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Ab or MWD for frigate brawling ?

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Starbuck05
Abiding Ormolus
#1 - 2013-07-11 18:12:26 UTC
Greetings ,


So i've been pondering about this for a long time now and i can't seem to find an answer and because of this i tend to use double prop on all my fits thus having a lack of a web and as far as it goes from my experience u almost always need a web and if u don't really " need " it , it doesn't hurt to have it .

But by fitting dual prop u almost never have an extra slot for a web . So my question is should i stick with just AB or just Mwd ? or keep it with both ..


I shield tank btw , and also i find it hard to think mwd is better for brawling because if enemy target ship has ab scram and u have mwd and scram he'l obviously be faster thus getting out of my range . Also if i have ab on and a kitey shows up i'm ****** ..



Any help or feedback will be greatly apreciated ! thank you .

Just because i am blond does not make me stoopid !
Mr Morita
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#2 - 2013-07-11 19:04:39 UTC
Starbuck05 wrote:
Greetings ,


So i've been pondering about this for a long time now and i can't seem to find an answer and because of this i tend to use double prop on all my fits thus having a lack of a web and as far as it goes from my experience u almost always need a web and if u don't really " need " it , it doesn't hurt to have it .

But by fitting dual prop u almost never have an extra slot for a web . So my question is should i stick with just AB or just Mwd ? or keep it with both ..


I shield tank btw , and also i find it hard to think mwd is better for brawling because if enemy target ship has ab scram and u have mwd and scram he'l obviously be faster thus getting out of my range . Also if i have ab on and a kitey shows up i'm ****** ..



Any help or feedback will be greatly apreciated ! thank you .

I use AB's for brawly frigs; and instead of a web I typically use a TD.
Brainbashi
Make-EVE-Great-Again
NO NEED LOOSE FACE
#3 - 2013-07-11 19:39:48 UTC
I loved AB fitted hookbill.

Rockets, web and scram was enought to melt down most blaster / AC fitted frigs. You just have to be at the edge of your scram range.
But then again, ones you face a kiting ship your only bet is to hope that your tank last longer than his cap...
Taoist Dragon
Okata Syndicate
#4 - 2013-07-13 03:10:23 UTC
Generally I fit AB in my brawling ships but you have to pick your engagement. In a plex at the warp in beacon for example and any AB frig will die if caught by a kitey.....

In FW plex's etc mwd gives a bit more flexability in manouvering seeing as you can't on-grid warp in the plex's.

But the reasons for using one over the other are so many you could probably write a few papers on it and still be dicussing the merits of each till your dieing day. Just go fit up a few and see how you go. Lol

That is the Way, the Tao.

Balance is everything.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#5 - 2013-07-13 12:43:33 UTC
Ab is always better once the brawl starts.

That said

Low sec : AB
0.0: MWD

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Liam Inkuras
Furnace
Thermodynamics
#6 - 2013-07-13 15:35:16 UTC
I like to fit my lowsec brawling frigates with afterburners, due to the fact that I am oftentimes warping into an enemy who is most likely sitting at 0. The AB will give me better range control and fight dictation than the MWD ever could, as it cannot be activated when scrammed and is essentially just a cap penalizing module at that point. Now MWDs do have their merits in lowsec brawling scenarios, such as rushing a scram range kiter and getting onto him before he can pull range. They are also great for catching kiters, but then it isn't brawling, just chasing kittens.

But as Garviel said, in general:

AB = Lowsec

MWD = nullsec

Except on AFs. Always fit MWDs to those.

I wear my goggles at night.

Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone
Syrias Bizniz
some random local shitlords
#7 - 2013-07-13 16:49:12 UTC
Dualprop Hookbill is pretty nice, so is Firetail. On shields. Firetail starts becoming significantly better dualpropper when armor tanked though.

Generally, the web is helpfull but not necessary when you have the ability to hit out to scramrange - Rocket ships, Laser ships, Autocannon-Ships. In case he starts pulling into a close orbit you can't break away from, still try getting transversal low by manual piloting for your guns to hit him. If he sees he can't take you down his tank is nearly overwhelmed already, in which case you hit approach on him, overheat scram and AB and finish him off since his traversal is now 0.

That being said, if you want to dualprop... go for armor tanked ships. Firetail is pretty awesome in that setup.
Ciyrine
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8 - 2013-07-15 18:26:02 UTC
Why do armor tanked ships dual prop better?
Ciyrine
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-07-15 18:27:10 UTC
Liam Inkuras wrote:
I like to fit my lowsec brawling frigates with afterburners, due to the fact that I am oftentimes warping into an enemy who is most likely sitting at 0. The AB will give me better range control and fight dictation than the MWD ever could, as it cannot be activated when scrammed and is essentially just a cap penalizing module at that point. Now MWDs do have their merits in lowsec brawling scenarios, such as rushing a scram range kiter and getting onto him before he can pull range. They are also great for catching kiters, but then it isn't brawling, just chasing kittens.

