These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

How do you guys feel about paid tools?
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Gordon Riddle
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-06-26 02:21:41 UTC
So, my day job involves math and number-crunching. As I've been playing Eve, it's not really surprising that I tend to apply the skills I have in real life to my play style.

As a result, I've found myself borrowing those skills from my real job to build a small army of calculators that are far more advanced than anything publicly available, although perhaps some serious players have something similar privately. I'm not talking about some formula you could drop into Excel, I'm talking about reports that run for hours or days, that run on hundreds of gigabytes of data. I'm not going to go into a lot of detail, since I'm not actually giving anybody access at the moment.

Well, it is one thing to grab a handful of spare computers to crunch numbers for my own amusement, and it is another thing entirely to open access to the broader Eve community. The latter would require real, significant, server infrastructure, that costs real money, on an ongoing basis.

So I have three options here:


  1. I can keep doing what I'm doing, using everything myself, and sleep soundly on my pile of ISK
  2. I can pay out of pocket for a tiny infrastructure that can host a tiny number of users, charge that handful a boatload of ISK, maybe we form a cartel
  3. I can offer access to the general public, but due to the large amount of hardware it would take, real money would need to change hands.


There doesn't seem to be a vibrant community of paid tools for Eve. There are a few: Neocom is freemium, Carebear Central is a paid app, etc. But the sense that I have gotten is that maybe nobody's really interested in paying for third-party software. Which might explain why the few players or corps who have serious data-crunching stuff keep it under wraps and don't talk about it.

What do you think?

Just to be clear: I am absolutely not talking about RMT for in-game assets, or botting, or anything like that. I'm just talking about calculators. Really, really, good calculators, like what stock analysts and business analysts use. Also, I'm not currently offering or accepting anything. Just want to hear people's thoughts.
Cap Tyrian
Guiding Hand Social Club
#2 - 2013-06-26 02:49:14 UTC
My Cristal ball tells me that you should go with 1

2: Not many willing to spend allot of ISK fore something not widely approved, probably obsolete and from a nameless source.

3. The standard eve player will likely have no need for that sort of data analysis.


My tip, if its your hobby, go on.

If you want isk, spend your time and skills playing eve.
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2013-06-26 02:57:09 UTC
1 here too. You sleep on your pile of isk and I'll sleep on mine.

Sugar Von MurdererTits : Jake Warbird gets my vote for most intriguing and attractive male character in Eve.
Togg Bott
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2013-06-26 03:05:49 UTC
Data for hours OR even Days.......

Blah Blah blah... seriously, if your gonna play the numbers game, get yourself 6-12 MONTHS of data. that being said, I have been with EvE for more than a few minutes... making ISK isn't hard.
Tumahub
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2013-06-26 03:12:05 UTC
I too, have a secret formula for making fabulous amounts of isk.

But I dare not describe it except to say that it is better than anything publicly available.

Send me some isk and I'll think about letting you in on the secret. I might even make you a beta tester if you send > 1bil. :))

-legit
Litair
Nleesh
#6 - 2013-06-26 03:17:37 UTC
There are some valid points here.. but it is a fact that people want easy money, so if you can provide that, then there'll most likely be people interested.
However you may want to offer a free trial or something like that to actually show off these things and convince people that it works. If it does work and people make a profit, I'm sure they'd be willing to pay you a share too in order to keep the money rolling in.

Personally I don't think I'd like to start throwing RL dollars around, but some ISK for a market tool or whatever that gives an advantage other than what you can already get for free on websites could be interesting, if it seems to be working.
stoicfaux
#7 - 2013-06-26 03:22:02 UTC
Gordon Riddle wrote:

Just to be clear: I am absolutely not talking about RMT for in-game assets, or botting, or anything like that. I'm just talking about calculators. Really, really, good calculators, like what stock analysts and business analysts use. Also, I'm not currently offering or accepting anything. Just want to hear people's thoughts.

If your data/analysis/process is that good, then sell it to the professional RMT folks. Otherwise go with 1.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Alex Grison
Grison Universal
#8 - 2013-06-26 05:05:06 UTC
Gordon Riddle wrote:
So, my day job involves math and number-crunching. As I've been playing Eve, it's not really surprising that I tend to apply the skills I have in real life to my play style.

As a result, I've found myself borrowing those skills from my real job to build a small army of calculators that are far more advanced than anything publicly available, although perhaps some serious players have something similar privately. I'm not talking about some formula you could drop into Excel, I'm talking about reports that run for hours or days, that run on hundreds of gigabytes of data. I'm not going to go into a lot of detail, since I'm not actually giving anybody access at the moment.

