Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Disclaimer: Yes, this post is fueled by recently having an AXOWer in my corporation and being helpless to expel them and discovering GMs aren't permitted to assist in any way except point me here.

Solution: A new Crimewatch flag to keep war targets, war targets, even when no longer in a corporation at war. (read on)

AWOXing seems to be endorsed, supported, and protected by game code. Should corpmates be able to shoot each other? Yes. Should there be spies, intrigue, and politics in eve leading to sabotage? Yes. Should non-corp capsuleers be permitted to remote repair a player participating in a member vs. member engagement? That's a complex issue I don't like, but we're not getting into that.

However, instead of addressing the exact AWOX scenario with game code, lets address why CEOs and Directors aren't permitted to expel a member while in space. To my knowledge, I'm always looking for more information, the reason the owner of a corporation cannot expel a member while they are in space is simply due to past abuse. CEOs and Directors are subject to hellish headaches because of someone else's game abuse in the past.

Abusive situations:

• You're at war with another corp/alliance. You have a bait ship waiting. Opponents attack. You expel the member in the bait ship. Instantly the opponents are flagged and attacked (by CONCORD and/or empire guns) provided you're in high sec or low sec near empire guns.
• You're sparring with a corpmate in high sec, they begin to fire on you, as a CEO or Director, you could expel them and watch as CONCORD rips their ship apart.
• Other potential abuses by CEO/Director.

The number one reason I'm aware of is the first list item above. So, how can we address that so they can re-enable expelling members in space and addressing AWOXing?Simple, add a new limited war engagement flag to Crimewatch.

This flag should be at least 15 minutes, maybe even 60 minutes in the event a chase or capital ship is involved, and when applied it treats ANY member of a corp that is at war with another corp as "suspect" and always a valid target as long as the flag is active. The flag is only removed by time expiration like all other Crimewatch flags.

This has two obvious results. The first is it addresses member kicking abuse during war time, and doesn't affect other Crimewatch flags. The second is a side effect, if you happen to be engaging war targets during the last minutes of a war then you would be a valid target after the war is over but the flag would no longer be getting refreshed. Obviously, more code could fix this, but it seems like an acceptable side effect and even encouragement to fight the war down to the last second.

If the other abusive situations related to CEOs and Directors are a concern... I don't see why, a member can simply leave the corp if they feel abused, but if the developers wanted a solution for this, I believe that's just as easy. If you engage a corpmate, enable the limited engagement flag with that member. Sounds dumb, but isn't that what that flag is for? In that situation if the CEO/Director kicks said member, the limited engagement flag would protect them from CONCORD for a short duration. Yes, this would also positively affect AWOXers, giving them time to destroy a target, but in the least we wouldn't have to endure them staying in corp and the engagement is effectively limited.

Please discuss and upvote/like if you agree. I'm also looking for improvement, suggestions, and thoughts on possible unintended consequences.

--Amizo

There's little reason such archaic mechanics such as 'Wait until they logout, disconnect, and/or you log in faster than them after downtime' should still be around for removing someone from your corporation.

The only potential abuse left over if a limited engagement system were in place that I can think of at the moment would probably be along the lines of getting a POS tower to throw a 'former' corpmate out of the forcefield and commence firing on them.... I'm too lazy to check at the moment but I think you might be able to do that with 'current' corpmates anyways.

Some sort of clock time countdown timer on the kick + apply the limited engagement flag in a sensible way where an expelled pilot is in combat fixes all of the possible issues. Even if that doesn't cover it all, how it works now is just dead stupid and needs to be fixed. If it causes other issues, then address them rather than hiding them under the skirt of a plainly idiotic mechanic that causes more problems than it ever fixed.

The current flagging system would already be able to do this... the problem is that the abuse was kicking people out right before an engagement (and thus, before any "flags" could be generated).

Sorry OP... try again.

Very simple.

Currently the only way to kick an AWOXer who wants to stay in the corp is to login before he does after downtime. For a lot of us, this simply isn't possibly because of sleep and/or work. Queue it up and that ceases to be a problem.

If CCP ever removes downtime, then that might cause a bit of a hitch. But that is solvable.

I'd prefer something that works quicker such as actually just expelling them while they're in space, but yes, this would work and I could settle with that if they're not willing to do more.

I figured someone would say this eventually. The typical "helpful" eve player.

Do enlighten us. How can you stay newbie friendly without adding excessive risk to your current members?

No broken, doesn't require a 'fix'.

Be more careful when letting trash into your corp next time.

hope this helps m8
07

So, you have a player created problem, but you want a CCP created solution?

Yeah, PVP happened, sorry to tell ya (actually, I'm not), but the GMs are not, and should not help you out in that situation.

Next time get his API key before you let him in.

Also, moar tears plz.

This is true, but it's more 'destroy them in one massive burst of treachery' than 'lurk around and make sure you're around at 11 am every day'