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Politics and Feuds in Running Incursions.

Author
Sam Ruger
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2013-07-13 21:59:39 UTC
Could someone either explain to me the exact nature of the hostility between the 2 main fleets of Shield Tanked incursion groups. I know one got the word shiny in their name and I cant remember the others name. Does this same animosity exist in the armor tanked fleets?
Donbe Scurred
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2013-07-13 22:02:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Donbe Scurred
Exact Nature: Competition+Greed=Animosity/Hostility
Jim Era
#3 - 2013-07-13 22:05:54 UTC
Why can't we be friends?

Wat™

Sam Ruger
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2013-07-13 22:10:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Sam Ruger
It was more that it just seems that I hear chatter about the shield side then the armor. I like the concept of them disliking each other, chaos is always more interesting then order.
Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2013-07-13 22:23:00 UTC
Donbe Scurred wrote:
Exact Nature: Competition+Greed=Animosity/Hostility


Welcome to the PvE world and all the dramas that come with it...especially the loot dramas and pimping.

_"In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." _ ~George Orwell

Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#6 - 2013-07-13 22:23:55 UTC
INB4AAW

/rescinded

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.

Sam Ruger
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2013-07-13 22:37:13 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
INB4AAW

/rescinded




Okay what the hell does INB4AAW mean. I will admit to not knowing crap about this game. I just joined it to fly space ship and blow crap up.
Falin Whalen
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2013-07-13 22:38:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Falin Whalen
Why can't we be friends?

"it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka 

Scatim Helicon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-07-13 22:42:24 UTC
Highsec + autism.

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.

Tasha Saisima
Doomheim
#10 - 2013-07-13 22:48:33 UTC
Sam Ruger wrote:
Could someone either explain to me the exact nature of the hostility between the 2 main fleets of Shield Tanked incursion groups. I know one got the word shiny in their name and I cant remember the others name. Does this same animosity exist in the armor tanked fleets?


isn, wtm and tvp like to engage in friendly contests. DIN can't win contests so instead of improving, they kill moms in a temper tantrum

thats basically it
Sam Ruger
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2013-07-13 23:11:08 UTC
Tasha Saisima wrote:
Sam Ruger wrote:
Could someone either explain to me the exact nature of the hostility between the 2 main fleets of Shield Tanked incursion groups. I know one got the word shiny in their name and I cant remember the others name. Does this same animosity exist in the armor tanked fleets?


isn, wtm and tvp like to engage in friendly contests. DIN can't win contests so instead of improving, they kill moms in a temper tantrum

thats basically it

Thank you
Emma Yobibit
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2013-07-14 04:15:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Emma Yobibit
Falin Whalen wrote:


YOU MADE ME US BING!Evil

NNNNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOoooooooooooooooo!!Cry
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#13 - 2013-07-14 04:25:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Sam Ruger wrote:
Doc Fury wrote:
INB4AAW

/rescinded




Okay what the hell does INB4AAW mean. I will admit to not knowing crap about this game. I just joined it to fly space ship and blow crap up.


INB4AAW is In Before Ace About WoW, Ace's posts are so predictable they're becoming a meme, although for once the WoW reference is missing.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Malcolm Shinhwa
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2013-07-14 04:35:03 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Sam Ruger wrote:
Doc Fury wrote:
INB4AAW

/rescinded




Okay what the hell does INB4AAW mean. I will admit to not knowing crap about this game. I just joined it to fly space ship and blow crap up.


INB4AAW is In Before Ace About WoW, Ace's posts are so predictable they're becoming a meme, although for once the WoW reference is missing.


Wait for it....

[i]"The purpose of fighting is to win. There is no possible victory in defense. The sword is more important than the shield and skill is more important than either. The final weapon is the brain. All else is supplemental[/i]."

baltec1
Bat Country
The Initiative.
#15 - 2013-07-14 05:14:49 UTC
Greed.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#16 - 2013-07-14 06:52:07 UTC
Idiocy

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#17 - 2013-07-14 07:12:41 UTC
Are the incursioners getting elitist again?


It was fun taking out those motherships so they couldn't farm the incursion for a week.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Archibald Thistlewaite III
The Royal Society for the Prevention of Miners
#18 - 2013-07-14 07:16:46 UTC
Ace Uoweme wrote:
Donbe Scurred wrote:
Exact Nature: Competition+Greed=Animosity/Hostility


Welcome to the PvE world and all the dramas that come with it...especially the loot dramas and pimping.



Welcome to the PvP part of running Incursions, where all the drama and content is created.

