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Ideas for Gallente/Amarr or Caldari/Minmatar pirate faction ships?
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Maximus Andendare
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#1 - 2013-05-16 19:08:40 UTC
These two faction combos don't have pirate ships to represent them, and I'm wondering what the community thinks would be good ideas for these combos. CCP typically tries to fill "roles" for ships, especially with tiericide, so we have "armor laser" and "shield laser" boats represented by Amarr and Sansha ships. "Armor drones" are Gallente and "shield drones" are Guristas. So I ask you: what combinations are missing that could be represented by new pirate factions for those racial combinations that are left out?

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Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#2 - 2013-05-16 19:15:20 UTC
Gallente/Amarr ships would be the blue-and-black, Amarr-hulled, hybrid-turreting ships flown by Equilibrium of Mankind.
ExAstra
Echoes of Silence
#3 - 2013-05-16 19:18:36 UTC
We don't have any Pirate faction "EW" boats aside from the Blood Raiders, so you could try a concept like that.

Gallente: 5% to Hybrid Damage/level (or maybe armor rep bonus?)
Amarr: 5% to Tracking Disruptor effect/level

I'm just pulling numbers out of thin air; it's just an example. I like the idea of Amarr/Gallente and Caldari/Matari, though.

Save the drones!
Xavier Thorm
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#4 - 2013-05-16 19:46:38 UTC
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
Gallente/Amarr ships would be the blue-and-black, Amarr-hulled, hybrid-turreting ships flown by Equilibrium of Mankind.


They use missiles too. Short range I believe. I would love to see these ships and this faction fleshed out in lore.

Caldari/Minmatar doesn't have any factions that it would fit in to based on lore that I'm aware of, but a group like Mordu's legion could evolve to incorporate something like that.
Iudicium Vastus
Doomheim
#5 - 2013-05-16 20:01:38 UTC
I would very much like to see these faction combos utilized as well.
I fly on armor doctrines, which means I cross-train Amarr+Gallente, but there are no pirate hulls that are available to me since I'd have to go time-sink into ships I have no interest in flying (Caldari/Minmatar) to gain access to some, and even then they'll be gimped since I won't be training the other race's required class of vessel to 5, or even 4, thereby I won't be using the hull's bonuses to their real potential.

I also know those who are all about shields and cross-trained cal/min share this disappointment in no available pirate hulls.

[u]Nerf stabs/cloaks in FW?[/u] No, just.. -Fit more points -Fit faction points -Bring a friend or two with points (an alt is fine too)
Xavier Thorm
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#6 - 2013-05-16 20:15:31 UTC
Iudicium Vastus wrote:
I would very much like to see these faction combos utilized as well.
I fly on armor doctrines, which means I cross-train Amarr+Gallente, but there are no pirate hulls that are available to me since I'd have to go time-sink into ships I have no interest in flying (Caldari/Minmatar) to gain access to some, and even then they'll be gimped since I won't be training the other race's required class of vessel to 5, or even 4, thereby I won't be using the hull's bonuses to their real potential.

I also know those who are all about shields and cross-trained cal/min share this disappointment in no available pirate hulls.


I know this isn't technically related, but it really would be worth it for you to train Minmatar spaceship command skills if you enjoy Amarr/Gallente skills that much. It's not much of a time sink (~2 months to get BS and everything below to V) and it opens up some really interesting ship choices from Blood Raiders and Serpentis without having to train a single new weapon or support skill.
Felsusguy
Panopticon Engineering
#7 - 2013-05-16 20:58:29 UTC
Guristas:
Tank - Shield
Weapons - Missiles and Drones

Blood Raiders:
Tank - Armor
Weapons - Laser Turrets, Stasis Webifiers and Energy Neutralizers

Angel Cartel:
Tank - Speed
Weapons - Projectile Turrets

Serpentis:
Tank - Armor
Weapons - Hybrid Turrets, Stasis Webifiers

Sansha's Nation:
Tank - Shield
Weapons - Laser Turrets

So far, only one pirate faction is hybrid-based, only one is drone-based, only one is missile-based and only one is projectile-based. Caldari/Minmatar could be both projectile and missile based, whereas Gallente/Amarr could be hybrid and drone based.