Well, it is one thing to grab a handful of spare computers to crunch numbers for my own amusement, and it is another thing entirely to open access to the broader Eve community. The latter would require real, significant, server infrastructure, that costs real money, on an ongoing basis.

So I have three options here:


  1. I can keep doing what I'm doing, using everything myself, and sleep soundly on my pile of ISK
  2. I can pay out of pocket for a tiny infrastructure that can host a tiny number of users, charge that handful a boatload of ISK, maybe we form a cartel
  3. I can offer access to the general public, but due to the large amount of hardware it would take, real money would need to change hands.


There doesn't seem to be a vibrant community of paid tools for Eve. There are a few: Neocom is freemium, Carebear Central is a paid app, etc. But the sense that I have gotten is that maybe nobody's really interested in paying for third-party software. Which might explain why the few players or corps who have serious data-crunching stuff keep it under wraps and don't talk about it.

What do you think?

Just to be clear: I am absolutely not talking about RMT for in-game assets, or botting, or anything like that. I'm just talking about calculators. Really, really, good calculators, like what stock analysts and business analysts use. Also, I'm not currently offering or accepting anything. Just want to hear people's thoughts.


Do you know where the hardware department is?

yes
Just Lilly
#9 - 2013-06-26 05:19:53 UTC
Sounds like you're "overdoing" it

How about playing the pew pew game and forget about the numbers eh?

Stick with option 1
Powered by Nvidia GTX 690
S Byerley
The Manhattan Engineer District
#10 - 2013-06-26 05:25:34 UTC  |  Edited by: S Byerley
The Eve economy is simple; if you're running through terrabytes of data you're over analyzing.
Adunh Slavy
#11 - 2013-06-26 06:03:30 UTC
Can these tools predict when CCP devs are going to change something?

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Mr BeanCounter
Inertial Operations
#12 - 2013-06-26 06:10:18 UTC
No tool is going to give you the leverage that playing the game at a high level will get you.

I have a small army of my own tools, like yours some have grown so advanced I've considered opening them to the public just to turn a bit of profit. But at the end of the day what I do to earn ISK makes even that seem like childs play, so why bother right.

Stick with what you're doing if you enjoy it, however don't forget there is a game here, and its while its fun to play in the meta, the content can quickly get lost if you start to slip into that routine, and let me tell you as a 10 year veteran, the content has never been more gorgeous.

Go enjoy the game IMO.
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#13 - 2013-06-26 06:11:00 UTC
0/10

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
Inxentas Ultramar
Ultramar Independent Contracting
#14 - 2013-06-26 15:11:56 UTC
Gordon Riddle wrote:
There doesn't seem to be a vibrant community of paid tools for Eve.


That's probably because there is no vibrant demand for paid tools for Eve. The sense you have gotten that probably nobody is interested in paying for 3rd party tools is probably spot on. I bet the list of browser bookmarks I have, already encompass the functionality that I would ever want or need. Apart from that I regularly check my wallet and skillqueue with Aura for Android, which is free. I'm not sure what data your app exposes, but I can't imagine something I would pay money for, $$$ or ISK.
Rob Crowley
State War Academy
#15 - 2013-06-26 15:30:55 UTC
Gordon Riddle wrote:
I'm talking about reports that run for hours or days, that run on hundreds of gigabytes of data.
So you're analyzing Eve videos on YouTube or how the heck do you come up with hundreds of gigabytes of Eve related data?

Quote:
What do you think?
I think I have the perfect answer for you which is far more advanced than all publicly available answers, but I'm not going to go into a lot of detail, since I'm not actually giving you access at the moment.
Jimmy Morane
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#16 - 2013-06-26 16:36:56 UTC
I do not pay tools to do anything for me because well...they are tools.
Ace Uoweme
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2013-06-26 16:57:41 UTC
I'm mixed about paid for tools, simply because playing WoW there's no need. Donation model is fine, though. Vuhdo is an example of such a addon that is donation friendly (and websites like Curse allow for direct donations supporting developers for their time -- Hello, CCP will we ever have such addons? You for this UI??? API should support it, right?).

The other factor is EvE websites appear to run on some really poor hardware (takes forever to load up Battleclinic for example, even with 100mb internet). Even GoDaddy's hosted websites aren't that slow. If someone is going to pay for a service, the site needs to load up faster than molasses. Sandbox game but not that sandbox feel deal.

_"In a world of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act." _ ~George Orwell