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[Q] Exploration sites spawn / respawn ?
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Leo Sagan
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-07-20 09:01:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Leo Sagan
Hi all !

After running a lot of relic / data sites in lowsec, I have 2 questions.

1) It seems there are not so many low-sec systems on the map, it's like a thin layer around the hi-sec and beyond that, a vast 0.0 (and below) realm that I'm a little afraid to scout ("Here be dragons eating n00bs"). I made a "road" of 80+ lowsec systems that I explored during the last few days (Yeah, I know, I *definitely* need a life :-) and now, it seems there are a few scattered lowsec systems I didn't visit on the map, but not that many. Did I overlook something, or is low-sec relatively small compared to null and high sec space ?

2) So, logically, I'm wondering about the spawning system of these exploration sites. I tried to re-visit a bunch of systems just one day after visiting them (after CCP's daily cut) and I didn't find any relic / data sites. But maybe it was just a feeling or me beeing unlucky. I thought that once the sites were emptied by a player, they would necessarily respawn somewhere after the cut in another place, so that there was a fair chance to find new ones in lowsec daily, even if it wasn't sure. I tried to find the answer in the forums, unfortunately what I read didn't always make sense :-(

Do we know for sure how these sites respawn since Odyssey ? And can you explain it to me and all the newbies who will read this ?

Thanks in advance :-)
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#2 - 2013-07-20 09:36:56 UTC
1) Nullsec has 3,524 systems, wormholes 2,498 and Empire(high+low) has 1907 systems from which about 800 are lowsec and 1100 are highsec. Highsec is mostly a giant connected ball and lowsec covers it and lowsec areas aren't evenly divided between all races, so there are indeed only thin layers of lowsec at places.

2) Sites respawn immediately or very soon after they've been completed somewhere withing a certain predetermined area. There are some obvious limits like highsec sites spawn only in high, certain sites don't spawn in 1.0 or 0.9 systems, low sec sites spawn in low, WH sites in WHs and so on. The thing is no one actually knows how the respawn system works in detail and CCP is determined to keep it that way. There are a lot of educated guessing, but no one actually knows. We do know, that they respawn constantly, so there should always be sites available, but areas being actively explored will contain less simply because they're completed soon after spawning, so they don't have the chance to accumulate in the area. Having to do a lot of traveling in search of sites is the normal thing for a dedicated explorer.
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-07-20 09:46:33 UTC
Respawning is definitely not tied to DT. I used to do a lot of exploring a couple hours before DT and would always find some sites. Don't have much time to explore these days, but I have several times seen a system that had 1 sig just after DT and when I go back through that system some time later that day there are 2 or more sigs.

Last time I a discussion on the respawn theory, it was limited only by sec and pirate faction. So a highsec Sansha site can respawn anywhere in highsec that has Sansha rats. Someone (I can't remember who) did a huge amount of work on Sisi and concluded that the respawns are probably not tied to the region.
Max Godsnottlingson
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2013-07-20 10:05:24 UTC
Leo, you have to remember, that originally there was no low sec, just Empire 1.0 to 0.1, there were even a few Empire 0.0 systems back in the mist of time, and null sec 0.0 space.

The high - low sec division is very much the result of too many 'cobbled together' hodge podge 'make do' routines, implemented by CCP as they had several harsh object lessions in how the player base can think outside the box and turn any game system weakness to their advantage.
Leo Sagan
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2013-07-20 10:42:56 UTC
Thanks for these answers !

Destiny, I had *no* idea that there were so many lowsec systems (800 Shocked), even if that makes a thin layer. I just spent a long time trying to decipher the map again : this tool is powerful but I guess I suspect it was designed with the occular implants technology in mind, because, man, it's difficult to read ! Still, I found two alternate routes already, so I guess I won't get short on low-sec systems any time soon.

The fact that no one knows for sure about the respawn system is kinda cool actually : at least, something that we can't put in charts , maybe we're real explorers and not just a bunch of greedy anomalies farmers after all Blink

Elena, I'm glad to learn that it's not tied to DT, it's better that way : I really thought exploring had to be done after DT.

Max, I didn't know that : from a newbie perspective, lowsec is as ancient as the EVE Gate Big smile I really need to do some reading about the game's history and even the lore. EVE is just so big, one doesn't know where to start sometimes.
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2013-07-20 11:01:09 UTC
Leo Sagan
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2013-07-20 11:05:28 UTC
Elena Thiesant wrote:
Maps - http://evemaps.dotlan.net/


My eyes are very grateful Big smile
Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#8 - 2013-07-20 11:05:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Destination SkillQueue
Leo Sagan wrote:
Thanks for these answers !

Destiny, I had *no* idea that there were so many lowsec systems (800 Shocked), even if that makes a thin layer. I just spent a long time trying to decipher the map again : this tool is powerful but I guess I suspect it was designed with the occular implants technology in mind, because, man, it's difficult to read ! Still, I found two alternate routes already, so I guess I won't get short on low-sec systems any time soon.

The fact that no one knows for sure about the respawn system is kinda cool actually : at least, something that we can't put in charts , maybe we're real explorers and not just a bunch of greedy anomalies farmers after all Blink

Elena, I'm glad to learn that it's not tied to DT, it's better that way : I really thought exploring had to be done after DT.

Max, I didn't know that : from a newbie perspective, lowsec is as ancient as the EVE Gate Big smile I really need to do some reading about the game's history and even the lore. EVE is just so big, one doesn't know where to start sometimes.

Well in all honesty I used the Stetson-Harrison method for determining the exact count of lowsec systems, I wouldn't bet any money on it being 800. There are some exact old statistics, but space has been added to the game since, so they're certainly inaccurate now. More likely it's about 700 lowsec systems at this point, but you'd need someone to do database query to get the exact current count.

As for the map, I'd recommend a 3rd party map like DOTLAN. They're not so pretty, but for actual navigation they're far superior to the ingame map.
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2013-07-20 11:59:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Elena Thiesant
From the Retribution static data dump.

Count of systems where security >= 0.5 : 1090
Count of systems where security > 0 and < 0.5 : 817
Count of non WH systems where security <= 0 : 3524

I don't know how the game rounds the sec level off at the boundaries, so I haven't done any rounding.
Terek Brinalle
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2013-07-21 21:18:03 UTC
Just a thought, but I was listening to one experienced veteran who was saying that - for certain activities - null sec can actually be safer than low sec. In low sec, for instance, everyone can often be playing carefully and very-much on their guard.

But a null sec system - especially one deep in null sec (and not on the border systems) can be populated largely by renter corporations full of "carebears". Just because it's null sec doesn't mean the people living there are more dangerous. Usually small renter alliances full of people who just want to PvE or mine will rent space from Nulli Secunda, or Goonswarm, or Test, or whatever aggressive PvP alliance controls the area. They just pay a rental fee for the privilege of carebear-ing in peace in very valuable asteroid belts and pirate lairs.

I've even heard some PvP junkies say you get better fights in null sec because the corps that live in deep null sec tend to be complacent and careless, and often will try and fight you in ridiculous and often ineffective small fleet compositions. Whereas everyone in low sec is too paranoid to act like that.

You can judge for yourself whether the existence of carebear renter alliances in deep null sec makes it easier or harder for you to do your exploring thing.