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Is there a point? (wh mining is now just throwing away isk)

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Moirae Nemesis
Kill All Ships In Style
#41 - 2013-07-17 15:09:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Moirae Nemesis
i have mined.
ok ok i was really really drunk, and it was a really really long time ago.

the problem with wormhole space mining is that it is, in every way, a little worse than mining in null sec.

the composition of the belts also do not support building anything.
take the building component away and what is remaining is mining abc ore for isk.
and here is where it starts getting funny.

you need a rorqual to compress the ore to really make it proper profitable, but that you already have in null sec.

what should change is, a wormhole only, ore refinery posmodule that would be vastly better than the current one.
other than that, its business as usual. scouts on all wormholes, keep an eye out for new sigs. same as in null.

i feel that if we remove the hauling to highsec and change composition of belts so that they have added veldspar, mining in wormholes would be more interesting and common.

so OT. no, there is no point.
Kira Hhallas
Very Drunken Eve Flying Instructors
Brotherhood Of Silent Space
#42 - 2013-07-17 15:14:21 UTC
A question what is bothering me.
Does the K162 side appears at the Moment you scan it to 100% or does it appears in the Moment warp to the static WH.
What i know is , that if the sigs is scanned to 100% the WH will open the K162 and the timer beguns to run....

Can some confirm it ?

Kira Hhallas - Austrian EvE Community - ingame =Österreich= - StoryPage - https://oneshotstorys.wordpress.com/ -

Cuiusvis hominis est errare, nullius nisi insipientis in errore perseverare
Bjurn Akely
WiNGSPAN Delivery Services
WiNGSPAN Delivery Network
#43 - 2013-07-17 15:16:40 UTC
James Arget wrote:
While I do love constant squabbling.. I'll try to add a gudpost to this.

When the grav sigs to ore anoms changes were made, I pointedly asked for an accompanying change to keep the risk:reward of wspace mining roughly the same. It was not an area CCP was willing to get involved in, as it would potentially affect a very large number of other players.

Unfortunately, wspace mining is quite literally a fraction of a fraction of the vast sum of playstyles, and as such I doubt there will be targeted changes made. However, I am committed to making sure that changes to the game are inclusive to our little niche.

Fly Safe.


You write a bit convoluted here so I'm having trouble understanding what you really mean. What does "not an area CCP was willing to get involved in" mean? CCP don't want to get involved in their game? They could hire me then and I can do that. Smile

Also: I just want to inform you that even though I do not mine but rather hunt miners I liked the old way much much more. There is nothing even closely related to skill to kill miners now. With the old mechanic I at least had to scan them down in one scan and MAYBE I'd get them. Challenge-less is useless. And very boring.

I know several people that are of the same opinion. So please James, work with getting W-space harder. Start with sigs popping up as soon as they appear, please. It's really a game-breaker.
Mr Floydy
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#44 - 2013-07-17 16:27:22 UTC
Was going to +1 every comment that disagreed with the OP. But can't be bothered.

Pay attention, don't sit one warp in at zero, gtfo when someone uncloaks next to you. It's not rocket science is it?
If it's a stealth bomber pointing you, it'll take around 3.5seconds or so to lock a venture (about the same as venture align time - but ofcourse, you'll be aligned), and then it has to apply a scram to lock you there.

If it is any other cloaky managing to point you. Well you deserve to die.
Tisisan
Hard Knocks Inc.
Hard Knocks Citizens
#45 - 2013-07-17 16:30:43 UTC
Kira Hhallas wrote:
A question what is bothering me.
Does the K162 side appears at the Moment you scan it to 100% or does it appears in the Moment warp to the static WH.
What i know is , that if the sigs is scanned to 100% the WH will open the K162 and the timer beguns to run....

Can some confirm it ?



The second. You can scan it down and leave it and the other side will not show up till someone warps to your side later.
James Arget
Future Corps
Sleeper Social Club
#46 - 2013-07-17 17:08:45 UTC
Bjurn Akely wrote:
James Arget wrote:
While I do love constant squabbling.. I'll try to add a gudpost to this.

When the grav sigs to ore anoms changes were made, I pointedly asked for an accompanying change to keep the risk:reward of wspace mining roughly the same. It was not an area CCP was willing to get involved in, as it would potentially affect a very large number of other players.

Unfortunately, wspace mining is quite literally a fraction of a fraction of the vast sum of playstyles, and as such I doubt there will be targeted changes made. However, I am committed to making sure that changes to the game are inclusive to our little niche.

Fly Safe.


You write a bit convoluted here so I'm having trouble understanding what you really mean. What does "not an area CCP was willing to get involved in" mean? CCP don't want to get involved in their game? They could hire me then and I can do that. Smile

Also: I just want to inform you that even though I do not mine but rather hunt miners I liked the old way much much more. There is nothing even closely related to skill to kill miners now. With the old mechanic I at least had to scan them down in one scan and MAYBE I'd get them. Challenge-less is useless. And very boring.

I know several people that are of the same opinion. So please James, work with getting W-space harder. Start with sigs popping up as soon as they appear, please. It's really a game-breaker.
I suggested a specific change to keep the risk:reward balance as it was, but CCP judged that it had too much potential spillover to be something they could change.

I shouldn't write stuff at 4am.

CSM 8 Representative

http://csm8.org
Bjurn Akely
WiNGSPAN Delivery Services
WiNGSPAN Delivery Network
#47 - 2013-07-17 18:52:33 UTC
James Arget wrote:

I suggested a specific change to keep the risk:reward balance as it was, but CCP judged that it had too much potential spillover to be something they could change.



