Ships & Modules

OK this might have been asked/discussed one million time. Just didn't find any of them so asking...

Why on earth is Gallante and Amarr industrial ships so silly skill bonuses??

Transport Ships Skill Bonus:
+5% armor repairer repair amount per level

or

Transport Ships Skill Bonus:
+5% armor repairer repair amount per level
+5% bonus to armor HP per level


I might not understand this game but somewhat it seems that all industrial ships use, if not all then most, lowslots on Expanded Cargoholds?

Ok but then minmatar and Caldari have both same to shields.. so they dont need to give up lowslots to have this important change to survival..


So bascily question changes little but I still dont understand anything at all.. in life, universe and/or in EVE-Online.

You can be clever all you want!! It does not change the fact that you are the one who is asking the questions (it does make you a bit of a troll though).

Regarding your concern... you have a better chance of survival with an armor tanker, because these can use the mid-slots for MWD, e-war (i.e. ECM Burst) and cap booster in addition to their armor tank. Shield tankers have the advantage of combining tank with more cargo space, but cargo expanders lower your speed and hull hitpoints and make you more vulnerable.

Remember these were designed a long time ago, and ways of using them were defined afterwards, once the players got their hands on them. For all industrials a tank is next to useless in my opinion. Increasing resists can help you survive long enough to burn back to gate (or tank rats if you're hauling). I can't imagine why I'd want to put a repper onto one.

I think CCP are re-doing industrials right now. Don't know if they're changing the bonuses.

Yea. What are you going to do with that? Occator's problem is even with MWD, if it's scrammed and webbed and bumped, it's not going to make it back to the gate. I have personal experience of this as I've been caught once before in one similar fit to the above and it popped really quickly. Now days I use warpy/cloaky Viator. Much less capacity, but I don't care if I have to do multiple trips.

It feels like most reason to do tank on industrial would be survivability so long that your buddies clear the sky or logistic start repping you.

For solo I have to little side with Sin and be dubious that even good tank can safe you if you are flying low sec. I started thinking that ofc nowadays when Jita is more dangerous than nullsec for industrial,there might be merit to tank industrials also so that cavalry has time to come and again clear the skies for you.

That fit has amazing tank btw. Need to try that sometime. Have flied battleship that had less tank than that

You should have a talk with a triple rep bait Iteron 5 with a single blaster and see what it can do, a piece of advice: stay away from it.

The tanking bonus can actually be somewhat useful for hauling in 0.0 mining op, having a hauler that just shrugs rat aggro is pretty convenient. Too bad it's at the expense of capacity.

Shields have a far greater advantage over armor when surviving gate camps imo. The best fit for an industrial to evade them is to fit a buffer shield tank (active tanks such as AARs have a real problem in that you cannot normally fire a rep off until the end of the cycle and so absorb the initial high alpha volley from many battle cruisers ) Use a cloak if you can but fit warp core stabs and nanofibers in the lows so you can possibly escape if tackled by only a couple of ships. If you need additional cargo space then fit cargo hold optimisation rigs.

Oh and i would never use ECM modules. If you ever need to burn back to a gate then using one will give you a one minute aggression timer and you will not be able to jump through. In high sec ECM bursts on a crowded gate are also likely to get you Concorded.

OP,

These ******** active tanking bonuses were put on these ships a few years ago when the then existing balancing dev or devs was stupidly only viewing the game through a racial design dogma lens. They failed to understand that ships have a function that interacts with the eve environment which can override any preconceived racial paradigms of the backstory. These ships want very specific things that don't lend themselves to some fixed notion that a particular race active armor tanks or some other such dren.

So for haulers, the lows and rig slots are there either for agility mods to get into warp faster or for cargo expanders. The vast majority of the time it is cargo expanders. Blockade Runners though do benefit from agility/speed mods in the lows or rigs, especially in nullsec with bubbles to navigate through.

The mids are then where you put a tank and prop mod. This tank should probably be resistance amps and maybe a shield expander. Shield expanders though increase your sig and make you get locked faster so be careful with them. Active shield hardeners require an extra click just as you may be freaking out and trying to navigate away from tackle. So my characters avoid them. Active shield is not a good strategy because it would require a sustained attack of lowish damage over time. Realistically if you are tackled you will die. The buffer/resist shield tank is there in the event of a shot or two while not being tackled. This for instance might happen on a regional gate if you got decloaked by a jet can or whatever and need a few seconds to get out of the edge of a bubble and warp out, before you get tackled or taken down by the incoming dps.

The highs are for a cloak of whatever variety will fit on the particular hauler, and maybe a probe launcher if you are in wormhole space.

Some people like to fit an ecm or damp as a last ditch effort to avoid/shake a tackle. Never seen this work myself. Usually, once one tackle lands on you there will be more in very short order. But you never know you could just have a solo pirate that opportunistically tackled you somewhere and the damp or ecm might wiggle you out.

Regardless, things are a little better with the latest rebalancing team. They still appear to lean toward low/mid slot distribution per racial predilections. But they also recognize function now. So once they get to DSTs I doubt we will still have the stupidity of a one mid slot Impel. It seems they also are aware that shorting the base cargo space on a hauler with more low slots can be overdone, and vice versa blessing the base cargo on a hauler with more mids. Especially if the balancing team retains any type of armor tanking theory for any of these ships. We will see.

The tech I haulers are undergoing a rebalance presently, and it will likely soon be off the test server and into the game. Here is a link to the relevant thread. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=252819&find=unread