EVE General Discussion

Nope, you are just consistently wrong.

I'm an old player, prefer pvp, still prefer high/lowsec to nullsec.

I don't like 0.0 because it's boring. People tend to make some point about how 0.0 pvp is for the skilled and the brave and...

Nonsense, it's for the patient. My experience with nullsec roaming can be summarized as follows.

"Ok, tengu/drake/raven on scan.... -scanscanscan- belt 7-1... aaaaand it's safespotted and cloaked. Ok, warp next gate. Tengu on scan, checking belts, aaand.. it's at a POS. Ok, next system, raven on sc- cloaked. Huh."

Alternatively, join an alliance, and you get the #OccupyWallSt form of pvp, where your job is to sit in a system for a week or so while waiting on timers, during which there will be two or three actual fights going on.

I stick out of 0.0 because highsec is a target rich environment, and it's easier to blend into the crowds rather than lighting up local like a christmas tree because there are exactly two people in system.

What would it take to get me into nullsec? There are two different paths.

One is to remove local, or to put it on a delay. What this does is allows a short time to scan down a target to make an attack. As it stands, if they're watching local, and click warp when you jump in, it's literally impossible to catch them. Warping an inty straight to their belt won't even be fast enough to catch a battleship that was paying attention.

Another is to make nullsec a little safer to encourage PVP. It sounds counter-productive, I know, but think of it like hunting: if you let everyone hunt as much as they want, with whatever weapons they want, all the prey die off. In nullsec, they leave; if you keep dying you'll just go back to highsec.

So, give them a chance, and maybe they'll actually come out, eh?

Essentially, what I want is a vibrant environment full of many different corporations and factions. You don't get that in nullsec. You get monolithic alliances which hold an entire region, share intel, and shoot on sight if anyone comes in; if you bring a fleet, they can bring a blob.

In highsec, you might have ten, twenty corporations in one system. Different factions, different politics. Sometimes they mind their own business, sometimes they fight. It's easier for a small corporation to prosper here.

So, what I want is a series of small factions, one-two systems, big empires maybe a constellation wide... dozens of corps packed into the same space sometimes, with shifting politics, in-fighting, out-fighting, skirmishes, and general good times to be had by all.

It's not going to happen though. Instead you get alliances forming blocks of 10 alliances and controlling the vast majority of 0.0. A big, monolithic, faceless entity that you can either join or try and gank.

Further, the mentality of EVE wouldn't allow for this kind of play even if the blobs were broken up. There would be no moment where you see a neutral and choose not to engage. Either you're at advantage and attack, or at disadvantage and get attacked. EVE players will never pass up an opportunity for a kill (myself included), and as such, any nullsec system harboring different factions will just be a killing field until one faction, or alliance of several factions NAPtraining, has driven every other faction out.

So, to make a long post short (tl;dr): I'd rather be in nullsec than highsec, but nullsec is a dead zone. Highsec is where all the life of EVE is, the abundance of corps, the abundance of targets.

I'm not interested in selling my soul to a big alliance; been there, done that, didn't enjoy it. Blob pvp doesn't do anything for me. I'm not interested in renting space, I'm not a carebear, why would I want nullsec rats? I'm not interested in pirating the alliances in nullsec, because it's way too easy to see a gank coming and escape. Roam all night and hope one person makes a mistake.

What I want is a place where small corps can thrive and sometimes fight. Lots of corps, lots of variety, lots of life. Given the nature of EVE, I don't think nullsec can ever be that place, as it simply encourages people to team up with as many as they can, and drive out all others, until they're the only faction left. Nature of the game.

Perhaps lowsec could be that place with some updates, or perhaps npc 0.0 could get an overhaul to make it a little more appealing, but player-sov 0.0 is dead to me, outside of say, the way CVA used to run: NRDS, lots of groups, lots of targets, not that I was welcome as a ... it was still my favorite section of 0.0 because it actually felt alive.

The rewards are richer for resource gathering outside high sec. For a good number of players, mining is a path for them to develop. Removing that from high sec would destroy options.

Null sec needs basic asteroids and maybe the high end ones need to have small quantities of the other minerals "impurities."

They also need a way to protect their miners. Maybe some sort of structure that protects them? Gives them time for help to respond?

I would like to see high standing with the pirate NPCs meaning that they protect you as one of them or as an asset.

Dead space generators and keyed gates? Destroyable gates, of course. which would take the generator offline.

... a whole load of mining barges going on sale. Then the high sec miners would swop over to other high sec activities, such as missions and PI.

You are talking about a mentality of play here. There are those that will always chose the safest and or casual options. It does not matter what you do with high sec or null sec, they will never move to null sec.

"So make it safer"
"Less blob and I'll come."

Null sec is NOT highsec. Those 20 or so corporations in one system don't have to talk to each other and basically ignore each other is because they don't need to interact at all. In null, it is a MUST.

