These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Ships & Modules

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Strangeness in dps increases between T1 and T2 damage rigs on Vargur

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Private Pineapple
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2013-07-10 12:55:47 UTC
Hey all,

So I was working with a Vargur fit yesterday and I noticed a strangeness... if I put on 3x RF Gyro, 1x T2 Gyro to support 4x 800mm's and then add a T1 Large proj burst aero rig it adds ~10 dps. T2 Large proj burst adds ~60 dps. T1 is 10% increased RoF while T2 is 15%. Can someone explain this?

My take on it is that on a "per second" level, the extra 5% RoF is enough to get more volleys in whatever model pyfa is using (like, pyfa might use it on a # of dmg done in 10 seconds kind of basis instead of dynamic # of seconds depending on turret cycle times). I do not use EVEFIT, I use Pyfa.

.
Zor'katar
Matari Recreation
#2 - 2013-07-10 13:03:29 UTC
Private Pineapple wrote:
Hey all,

So I was working with a Vargur fit yesterday and I noticed a strangeness... if I put on 3x RF Gyro, 1x T2 Gyro to support 4x 800mm's and then add a T1 Large proj burst aero rig it adds ~10 dps. T2 Large proj burst adds ~60 dps. T1 is 10% increased RoF while T2 is 15%. Can someone explain this?

My take on it is that on a "per second" level, the extra 5% RoF is enough to get more volleys in whatever model pyfa is using (like, pyfa might use it on a # of dmg done in 10 seconds kind of basis instead of dynamic # of seconds depending on turret cycle times). I do not use EVEFIT, I use Pyfa.

I'm guessing it has to do with the order of stacking. The T1 rig is going to be at the bottom of the stack (less than the 10.5% of the Gyros), and thus penalized into oblivion. The T2 rig will be at the top, thus not being penalized at all (and instead pushing the bigger penalties onto the smaller bonuses of the Gyros).
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#3 - 2013-07-10 13:09:51 UTC
Private Pineapple wrote:
Hey all,

So I was working with a Vargur fit yesterday and I noticed a strangeness... if I put on 3x RF Gyro, 1x T2 Gyro to support 4x 800mm's and then add a T1 Large proj burst aero rig it adds ~10 dps. T2 Large proj burst adds ~60 dps. T1 is 10% increased RoF while T2 is 15%. Can someone explain this?

My take on it is that on a "per second" level, the extra 5% RoF is enough to get more volleys in whatever model pyfa is using (like, pyfa might use it on a # of dmg done in 10 seconds kind of basis instead of dynamic # of seconds depending on turret cycle times). I do not use EVEFIT, I use Pyfa.


As indicated, it's to do with stacking penalties. The RoF rig is reducing the RoF bonus from your 4th Gyro to effectively nothing

Eg If the RoF that 4th Gyro is giving you 50 DPS, the T1 rig is giving you 60 DPS and the T2 Rig is giving you 110 DPS then

60-50 = +10 net gain

110-50 = +60 net gain

(numbers totally made up for purposes of illustration. No doubt some helpful OCD'er will supply accurate ones to make the point)

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Whitehound
#4 - 2013-07-10 13:10:42 UTC
Private Pineapple wrote:
Hey all,

So I was working with a Vargur fit yesterday and I noticed a strangeness... if I put on 3x RF Gyro, 1x T2 Gyro to support 4x 800mm's and then add a T1 Large proj burst aero rig it adds ~10 dps. T2 Large proj burst adds ~60 dps. T1 is 10% increased RoF while T2 is 15%. Can someone explain this?

My take on it is that on a "per second" level, the extra 5% RoF is enough to get more volleys in whatever model pyfa is using (like, pyfa might use it on a # of dmg done in 10 seconds kind of basis instead of dynamic # of seconds depending on turret cycle times). I do not use EVEFIT, I use Pyfa.

The explanation is easy: you do not really have a problem. T2 is better than T1.

Or tell us why this should be a problem?!

Loss is meaningful. Therefore is the loss of meaning likewise meaningful. It is the source of all trolling.
stoicfaux
#5 - 2013-07-10 13:21:43 UTC
Zor'katar wrote:
Private Pineapple wrote:
Hey all,

So I was working with a Vargur fit yesterday and I noticed a strangeness... if I put on 3x RF Gyro, 1x T2 Gyro to support 4x 800mm's and then add a T1 Large proj burst aero rig it adds ~10 dps. T2 Large proj burst adds ~60 dps. T1 is 10% increased RoF while T2 is 15%. Can someone explain this?

My take on it is that on a "per second" level, the extra 5% RoF is enough to get more volleys in whatever model pyfa is using (like, pyfa might use it on a # of dmg done in 10 seconds kind of basis instead of dynamic # of seconds depending on turret cycle times). I do not use EVEFIT, I use Pyfa.

I'm guessing it has to do with the order of stacking. The T1 rig is going to be at the bottom of the stack (less than the 10.5% of the Gyros), and thus penalized into oblivion. The T2 rig will be at the top, thus not being penalized at all (and instead pushing the bigger penalties onto the smaller bonuses of the Gyros).

This. ^^

http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Stacking_penalties or http://www.eve-wiki.net/index.php?title=Stacking_penalty

Generally speaking, the T1 damage/rof rigs aren't worth using when you have 3+ damage mods.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Muad 'dib
State War Academy
Caldari State
#6 - 2013-07-10 13:27:35 UTC
Highest value modifier for a stacked module attribute doesnt stack.

the T2 rigs work so well because 15% is far higher than the next highest being 10.5%, normally the 10.5% would come before the 10% of a t1 rig which is why the gap is so big.

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.
Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#7 - 2013-07-10 13:54:25 UTC
Stacking takes highest first

Thus t2 dps rigs are always awesome even if you have 4 damage mods.



TL:DR:

ITS STACKING MAGIC

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Private Pineapple
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2013-07-10 13:58:39 UTC
Thanks for the replies everyone, no further replies are necessary. Let this thread die Cool

.