition them and mail me their names.

The other promised me they will never do that again.

"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk
Oraac Ensor
#19 - 2013-07-24 08:25:09 UTC
Jayor Robb wrote:
Oraac Ensor wrote:

The argument was done to death in the thread I linked.

The fact remains that older players challenging newbies in rookie systems is regarded as griefing.

End of.


End of? Who are you arguing with? lol

I'm not arguing with anyone.

Read my post again.
Lugalbandak
Doomheim
#20 - 2013-07-24 10:01:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugalbandak
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
If you get podded in high sec when you're at your computer you have to be a special kind of bad.



you could also say with your comment the solution , please help newbies here.

Right before you ship get blow to parts , spam the warp button to a celestial , example a planet or the sun or whatever.
Then your pod instant warp to there , only in null sec with a warp dis bubble tey can kill your pod then.

have fun in eve , and you can always mail me for questions

srry for bad english

edit: and yeah in newbo bro system , report the guys , and with above , with a old rig and lag it wont always work.

The police horse is the only animal in the world that haz his male genitals on his back
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