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Evangelina Nolen
Sama Guild
#1 - 2013-07-06 08:34:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Evangelina Nolen
Two ideas for WH connections mechanics. Hopefully, every1 has seen that TCU's in wh space create warpable points. I propose that WH to WH connections do the same. When a static such as X877 collapses; the new one will spawn and simultenously spawn a K162 on the other side w/o requiring some1 to land on grid first/initiate warp. K-space to WH connactions must still be scanned down & use current mechanics.

Now, for the first proposal:
All WH to WH connections that are less than 15 minutes old do not show up on the overview like a TCU & will not appear on the discovery scanner. The sig will still appear on the visual overlay.
After 15 minutes, they now will appear on the both the discovery scanner and as a warp-able point.
Static rolling must either be scanned down via probes or wait 15 minutes.

OR

Second Proposal
No warpable TCU like celestial & WH to WH signatures do not show up on the discovery list at all. Probes must be used to discover new wormholes, both static and roaming.

AND

Addendum concerning highsec wormholes such as B274.
Players with the 5 minute cooldown{forgot the name} can be agressed by other players whom also have the same cooldown from the exact same womrhole. Even in highsec.
Evangelina Nolen
Sama Guild
#2 - 2013-07-06 08:40:38 UTC
Yes, carebears every where are having panic attacks.
Evangelina Nolen
Sama Guild
#3 - 2013-07-06 09:11:03 UTC
Black Hole New Effects:
Shield & Armor Repair: +25% +44% +55% +68% +85% +100%

I would love to be able to get speed tanking marauders ENGAGED!!!
AtomYcX
Perkone
Caldari State
#4 - 2013-07-06 09:13:42 UTC
Are you high?
Nix Anteris
The Dark Space Initiative
Scary Wormhole People
#5 - 2013-07-06 09:25:26 UTC
Evangelina Nolen wrote:
When a static such as X877 collapses; the new one will spawn and simultenously spawn a K162 on the other side w/o requiring some1 to land on grid first/initiate warp.

This was discussed recently

Evangelina Nolen wrote:
they now will appear on the both the discovery scanner and as a warp-able point.

Do not want.

If a wormhole is there, it's there. Why would it suddenly become warpable after X minutes. Remove them from the discovery scanner completely, keep the requirement that they have to be probed down.

It makes it too easy to just race down a chain thats older than 15 minutes with this mechanic. Collapse static, new static has wormholes warpable already, some guys in space notice you and want to escape through a wormhole, but you already have your fleet there because you didn't have to scan.

Evangelina Nolen wrote:
WH to WH signatures do not show up on the discovery list at all. Probes must be used to discover new wormholes, both static and roaming.

Much better.

But why restrict it to WH->WH sigs. All WH sigs whether they lead to another wormhole or a k-space should be removed.

Evangelina Nolen wrote:
Players with the 5 minute cooldown{forgot the name} can be agressed by other players whom also have the same cooldown from the exact same womrhole. Even in highsec.

Again, no thanks.

It's -1 space, there are no police, why would your actions in such space matter in empire space?
Nix Anteris
The Dark Space Initiative
Scary Wormhole People
#6 - 2013-07-06 09:40:32 UTC
Evangelina Nolen wrote:
Black Hole New Effects:
Shield & Armor Repair: +25% +44% +55% +68% +85% +100%

I would love to be able to get speed tanking marauders ENGAGED!!!


I think we can do better than that. It looks like its just a cataclysmic variable in disguise.

Keep in mind that Black Holes have a flavour related to their effect. You have a higher velocity and it's harder to turn because you're being assisted by some extra gravity. Your weapon systems are less accurate for the same reason.

I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing that there is a type of effect that makes a system undesirable, but most other systems have benefits that act as a trade off to their negative aspects, and for a black hole it does feel like everything is negative.

If I was going to make a change, I'd probably keep the flavour, but make it a little less severe. Keep the values the same at C1 level, but reduce them to 50-75% of their current effect at C6 level.
Winthorp
#7 - 2013-07-06 11:07:35 UTC
OP you drunk, go home.


P.S have i been out of WH's for too long, whats with all these ******** threads. You need to gank these fools more.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#8 - 2013-07-06 11:23:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Jack Miton
Wow...you post a LOT of garbage on these forums Evangelina but you've really out done yourself this time.
WHs you don't need to scan down? yeah, eve has those. theyre called stargates and they have no place in whs.

Nix covered your crap pretty well.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

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Ellariona
B52 Bombers
#9 - 2013-07-06 12:01:33 UTC
Black holes are fine the way they are. I haven't tried any, but some doctrines look really cool on paper.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2013-07-06 12:15:41 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Wow...you post a LOT of garbage on these forums Evangelina but you've really out done yourself this time.
WHs you don't need to scan down? yeah, eve has those. theyre called stargates and they have no place in whs.

Nix covered your crap pretty well.



Shh, you are gonna scare her back to her NPC alt.
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#11 - 2013-07-06 12:22:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Rroff
PS due to the way wormhole gameplay has developed a wh spawning its k162 side instantly isn't actually the PVP driver people who've not spent much time in w-space think it is.