They should think again IMO. Now W-space feels pretty much like Null. Boring and easy to avoid fights if you want to. Site farming is very easy with little risk of being ganked. My wallet tells me so. I'd rather have a leaner wallet and more spectacular loss mails.
Oxandrolone
Unlimited Liabilities LLC
#48 - 2013-07-17 21:25:10 UTC
If you are dieing in a venture you are a ******* idiot or afk

It has +2 warp core strength
It aligns and warps in <5 seconds
Its cap stable with AB on
Goes over 2k with MWD
Costs about 20million
Srensis
Jaded Gamers
#49 - 2013-07-17 22:17:29 UTC
go back to hisec
Jess Tanner
Bangworks Systems Inc.
#50 - 2013-07-18 00:26:19 UTC
Nathan Jameson
Grumpy Bastards
#51 - 2013-07-18 03:30:40 UTC
Of course there is a point.

It starts wonderful threads like this one.

http://www.wormholes.info
Evangelina Nolen
Sama Guild
#52 - 2013-07-18 04:00:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Evangelina Nolen
I've mined in WH space while AFK after odyssey. Tech 1 barges pay for themselves in less than 2 hours, still haven't been ganked. If you want to maximize profits by using tech 2 barges; you have to secure the wh at all times.

Edit: Ventures don't cost 20m. What are u smoking?
Kira Hhallas
Very Drunken Eve Flying Instructors
Brotherhood Of Silent Space
#53 - 2013-07-18 06:18:55 UTC
Tisisan wrote:
Kira Hhallas wrote:
A question what is bothering me.
Does the K162 side appears at the Moment you scan it to 100% or does it appears in the Moment warp to the static WH.
What i know is , that if the sigs is scanned to 100% the WH will open the K162 and the timer beguns to run....

Can some confirm it ?


The second. You can scan it down and leave it and the other side will not show up till someone warps to your side later.


Strange, in the last month we had some "Bugs"
New Wormholes are appear on the same place then the old one.
Funny thing was, if you jumped to the old BM and you dont scanned the new one to 100%, we also found a WH... but you cant jump through and the timer never begun to run....
In the moment a other player scanned the WH to 100%, the timer started and i was possible to use.

We had this "Bug" in the last month 2 -3 times.

Thats why I ask.

Kira Hhallas - Austrian EvE Community - ingame =Österreich= - StoryPage - https://oneshotstorys.wordpress.com/ -

Cuiusvis hominis est errare, nullius nisi insipientis in errore perseverare
Xen Solarus
Furious Destruction and Salvage
#54 - 2013-07-18 07:31:43 UTC
I agree these changes are very bad for the wh-miner, and clearly in the favour of the hunter. Even when you close your current exits, don't form the new ones and be vigilant on looking for new entrances forming as well as spamming the crap out of that D-scan, there is absolutely nothing that can be done to protect yourself against someone that is already in system. You see enough nullsec players moaning about AFK-cloakers, in wh-space you don't even know they're there to moan about. And once you finally think you're safe, BAM! You're locked, scrammed, jammed and slammed. Shocked

For that reason, i don't agree with hunters that moan that the system is now unfair against them. Sure, when you scan down that hole and enter you can expect everyone to immediately scatter in the presence of that new entrance, but after that it's free season! All you have to do then is wait patiently (or logoff till later), and soon enough those fools will start feeling all safe again, ready for you to ****-their-face.

Persoanlly, i think wh-mining is now dangerous in the extreme! Only something that should be attempted in a cheap venture, fully accepting that death is a good possibility.

Post with your main, like a BOSS!

And no, i don't live in highsec.  As if that would make your opinion any less wrong.  
Kira Hhallas
Very Drunken Eve Flying Instructors
Brotherhood Of Silent Space
#55 - 2013-07-18 08:02:50 UTC
Ehmm.... it is W-Space ? W-Space should be in this way ? And yes we are prey and hunter together.
But we never said the system ist unfair to the hunters.

So if you move into a WH system, you accpeted the danger that you can lose all,
what you bring in or built in this wormhole System.
And by the way.. it not so heasy to lose a Large Tower becasue in w-space... nobody will jump with 20 dreads out of the nothing and shoot your tower into RF....

So the danger is calculable.

Kira Hhallas - Austrian EvE Community - ingame =Österreich= - StoryPage - https://oneshotstorys.wordpress.com/ -

Cuiusvis hominis est errare, nullius nisi insipientis in errore perseverare
Nix Anteris
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#56 - 2013-07-18 18:21:28 UTC
I read as far as the first line

Ronce wrote:
... single pilot ... wh ...


Welcome to the most hostile environment to live in. You want to do it solo, you need the stones to go with it. That is all.
Sorany
xHELLonEARTHx
Simple Farmers
#57 - 2013-07-18 19:14:29 UTC
if we get a local chat can we also get supers?

Roll
Lucas Ericsson
Legio III Italica
#58 - 2013-07-18 19:22:36 UTC
I didn't mind scanning down the miners the old fashioned way. Easier to catch them? Yep.

However, now that there is the new scanner system they also know when I have just rolled into their system.

We're even I think ;)
Proclus Diadochu
Mar Sarrim
Red Coat Conspiracy
#59 - 2013-07-18 19:33:35 UTC
I wish to formally complain about mining in wormholes...


...because it is seriously important to this community. /s

Minister of High Society | Twitter: @autoritare

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My Blog: http://diogenes-club.blogspot.com/

The Diogenes Club | Join W-Space | Down The Pipe
Godfrey Silvarna
Arctic Light Inc.
Arctic Light
#60 - 2013-07-18 21:32:51 UTC
Join a corp.