Highsec = NO POLITICS
Nullsec = MUCH POLITICS

its important to understand that "One does not simply walk into nullsec" (lol LOTR ref that works) You talk to people who can get you in. I am tired of seeing pubbies complain about how hard it is when they completly ignore the political side of Null. That was makes Null fun for me. Actual politics that matter on a day to day basis. If you just play in highsec, you don't know where everyone stands in a given system because they are all neutral.

In Null you NEED to know who EVERYONE IS and what they are capable of. Because that one time you let one guy slide in and out without looking is that one guy who logged off in your system to be brought on again later to hot drop your carrier with super carriers.

Null is what it is because of poltics between large alliances. It is possible to go in, but you have to establish communication with someone before you go in.

Maybe a tutorial on large corp/alliance interaction video on how to forge alliances and permission to go into null would be in order.

Null is hard because politics is an often ignored aspect of it.

Null is fine the way it is. If anything it needs to be BUFFED so it is INDEPENDENT of highsec besides LOW GRADE industry. All T2 manufacturing and faction drops should only happen in Null. Ice should only be in Null, ABC ores should only be in Null and WH space.

The reason those large alliance are so powerful is because YOU LET THEM GET THAT BIG. Stop complaining and get in contact with some of your buddies and join a nullsec corp/alliance. You dont like the DRF, Test, Goons, Raiden? Don't join them. Simple as that.

[quote=Metal Icarus]"So make it safer"

Null is fine the way it is. If anything it needs to be BUFFED so it is INDEPENDENT of highsec besides LOW GRADE industry. All T2 manufacturing and faction drops should only happen in Null. Ice should only be in Null, ABC ores should only be in Null and WH space.

quote]
thats the fastest way to kill eve
Null sec alliances have no interest in industry beyond moongoo and abc ores
Like so many people already stated in this thread it is the politics and the sometimes so arrogant PVP only mentallity or the join us or keep out policy, that keeps people away from null sec
You can buff nul sec and nerf high sec to death if you want it will not do a thing, only result is that alot of people will simply walk away from this game

I still hope for one game-changing thing:
A module or any ability for any ship to warp from one system to the next "Star Trek style".

Gates are killing nullsec because gates represent a mechanic for gank/blob as the only recourse. The bubble reigns because of gates, and so we have camps and blobs.

Warp-to-system means the Combat Probe will reign, and patrolling will replace blobbing, scouting will replace camping. For the politics and implications of gaining or holding SOV, I don't know, but for PVP and "having a chance to get in" I am sure a good time would be had by all.

Why don't I reside in Null-sec (anymore)?

A couple simple reasons:
1. The people. Null sec is either feast (a few good systems, during the right time frame, or during a fleet fight) or famine (anywhere else, 99% of the time - if you do see someone, it's likely a botter or someone AFKing in a POS/SS/cloaked, or both). There's a myth about "ooo, dangerous" - in my first week of the trial, I put a pod on autopilot on a long course through 0.0. And I found no one. Not even a camp on the pipe in or out. Things these days have improved, especially in terms of camps on the pipes, but once in the deep, you are usually the only shark in the waters. Further, the people that do exist out there are either elitist PvP'ers demanding incredible dedication (more to follow), renters that barely inhabit systems, or lone wolfs looking for a kill. The atmosphere in 0.0 is deadly to any form of industry beyond moon mining and supercap construction (maybe PI), and the attitudes of many alliance leaders is just as toxic towards non-PvP activities. Thus, you find incredible boredom, snide condescension, or immediate demands to join fleet and go go go. Solo living is difficult; you have to be with the people or you'll find yourself eventually bored to death unless you get mobbed - in which you take the clone express.
2) Territorial demands, rights, and responsibilities. I have a full time job. It pays me enough to keep my Eve account current, and even for a time to have a second account, even though I'm not playing much until (hopefully) the winter expansion gives me nerd chills. I don't want another one. Being part of a Sov-holding entity in 0.0 demands a high level of activity (even if it's just bouncing through 30 systems refueling POS towers or making 20 jumpfreighter / carrier runs to Empire and back), and then of course there's CTAs, alarm clock ops, and things you MUST do if you don't want to find out you've been flagged red and just lost all your possessions in a station you won't be able to dock into again. (Never happened to me, fortunately - although almost lost stuff during outpost ping-pongs.) The infrastructure is severely lacking - lose a ship and you might as well go all the way back to Empire to replace it (odds are you won't find the ship, or modules, you need in your region - and if you do, they might not be someplace you can pick them up). This adds more time required just running logistics and trying to get ready to try and live out there. Tack on to this that if you are a member of a populous alliance, odds are you cannot make decent money running rats in belts or anomalies to afford the amount of metal you are about to consign to the fires of interstellar combat at the behest of your charming, vaguely accented lord and master. If you don't live, breathe, and sleep Eve, along with your 150-2000 friends, 0.0 just isn't worth the time. I can do anything I need to do gamewise faster, cheaper, and with considerably more fun in Empire and the fringes of null sec. Which is important, as I don't want to be chained to my computer desk in case the Goons decide to rush in. 0.0 induces burnout - much like a job - which is one of the reasons I think 0.0 is relatively stable right now... the big rush of wars just kindof wears you down, y'know?