The Caldari put business before pleasure. The Gallente put business in pleasure.
Maximus Andendare
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#8 - 2013-06-11 20:19:59 UTC
Felsusguy wrote:
Guristas:
Tank - Shield
Weapons - Missiles and Drones

Blood Raiders:
Tank - Armor
Weapons - Laser Turrets, Stasis Webifiers and Energy Neutralizers

Angel Cartel:
Tank - Speed
Weapons - Projectile Turrets

Serpentis:
Tank - Armor
Weapons - Hybrid Turrets, Stasis Webifiers

Sansha's Nation:
Tank - Shield
Weapons - Laser Turrets

So far, only one pirate faction is hybrid-based, only one is drone-based, only one is missile-based and only one is projectile-based. Caldari/Minmatar could be both projectile and missile based, whereas Gallente/Amarr could be hybrid and drone based.
I could definitely see a +optimal focused, projectile boat that Caldari and Minmatar could share. I don't think that +optimal projectile is "covered" in the various roles that CCP has set up in the ship lines. Most of Minmatar/Angel are set up for +falloff (when they receive a bonus for that), but I'd have to wonder if there'd be demand for a +optimal to projectiles/shield ship. Would this step on the toes of the Rokh or Mael? Admittedly, a +(p) optimal and resist boat would be nice, but a bit overpowered and I'm not sure it'd fit well in the lineup. What about +(p) optimal and ROF? Maybe it goes for maximum damage?

For Gallente/Amarr, the issue there is they already have armor drone boats, and laser drone boats and hybrid drone boats. Amarr have much overlap with Gallente, which I why I'm sure CCP hasn't implemented a good pirate faction for that combo yet. I mean, both are Armor and have strong drone qualities. They each have strong(ish) cap. So what qualities do Amarr have that makes them unique and apart from Gallente? What do the Gallenteans offer unique from Amarr? Most obvious are their tanking styles, but I don't think an active tanked laser boat could last under that cap strain. Maybe an EOM resist (or +armor) hybrid line?

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Jayrendo Karr
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-06-11 20:34:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Jayrendo Karr
Gallente are already used in 3 pirate hulls, same with minmatarr, they should add EoM ships using Caldari and Amarr Skills. As it stands there are a lot more reasons to train Gallente and Minmatarr which each already grant bonuses to 3 pirate faction ships, while Caldari and Amarr only grant bonuses to 2 pirate faction ships.
Maximus Andendare
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#10 - 2013-06-11 20:38:49 UTC
Jayrendo Karr wrote:
Gallente are already used in 3 pirate hulls, same with minmatarr, they should add EoM ships using Caldari and Amarr Skills. As it stands there are a lot more reasons to train Gallente and Minmatarr which each already grant bonuses to 3 pirate faction ships, while Caldari and Amarr only grant bonuses to 2 pirate faction ships.
I'm sure as long as EOM makes it in there somewhere, people would be happy.

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LtauSTinpoWErs
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#11 - 2013-06-11 20:56:34 UTC
For Caldari/Minmatar, I would love to see some sort of shield tanked missile ship with a bonus to webs :)
sten mattson
Red Sky Morning
The Amarr Militia.
#12 - 2013-06-12 01:40:46 UTC  |  Edited by: sten mattson
i would love to see a lazor + armor rep amount boost ship as the amarr/gallente one as long as it has enough mids to support active armor tanking (at least 4)

IMMA FIRING MA LAZAR!!!
Xander Det89
T.R.I.A.D
Ushra'Khan
#13 - 2013-06-12 06:38:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Xander Det89
Maximus Andendare wrote:
I could definitely see a +optimal focused, projectile boat that Caldari and Minmatar could share. I don't think that +optimal projectile is "covered" in the various roles that CCP has set up in the ship lines. Most of Minmatar/Angel are set up for +falloff (when they receive a bonus for that), but I'd have to wonder if there'd be demand for a +optimal to projectiles/shield ship. Would this step on the toes of the Rokh or Mael? Admittedly, a +(p) optimal and resist boat would be nice, but a bit overpowered and I'm not sure it'd fit well in the lineup. What about +(p) optimal and ROF? Maybe it goes for maximum damage?


I know it's not what you're suggesting, but to me this would just lead to hybriding the Rokh and Mael into some horrific apex sniper boat, imagine a BS hull at special bonus 37.5% Optimal (50% would be waay too much for artillery given how much falloff they get you could easily snipe with short range ammo at 100k) , Cal BS 4% shield res per lvl, Min BS 5% Proj RoF per/lvl. Sure I'd love it all day long, but that's because it'll be the king of the med/long range hill.
PavlikX
Scan Stakan
HOLD MY PROBS
#14 - 2013-06-12 07:57:42 UTC
Obviously there EOM pirates to become amarr\galente pilots.
Proposed main characteristics:
Weapons hybrids on all ships anf drones with at least one ship (battleship probably)
Amarr hulls with armor tank or repair bonuses. Those EOM ships really beautiful.