But as Garviel said, in general:

AB = Lowsec

MWD = nullsec

Except on AFs. Always fit MWDs to those.


Why ab low and mwd null?
Deacon Abox
Black Eagle5
#10 - 2013-07-15 20:56:56 UTC
Ciyrine,

Armor ships dual prop better because they may have more available mids. A shield tanker gives up a tanking slot for every prop mod and tackle mod he fits. On the flip side armor tankers have fewer base med slots.

If you have an armor frig with 3 med slots it could be ab/scram/web or ab/mwd/scram or etc. Thus leaving all the lows for tank and damage mods. Of course a 2 med slot frig is just ******. And on the flip side a 5 medium slot frig is potentially op.

As for lowesec - ab, nullsec - mwd, it all has to do with warp disruption bubbles. The need for speed is much greater in nullsec. If you land in a bubble you often need to get out of it quickly unless you have the tank to tank what is waiting for you to be caught in that bubble. It really sucks to have your ship go boom inside a bubble and afterward have your pod then sitting utterly helpless in that same bubble.

CCP, there are off buttons for ship explosions, missile effects, turret effects, etc. "Immersion" does not seem to be harmed by those. So, [u]please[/u] give us a persisting off button for the jump gate and autoscan visuals.

Taoist Dragon
Okata Syndicate
#11 - 2013-07-15 21:05:29 UTC
AB/MWD/web all has to do with your desired combat engagement envelope.

Most ppl recomend mwd for null because of the bubbles etc and generally I agree but if you are well versed in null survival you can use an AB pretty effectively.

I find that AB in low is perfectly fine for general piracy, killing miner/ratters/explorers etc, but in FW plex's where you cannot warp on grid the manouverability of the mwd is great.

Then you have ships like the Hookbill and Firetail that can field buth tank and dual prop to awesome flexibility. In the end you need to find out your prefered combat style and keep at it.

AB brawling is a lot of fun and I generally prefer it, especially for 1v1's, but for 1v1 survival mwd/kiteing is generally better. Small gangs also tend to perform better with a kitey aspect to them in FW.

That is the Way, the Tao.

Balance is everything.
Plato Forko
123 Fake Street
#12 - 2013-07-15 21:50:49 UTC
AB only for brawlers. Brawling is all about being able to either out-tank or out-gank your opponent. You can't do either well if you've gone and wasted one mid slot and a third of your PG fitting a mod that gets rendered useless the moment you engage.
Taoist Dragon
Okata Syndicate
#13 - 2013-07-15 22:38:26 UTC
Plato Forko wrote:
AB only for brawlers. Brawling is all about being able to either out-tank or out-gank your opponent. You can't do either well if you've gone and wasted one mid slot and a third of your PG fitting a mod that gets rendered useless the moment you engage.


Like Garv said above AB is always better once the brawl starts.....

However AB severly limits you ability to force a fight. If you are caught by a kitey then there is next to no chance of catching them unless they make a horrible mistake and you'll just die (all be it slowly) if you can't call in the cavalry to chase/catch him.

Having an AB means you have to pick your fights smarter to engage either
a) other brawlers looking for a fight,
b) catch people unawares who don't want to fight or
c) fish for kiters hoping to catch them on the warp in or hope they don't manually pilot and you can OH you AB and potentially snag them on the approach.

All down to personal preference. Mine has been moving towards mwd recently for some reason vOv

That is the Way, the Tao.

Balance is everything.
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Of Essence
#14 - 2013-07-15 23:04:06 UTC
Fly a hookbill - fit both, and ewar to boot.
Starbuck05
Abiding Ormolus
#15 - 2013-07-16 06:48:47 UTC

The reason i asked is that recently .. not so recently , more and more people fly kitey stuff so i need to fit mwd to be sure i can pop them damn kiters BUT , the moment a rare specimen of brawly comes i am dooomed , more or less .



I also prefer dual prop and since i shield tank i find the hawk to be good at it , with miner issues sometimes beeing the lack of a web since all AF are slower then regular frigates .


I like to go find me a plex and sit in it ( hate the hunting part cause everytime people run away so i gave up on that ) and w8 , if someones shows up and i know i have a slim chance i fight , if 2 or 3 shows up i run away ( no sence in loosing a ship for nothing ) if no one shows up well np atleast i'm making money

Just because i am blond does not make me stoopid !
God's Apples
Wilderness
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
#16 - 2013-07-16 20:49:32 UTC
chatgris wrote:
Fly a hookbill - fit both, and ewar to boot.


Or just fit MWD and dual webs so you can dictate range (assuming you don't entirely fail the approach) against AB single web frigs.

"Hydra Reloaded are just jealous / butthurt on me / us because we can get tons of PVP action in empire while they aren't good enough to get that." - NightmareX