User of 'Bumblefck's Luscious & Luminous Mustachio Wax'

Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
#19 - 2013-07-14 07:35:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Mina Sebiestar
There are 3 types (worth mentioning) of sites in incursions

HQ ze best everybody and their grandma want to run those most isk and lp

AS not to go deep here for about same amount of time you will be payed less than HQ and serving half pilots

VG steady and boring sites lowest lp isk is good

Incursion mechanic allow and support contesting by design that means that who ever is fittest/capable/experienced of contesting fleets will take away all isk/lp reward and loosing party will get nothing.

Further more loosing fleet will waste time while win fleet will improve ISK/h ratio.

There are few things that can be done in this situation i will mention few.

Contest again improve be better win contests.

Go to another incursion or downgrade to as/vg

cry foul demand that your kitchen sink fleet be left alone to farm when ever because you as farming carebear are entitled to

Or start killing mother ship(closing inc) every time your fleet is reminded this is eve and hand holding will get you nowhere.

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard

Joan Greywind
The Lazy Crabs
#20 - 2013-07-14 07:40:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Joan Greywind
There are a couple of main groups that run HQ with shield ships:

Disclaimer: I am a little biased towards 1 of these groups, but I will try to be as objective as possible (lies already :P)

ISN or Incursion Shiny network: They currently have the highest standards for ship fittings, and are generally the best at doing incrusions (winning most contests and fastest sites with minimal losses). Although they do have higher standards than other communities they aren't elitist, and will accept any pilot with the right fittings and skills and teach them how to do incursions.

Policy: Contest whenever they can (more iskies and fun) and never kill the last mom in highsec.

TVP: They have the largest numbers of pilots, due mainly to their low fitting standards. They are a good starting ground if you are just starting incursion and dont have the skills, iskies to fly a more expensive ship. They fly shiny ships but it mostly gets watered down by the other less than optimal ships they fly with. All in all a healthy community, albeit bloated leadership and sometimes loss in the sense of direction. They also suffer from false "propaganda' in their channels.

Policy: Depends on the FC currently running really, so can range from contesting a fleet they have a chance of beating, to outright killing the mom when they lose one.

DIN Flotten: A german multiboxer community, where a fleet of 40 ships is usually piloted with less than 20 people. They usually fly shiny, but most of the members multibox so they are now regarded as the worst Incursion community (efficiency wise) losing almost all of their contests. Some pilots having 10 pilots in a fleet of 40 ships at any one time. They fit the "angry german" stereotype, at least at the the leader ship level. Sadly they have the worst form of false "propaganda" relying on outright (albeit hilarious) lies to save face, and that is made that much easier with the language barrier (mostly German speaking community).

Policy: Multiboxers get in fleet before real pilot on the queue, and kill every mom in highsec if we get contested even once.

Extra Quotes by DIN Flotten: "ISN made them do the mom", "this is our incrusion", "It's ok that I lost my 5b mach, I have 78 others"

WTM: it's a relatively new incursion community that to my limited knowledge is an offshoot of either TVP or DIN, (or both). Efficiency wise they aren't that bad and run relatively shiny fleets.

Policies: Unknown to me

There are other notable incursion communities, armor (they mostly keep to themselves and don't run as much the shield fleet (less efficient especially in hqs). You also have some form of a Russian community that sporadically shows up, but they also keep mostly to themselves.

Now in Incursions you can contest sites, where a fleet is a winner and the other the loser, one gets the iskies and the other gets none. Now since ISN is the best, they win most to all of their contests. ISN are aggressive with their contesting as the "good sites" (best isk efficiency) gets done by all fleets as they spawn. Now the other communities hold the belief that sites shouldn't be contested, and call it "unfair" and "there is enough for everyone". Of course ISN likes contesting and sees no reason it shouldn't do it (more iskies, more fun). Now that might sound elitist, but ISN pays for it by being better organized and having better ships and skills. After all it asks its members for higher investments than the other communities, why should the members invest so much if they see no return? The other communities respond to that by killing the mom sites which kills the incursion, and noone can do sites anymore (no more iskies). Now this of course hurts all incursion communities and is really the "nuclear option". Of course it hurts the incursion communities invoking the nuclear option as they are usually the "poorer" communities and need the iskies the most. This of course is not sustainable and soon, will have accept the fact, that either they need to step up their game (better ships) or do the cheaper sites. Don't get me wrong ISN does get damaged from the moms popping, but they get hurt the least, as they have the richest base and are generally more tightly knitted and organized. It is now really a battle of wills, who can hold out longer.

So there it is, your drama, and I know it is a long post. Whoever said you cant have spais and drama in highsec, well here you go. And for people that are going to call this carebear acting tough, remember an average fleet of 40 pilots can make 4b an hour in incursions, that is (conservatively) 20b a day and 600b a month for each community. The big war in null sec is being fought for 200b/month worth of moons, by tens of thousands of players.
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