And here we have huge problem - those rats must have their own territory in npc nulls and in other sec systems as belt and mission rats. They must have their own LP shop, there must be EOM's complexes and so on. Reduce drone regs, replace them with EOM's regs? Bring more solar systems and regions? Hardly it's posible before rebalance (there is module rebalance also) finished.
HiddenPorpoise
Jarlhettur's Drop
United Federation of Conifers
#15 - 2013-06-12 10:38:10 UTC
EoM would likely be meant for assault missiles or blasters depending on the ship but either way would fight like most Gallente ships do, land on the target and burn it down; add Amarr tanking to the mix and the result is fiery death that can't keep pace unless it's in warp. I want it.
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#16 - 2013-06-12 10:44:56 UTC
HiddenPorpoise wrote:
EoM would likely be meant for assault missiles or blasters depending on the ship but either way would fight like most Gallente ships do, land on the target and burn it down; add Amarr tanking to the mix and the result is fiery death that can't keep pace unless it's in warp. I want it.


Err... EoM aren't Gallente and they certainly don't fly like it. They're one of the very many schizophrenic sociopathic Amarrian-based weirdo-cults. They fly black-and-blue Amarr hulls with railguns, long-range missiles and active shield tanking. To be fair, they're more of an Amarr/Caldari cross but that's already taken so we work with what's left.
HiddenPorpoise
Jarlhettur's Drop
United Federation of Conifers
#17 - 2013-06-12 10:55:48 UTC  |  Edited by: HiddenPorpoise
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
HiddenPorpoise wrote:
EoM would likely be meant for assault missiles or blasters depending on the ship but either way would fight like most Gallente ships do, land on the target and burn it down; add Amarr tanking to the mix and the result is fiery death that can't keep pace unless it's in warp. I want it.


Err... EoM aren't Gallente and they certainly don't fly like it. They're one of the very many schizophrenic sociopathic Amarrian-based weirdo-cults. They fly black-and-blue Amarr hulls with railguns, long-range missiles and active shield tanking. To be fair, they're more of an Amarr/Caldari cross but that's already taken so we work with what's left.

I don't mean to say the psycho death cult is Gallente, I mean to say that their ships would fight like slower, tankier, harder hitting Gallente. Everytime I fight them I deal with a face full of HAMs, I thought that was their thing. They seem like a jumble of everything at this point which frees them to be messed with more.
Mole Guy
Bob's Bait and Tackle
#18 - 2013-06-12 14:30:38 UTC
gallente/amarr -

hybrid geddon.

special bonus-100% drone control range
gallente- 10% tracking and range per lev
amarr- 10% hp and damage per lev

uses hybrids
7 high, 5 mids, 8 lows, 4 turrets
125Mbit bandwidth
400 m3 drone bay

reason- they both are drone masters. gallente domi bonus for tracking and range, domi/amarr for damage. the drone range thing would be specific to the new faction.


i think it would be a fun ship for those who like armor and drones. i had to train up caldari and shields to use the rattlesnake...im an armor/drone guy.
Maximus Andendare
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#19 - 2013-06-12 14:55:18 UTC
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
HiddenPorpoise wrote:
EoM would likely be meant for assault missiles or blasters depending on the ship but either way would fight like most Gallente ships do, land on the target and burn it down; add Amarr tanking to the mix and the result is fiery death that can't keep pace unless it's in warp. I want it.


Err... EoM aren't Gallente and they certainly don't fly like it. They're one of the very many schizophrenic sociopathic Amarrian-based weirdo-cults. They fly black-and-blue Amarr hulls with railguns, long-range missiles and active shield tanking. To be fair, they're more of an Amarr/Caldari cross but that's already taken so we work with what's left.

Actually, as someone suggested earlier, EOM could be a mix of Caldari/Minmatar with perhaps +optimal and +web range bonuses. Yes, the hulls are Amarr, and that's a bit off, lol, but the bonuses I think would be solid. I'm not sure how they'd affect the other web range bonused ships, since I think some of their balance comes as a result of ACs hitting in falloff or the low(er) dps of Arty.

It still begs the question if there's some unique racial flair that we're not factoring in (like the web strength bonus that Serpentis gets).

It is true that EOM would need space of sorts, so that we could run missions or LP from them. Certainly, though, some drone space could be converted over.

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Xander Det89
T.R.I.A.D
Ushra'Khan
#20 - 2013-06-12 18:02:09 UTC
Mole Guy wrote:
gallente/amarr -

hybrid geddon.

special bonus-100% drone control range
gallente- 10% tracking and range per lev
amarr- 10% hp and damage per lev

uses hybrids
7 high, 5 mids, 8 lows, 4 turrets
125Mbit bandwidth
400 m3 drone bay

reason- they both are drone masters. gallente domi bonus for tracking and range, domi/amarr for damage. the drone range thing would be specific to the new faction.


i think it would be a fun ship for those who like armor and drones. i had to train up caldari and shields to use the rattlesnake...im an armor/drone guy.


Ofc with that setup, unbonused guns means it'll get used either with just utility highs or projectiles.
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