Ships & Modules

Just wondering what the best is to train first to do the best in either pve or pvp. I will most likely train both eventually but would like to pick one to focus on training for now.

The proper way to fit a Navy Harb

[NEW Harbinger Navy Issue, New Setup 1]
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Damage Control II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Large Shield Extender II
Warp Disruptor II
Large Shield Extender II
Stasis Webifier II

Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I

Medium Energy Locus Coordinator II
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Medium Energy Metastasis Adjuster I


Warrior II x5

638 DPS 31+7 with scorch. 780 DPS 10+7 With multi. 860 DPS 10+7 with Conflag

And the proper way to fit a harb:

[Harbinger, New Setup 1]
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
Warp Disruptor II

Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I

Medium Energy Locus Coordinator II
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I


Warrior II x5
585 DPS 31+7 with scorch, 713 DPS 10+7 Multi, 786 10+7 Conflag

Fixed it.

Pulses with Scorch get much better damage and application than beams in the same general fit in almost any situation, really only surpassed when you get out to much longer ranges. But you typically won't be at those ranges, even in PvE.

Also, Pulses drain a lot less cap per second, so you'll last a little longer before your cap runs dry.

Here is a fitting with Beam Lasers only to have shown you one.

Note that lasers are not as powerful as hybrid weapons and should not be fitted with raw DPS in mind, like one would fit a Gallente ship. It is pretty hard to out-damage a Gallente ship. Instead do you focus on their strength as being heavy armor tankers and build on it.

[Harbinger, Beam+AB PvP]

Damage Control II
Medium Ancillary Armor Repairer, Nanite Repair Paste
Reactive Armor Hardener
Heat Sink II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II

10MN Afterburner II
Medium Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 400
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Warp Disruptor II

Heavy Beam Laser II, Aurora M
Heavy Beam Laser II, Aurora M
Heavy Beam Laser II, Aurora M
Heavy Beam Laser II, Aurora M
Heavy Beam Laser II, Aurora M
Heavy Beam Laser II, Aurora M
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I

Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Processor Overclocking Unit I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I

Hobgoblin II x5
Infiltrator EV-600 x5

Range is key and you use this ship when you know that you can define the initial engagement range. Do not worry about tracking too much. Anything faster than you will either use an MWD and have a huge signature, making it easy to hit them, or they will not be significantly faster than you and can be tracked. You then switch to Gleam M while webbing and neuting your target. You also have 5 light drones and 5 medium neut drones to deal with the small, faster stuff.

It deals 500 DPS with Gleam M / Multifreq. M or can hit as far as 65km with Aurora M. However, your armor tank has got on average 70% resistances, 41.3k eHP and the AAR will rep with 235 eHP/s (304 eHP/s overheat) and the reactive armor hardener will work in your favour the longer the engagement lasts. So your tank will shave off quite a good deal from the incoming DPS.

And cap issues can be dealt with the cap booster.

A similar fitting with Pulse Lasers:

[Harbinger, Pulse+MWD PvP]

Damage Control II
Medium Ancillary Armor Repairer, Nanite Repair Paste
Reactive Armor Hardener
Heat Sink II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II

Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Medium Capacitor Booster II, Navy Cap Booster 400
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I

Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Conflagration M
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I

Medium Processor Overclocking Unit I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I

Hobgoblin II x5
Infiltrator EV-600 x5

Here it is 612 DPS with Conflagration M and a repair rate of 266 eHP/s (344 eHP/s with overheat) with the same eHP as above.

Getting emotional does not make a good argument.

You already wrote that you do not care for effectiveness, but style is your thing.

Fit all your ships as if these were Minmatar and put ketchup on everything you eat like kids do! Why should one care?!

You do not have any?! It would explain why you come across like Sponge Bob.

How about you post something on the subject and with a bit of substance, maybe a fitting or two of your own.

Mother of god, did somebody unironically post an AB Beam pvp fit harbinger, good god.

You can do some pretty good things with the Harb, I prefer shield fit myself but yeah, armour fits are good too;

Heres an armour fit;

[Harbinger, Lolbinger]
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Internal Force Field Array I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
1600mm Reinforced Steel Plates II

Warp Disruptor II
X5 Prototype Engine Enervator
Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Navy Cap Booster 800

Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I

Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I


Valkyrie II x5
Warrior II x5

Heres a shield fit;

[Harbinger, Nano Harb]
Nanofiber Internal Structure II
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Internal Force Field Array I

Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
Warp Disruptor II

Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I

Medium Energy Locus Coordinator II
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I


Both are good, the shield fit obviously heavily abuses scorch.

You said that I posted a load of tosh... Perhaps do not feel too free yourself when it comes to personal attacks!

Before you say again that Amarr being armor bricks is only a style do know that you are wrong. It is not a style, but the consequence of a natural selection, of lasers being weaker than hybrids and Amarr having the best armor hulls.

Nobody said you cannot fit your ships anyway you like. The new variety may actually allow for a lot more mediocre fittings that are capable of winning a fight, and a relatively lesser amount of fail fittings and superior fittings.

Take Chessur's Harbinger fitting for instance. It is not a terrible fitting, but I would not want to fly it. The two TEs and two nanos allow one to stay at range, but the DPS at this range will not be much higher, because of how the damage converges over the distance down to 2%. It diminishes and with it diminishes the gain.

When you do the math and check what difference the additional range from two TEs makes then you may be surprised. For example take two ships with 10km optimal and 10km falloff, one without TEs and the other with two. The one with two TEs has got an optimal of 11.9km and a 13.7km falloff (after stacking penalty). In a 1v1 fight would the difference show after 10km range, obviously, but only when both ships are 25km(!) away from each other does the difference grow to a maximum of ~30% at which point one ship will do ~30% of its DPS and the other will do about ~60%. After 25km does the difference diminish just like the DPS of both ships. (edit: used a better approximation)

The tracking bonuses of two TEs also make a difference, but only at close range, and a web will be much more efficient at close range.

Tracking enhancers really begin to shine when you have short optimals and long falloffs. And Pulse Lasers with Scorch M just have too little falloff to be worth the two low-slots.

The fit then has got almost a quarter less eHP compared to mine, and with 0%(!) EM resistance on shields. If it gets hit with lasers or hybrids will the shields drop like a rock and no range advantage is going to make a difference. The extra speed will allow one to flee the scene, but it will most likely not outrun a true Minmatar build (that is a Minmatar ship build for kiting).

And please do not take offence when I call a fitting mediocre. I have tons of those and I always look for people who might post one, which shines brighter than the others.

I do not know why you are telling me this. I did not comment on your beam laser fitting. It seemed just fine.

The rest - just plain nonsense. I posted it. You called it a load of tosh. End of story.

And if you actually did the math would you be able to see for yourself and did not have to rely on my words. I cannot give you any better advise than that.

TEs give a 10% bonus to the optimal and Pulse Lasers with Scorch already shoot out to point range with their optimal. A third heat sink for the second TE will give you more damage at close range (about 10% DPS more after the penalty) and about the same damage over the distance of the falloff. The second TE only gives you an extra +8% to your optimal.

Why would you want the extra range when you already shoot out to point range with only the optimal when you can have more DPS? You do agree that the range is silly!

Scorch out to 35 means you can apply DPS out of point range (because you dont have to always be pointing the target) it also allows you to apply damage on tackle quicker killing it or forcing it off and allows you to start applying damage to things faster than you quicker helping you win the DPS race.

Also, TEs help tracking which again helps against tackle.

(Also yes your beam fit was terrible and your pulse fit sub-optimal).