It gives whoever is in the destination system at the minimum around an extra 30 seconds heads up, potentially several minutes extra to deal with a new sig to them before anyone can get tackle on them and if your wanting to bear with those mechanics in mind then instead of collapsing your static you'd critical it down to less than a single battleships mass and be fairly safe (atleast as far as someone jumping you from your static goes).
Nix Anteris
The Dark Space Initiative
Scary Wormhole People
#12 - 2013-07-06 12:28:41 UTC
Rroff wrote:
It gives whoever is in the destination system at the minimum around an extra 30 seconds heads up, potentially several minutes extra to deal with a new sig to them before anyone can get tackle on them and if your wanting to bear with those mechanics in mind then instead of collapsing your static you'd critical it down to less than a single battleships mass and be fairly safe (atleast as far as someone jumping you from your static goes).


It's actually more to do with people trying to be safe by collapsing their static then not warping to the new one, so they can run sites. Instantly spawning the K162 helps to prevent such blatant carebearing.
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2013-07-06 12:57:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Mr Kidd
Yep...more and more suggestions to make w-space like k-space.......which is exactly why most of us are here.....it's not k-space.

Look, what your suggesting only serves one purpose....to deny people bearing it up their bear. That's why you are there....not mechanics. Last I checked, if you're looking for pew, you might just find pew. If you're opening your statics, then the k162 is created. Why are you suggesting that this should be an automatic mechanic? To scare the bears? Many of them don't even pay attention to dscan or discovery scanner......me thinks someone is just too lazy to drop probes.

Don't ban me, bro!
Kalel Nimrott
Caldari Provisions
#14 - 2013-07-06 13:03:38 UTC
If I take the effort and risk to roll, it should be rewarded. Not penalized. The basic concept is not thatit shouldnt be safe, is that you learn how to make it safe and work for it.

Bob Artis, you will be missed.

O7
Proclus Diadochu
Mar Sarrim
Red Coat Conspiracy
#15 - 2013-07-06 15:08:05 UTC
No.

^ Constructive Feedback. This is also not a "threadnaught". < Also constructive.

More constructive feedback. > Stop posting in Wormholes.

Minister of High Society | Twitter: @autoritare

E-mail: diogenes.proc@gmail.com

My Blog: http://diogenes-club.blogspot.com/

The Diogenes Club | Join W-Space | Down The Pipe
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#16 - 2013-07-06 15:36:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Rroff
Nix Anteris wrote:

It's actually more to do with people trying to be safe by collapsing their static then not warping to the new one, so they can run sites. Instantly spawning the K162 helps to prevent such blatant carebearing.


If CCP made that change tho people wouldn't collapse their static to bear but instead mass it down to critical (some people do this anyway) so that only a very small number of ships can jump in at best - they are almost as safe as it is now when its collapsed.

If the k162 side spawns as soon as the other side it has the knock on effect of actually slightly nerfing PVP rather than increasing - if your rolling your static trying to catch someone in the middle of running a site they will see the new sig soon after your previous static was collapsed and before your scout has even cycled probes to start warping to the new static - giving them crucial extra time to evacuate their ships from site - currently by the time they've seen the k162 appear on their side your scout/fleet will be landing on your side of the static ready to jump in.


EVIL EDIT: If you want to make bearing more risky in high end WHs then make it so that escalating the sites causes a wh to spawn on the site that leads to a random C5/6 that the sleeper guardians appear to come from when they spawn :D
Svodola Darkfury
Cloak and Daggers
The Initiative.
#17 - 2013-07-07 01:37:23 UTC
Ellariona wrote:
Black holes are fine the way they are. I haven't tried any, but some doctrines look really cool on paper.



No they're not. They nerf EVERY weapon systems range. Nobody has time for that. That's why every black hole system C3 and up is empty or inhabited by new guys who just wanted to get into SOMETHING.

Svo.

Director of Frozen Corpse Industries.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#18 - 2013-07-07 02:26:13 UTC
Ellariona wrote:
Black holes are fine the way they are. I haven't tried any, but some doctrines look really cool on paper.

take this from someone who lived in a C6 black hle for a year: NOTHING about black holes is 'fine'. on paper or otherwise.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Nix Anteris
The Dark Space Initiative
Scary Wormhole People
#19 - 2013-07-07 10:18:54 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
take this from someone who lived in a C6 black hle for a year: NOTHING about black holes is 'fine'. on paper or otherwise.

I was there.

What I think _is_ fine, is that there are certain systems that are undesirable to operate in. Why should every system give you some sort of bonus? It seems perfectly logical to me that there should be _some_ systems that are absolutely horrible in every way.

If they're the last systems unoccupied and someone is desperate to live in a wormhole, they deal with the bottom of the barrel, or they FIGHT their way up.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#20 - 2013-07-07 10:33:38 UTC
Guess that's fair enough.
would be nice if SOME fits worked well in black holes.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
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